It's gods gift from heaven. How hard was it to actually make _one_ book instead of 8000 guides?!

From what I've read about X... it seems to suck harder than a black hole in outer space. I even made a topic here at LQ (link) asking for a X replacement but so far nobody replied

I've read and quit reading in over six times now. Every time I try to make a LFS system I get stuck. That doesn't mean it was a waste reading it because I did learn from it . I'll definitely try it again but not now. It gives me headaches. You see... the problem with me is that I am always too enthusiastic for my own good and I want to remember and understand every single thing that I do. I'll always end up at 20% of what I was planning to do. But I never give up... I'll just get back to it later. I always want to do thousands of things at once.

Good luck with that! It is hard, and I am not your mom, but as always: School comes first. I always put school first but end up playing with my computer and so I ended up repeating two grades. This is my last year, and my last chance, and hopefully I will graduate from high school this year. Even if that involves giving my flatscreen to my mom until I have graduated.

Boy, I remember those days! High school was when I learned a lot of what I know about computers, thanks to one of my friends who taught me. By the time I graduated I could build a system in under an hour while head-banging to Slayer(and I still can). Now, in college, I've taken classes for repairing and networking and work in the library's computer lab, where I surf the net and download all my Linux cd's. I feel so at home...

V!INCENT, I looked at your question and it seems the only competitors were never adopted on a large enough scale to compete with X. The only thing available right now might be a project called Berlin.
http://w3.linux-magazine.com/issue/04/Berlin.pdf

There is SO much truth to this!

I had a job working as an IT tech for a medical company some time ago, and the only thing separating me from the IT director (small company...it was just the two of us) was that he had a college degree and I did not (in terms of knowledge we were roughly equivalent). When times were good, he got a considerably larger bonus than me, and when times were bad...well, he's still working there and I'm not.

Point is, when it comes to sitting in front of a terminal and maintaining a Linux/BSD/Windows/Solaris/etc... box, the task at hand doesn't care if you learned in a formal manner or if you read a book in your free time. When it comes to business, however, a piece of paper from an accredited university goes a LONG ways...

I can't believe I'm going to graduate, honestly...I'm lucky to be working for an employer who believes that school comes first, and I'm lucky to be married to a woman who has supported my efforts in finishing a degree that I started over 12 years ago...haha.

Well... berlin is dead. Last updated 2004.

Rats! I was going to spend some time this evening looking at berlin and maybe trying it. Yesterday I only had enough time for the Google search to find it. That and opening the pdf kept crashing the computer I used. Stoopid state-owned hand-me-down office computers... OIS disabled booting from a cd so I can't even boot Knoppix if I wanted to.

I was just commenting to a co-worker earlier this week about the same thing, regarding any field of work. I think about it a lot and often come to the conclusions that a)managers make decisions based on things they can see and touch (you can't "see" someone's IQ or level of knowledge) and b) it's a pity we live in a world where a piece of paper is worth more than the knowledge required to obtain the piece of paper.

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaa!!! Well, lookee here!! Ain't no pesky Winders!!
Got rid of XP on Wednesday, then my old CRT monitor died. Up and running now with new 19" TFT.

Hello.
About two years ago, I switched from Windows to Fedora, then SuSE, and finally Ubuntu.
All of them were better then Windows. Here are some of the things I noted right away which took me away from Windows.

Virtual Desktops- My all time favorite feature of Linux is Virtual Desktops. We had it way before OS X, and Windows still doesn't have them. They really help you concentrate(move an important window to the next desktop, and leave all the others behind) and organize.

Stability- Some people think the average user might not be able to tell the different here, and are wrong. With my first few days of using Ubuntu, I was amazed at how you could put a CD or Flash drive into your machine, and your nautilus window wouldn't freeze up like Windows Explorer. Plus, you can copy HUGE(5+ GB) files, with hardly any performance loss! I can surf the web, keep a OO document in the background, listen to music on Rhythymbox, transfer large files, and IM all at the same time, which is a hard to do on windows(especially with the copying files). I feel as if Windows isn't a true multitasking OS.

Apt-get- apt-get is a feature Windows and OS X will probably never be able to match, as they don't have such a dedicated free program base as Linux. I could install hundreds of programs right there, no need to go to firefox.

Customization- Some people think the average user also won't be able to truely customize their Linux, and it takes a guru. This is once again, not true. Following a simple tutorial on Ubuntu Forums, I was able to get Compiz Fusion on XGL, which is customizable as it gets. Then, I added in Awn, which also comes with different options. However, the best part was the themes I downloaded from gnome-look.org, and even hacked one with my own graphics. You just can't match this customization in Windows without some crappy software like Windows Blinds.

Drivers- Everyone seems to think Drivers for Linux are awful. I think its the opposite. In Windows, I had to install drivers for the freaking keyboard and wireless mouse! which worked easily with every Linux distro(10+) I've tried! My networked printer in Windows, which I eventually gave up on, took a 5 minute tutorial on the web, and almost all printer drivers are included with Ubuntu! Then, instead of installing all that crappy software my creative zen needs on Windows, I simply typed in 'Creative Zen' in Apt-get, and installed gnomad. While my wireless card took some time with ndiswrapper, it wasn't too bad an upgrade from that awful linksys software that you need for it on Windows.

Compiz Fusion- While many people think compiz fusion is silly and non-productive, I think they are wrong. Wobbly Windows I can no longer live without. It just seems to add a whole new dimensions to multi-tasking and what windows are.

And then there's gparted, which there is no equivalent for on Windows, a great camera program(F Spot), security, quicker boot time, better network tooks, and more. Not only this, but with Vista out(never tried it) Windows seems to be getting worse in terms of BSOD. I think that not only is Linux ready for the Desktop, but its better then Windows on the desktop. Ease of use isn't really a problem in Ubuntu, unless you have special hardware(wireless cards, sound cards, etc.)

thanks,
LN75

You realise what NdisWrapper is (does), don't you?

Alas, for those pieces of hardware which are both supported (natively) by Windows and Linux, perhaps Linux is the winner, but what happens with those pieces which are not supported by Linux - either natively .. or at all? Just because your hardware worked, doesn't mean so does everybody else's.

I think they are silly and non-productive; so allow me to think You are wrong.

Are you saying there are no partition managers for Windows? Or perhaps none of them are as 'cool' as gparted? Well then name one Linux application that matched Adobe Photoshop (the "standard" example in Win vs Linux battles :P but I'm too lazy to look for other).

Then surely you have a dozen friends ready to vow that is true.

--

Please note that some people are happy with windows and rightfully so. And it's not just computer illiterate people either, although many Linux users would like to believe that.

I am not sure why you didn't want to collaborate with so many already existing threads (we even have a sticky), but here it goes. I just wanted to say that you are wrong about Virtual Desktop. Microsoft has released Power Toys for Windows XP quite a long time ago and it gives the same functionality, although limited to 4 desktops.

Some graphics card manufactures also gives you similar functionality when using their proprietary drivers.

I don't want to offend you, but your "review" was pretty bad (can't find anything constructive to say). A lot of it is personal opinion without much to back it up. Parts of it makes you sound very misinformed, like the Virtual Desktops. And in some parts, you haven't even tested yourself (like Vista) but is just repeating what you've heard from someone/somewhere.

And reverse read my thoughts. Listen to his reply

Those arguments don't seem very valid to me either. My preferred environment is *nix (preferably Solaris, but Linux is OK too). However, I really can't bash Windows too much, it does what it's supposed to. Current versions seem very stable (I'd have to say more so than Mac OS, perhaps a little less than Linux, but only after a couple weeks of uptime (which I never have on any machine anymore with the rate kernel patches keep coming out)).

Obviously there's different support for features in each OS. I personally gave up on using virtual desktops, it just made things even more likely to get lost for me. Customization is how systems end up broken. Took me a long time to learn that. Doesn't matter what OS, the more you tweak it, the more likely things are to break (especially when you upgrade next)...

File this under: "Proselytizing the previously converted".

Seriously, these are all good points--especially things like the package manager / repository system. For me, a good front end like Synaptic is the real key.
Drivers are 1000% easier in Linux---MOST of the time (more on this in a minute).

Stability? Yes--MOST of the time.

Following the LQ code of fairness and objectivity (you've read that---right?), I note a few ways in which Linux is not quite there:
e
1. Printing: This continues to be a pet peeve. Most of the time, things go well--especially with HP printers, and usually with Epson. At the moment I have just installed PCLinuxOS (latest) on several systems, and--in certain utilities, the test page does not work. Further this distro (and many others) have multiple print management utilities installed. I keep several of the top distros installed, and each one has it's own tools for printing with various glitches--e.g. with respect to the test page. What's worse is that--even thought they are all current--they have different options for drivers for my Epson 900---some of which give very different results.
The bottom line is that the installation of individual drivers on Windows was peanuts compared to the time I have spent chasing printer funnies on Linux.

2. Speed: When all set up, some things are clearly faster in Linux. But many operations are painfully slow--eg the opening of Open Office vs MS Office. I'm told that IE is faster than Firefox, but this never gets past my "annoyance threshold".

3. Wireless on laptops: Even PCLOS, which works "out of the box" has an annoying quirk: It will not actually connect until I open the Wireless management window. (I don't DO anything in the window--just open it).

4. The few things that don't work--eg getting SW updates for my Garmin GPS.

5. The sprinkling of web sites that don't support Firefox. Current issue: Bank of America with a coding error that I cannot get them to acknowledge. Ironically, it is something where FF does not follow the standards---but if they would fix the code, no browser would have an issue.

One of my pet peeves--which cuts across many more specific issues--is the sometimes puritanical attitude towards non--OSS software. The market forces are simply not yet adequate for every vendor, website maintainer, etc. to put out the effort to fully support Linux. This is of course evolving rapidly. When someone puts together a Linux distro which runs wireless out of the box, and has the best available support for printing, why should I care if it contains a few proprietary applications? The end user wants value for the dollar, but--in the end--they simply want things to work.
In this regard, one real absurdity is the absence of Firefox in Debian (because the name is copyrighted, IIRC). So they put a new name on it--IceWeasel--which of course means that at least one website rejects it. Dumb...

Yes--for those of use who don't mind tweaking thing--Linux is mostly there. The only time I turned on Windows in the last 3-4 months was to update my Garmin---and I did (gag, choke) install MSWindows on Crossover because OpenOffice is still not 100% compatible, and I have a proposal deadline in 1 week. But Linux is still not for everyone---and probably won't be for quite some time.

I'm about to click "Post Quick Reply"---sorry that LQ doesn't have one for "Long-Winded Ramble".....

so ... after narrowing it down , we sort of left with installations and usages of printers and wireless networking stuffs ... and i would like to add in one more which is 3d(i mean mostly the newer type) graphic cards ...

but i believe these hardwares they have some (or even at least one) big names behind them that can actually be installed and work the same as they are in windows systems ... so , maybe its not that hard to follow ...

probably linux should works(or "goes along") with these types of hardwares when coming to installation methods and "front ends" ... maybe lots of things have to sorted out along the paths which lead to a more standard way of installing and using these hardwares for every users ... whether with rpm , dep , pkg or whatever ...

and we have deliberately left out sound systems ...

as for the rest , i think they are application softwares ... depend on how far we are able to push ourselves(and those that we are working with) when using them ... but if more and more(i mean really a lot) people really are using linux then shouldnt be a problem in the end ...

so ... LinuxNoob75 is correct with his passage ...


//btw ... why did you switch from fedora to ubuntu ... ?? i find this strange as fedora was suppose to be your first try with linux ... not like you switched from older or smaller "just for fun"(live cd for example) linux distros where you can have more "freedom" to choose a linux and stick with it no-matter what happen ...



.

Besides the limited disk manager that comes with Windows XP, there are almost no free partition editors for Windows. Partition Magic, however, you can pay for. So no, there aren't any free real partition managers for Windows.

Ndiswrapper allows you to use your Windows drivers on Linux. So, unless your particular driver isn't fully supported by ndiswrapper, then it will be able to run as well as in Windows. To the outsider, it works almost the same way as a native driver. It is really just a matter of time before someone develops a better frontend to work with the ndiswrapper drivers. See Blake Martin's ndiswrapper software on the Ubuntu Forums.

Yes, but it doesn't ship with Windows, and therefore isn't availible to the average user, unlike Linux.(and most window users didn't even know there were virtual desktops before Leopard, and now a few more do)

Adobe Photoshop works fine under WINE. Its 5 installation steps:
1. open apt-get
2. search for WINE, find it, install
3. Set WINE to Windows XP
4. Put in your photoshop CD
5. Go to the CD, and click autorun.exe or setup.exe

If you count Microsoft as 6 friends, then I have my brother, Digg, 2 close friends, and UPenn.
-Microsoft: http://apcmag.com/vista_activation(deactivation, not BSOD)
-Digg: http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/toronto/b...ime-320824.php
And my friends and brother all report that Vista is buggy, and they often get the BSOD. I guess there's no way to vouch on that, though.
-UPenn- A friend of mine recently ordered a laptop from UPenn, where he works. It was supposed to come with Vista, but it was reformated with XP, because 'Vista has too many bugs'.

I started with Fedora, because it was the first distro I knew of, as my friend had it. I hated fedora(Probably because I wasn't use to the default bland look of GNOME), and switched to KDE SuSE. Can't remember why I went to Ubuntu then.

Of course, I wasn't trying to prove Linux was better for everyone, but it was better then Windows on many points.(See title-'Windows vs Linux- Points people seem to overlook', not 'Windows vs Linux, USE Linux!')

My couple second version of this:
I don't need them. Taskbar, Tabs, and my mouse do the job.
Windows is plenty stable. Just stick with the right drivers, no BS software, keep you comp running cool... no prob
I like to do install crap "manually" (IE, going to Firefox's site to install it... it takes a second to do)
Regedit will suffice. I don't know about you, but I just change a couple of options in windows and do a couple registry changes... I'm as configured as I'd like to be.
Drivers... for linux? Not in a million years. Buy a nVidia graphics card, stick it in you computer, go to nvidia's site, install the drivers, restart, done. Linux? Download some cheezy peice of open source software and fiddle around with it in the console and crap... heh waste.
Heh, eye candy... and you all complain about it when MS tries it in Vista. The 3D cube desktop thing drives me nut. The only cool thing is the wavy windows and stuff... and that alone is pretty useless.
-----------------------------
I don't know WHAT you're trying to get me to do...

Now your gonna say that Linux is not the thing for me and to STFU, but you go tell a noob to go apt-get something... heh whatever. The noob wouldn't even be able to get the drivers working to use compiz.

I'm sorry, Linux is pretty cool for free, but If you wanna get down and dirty to do some real work done on your comp, I'm not even gonna think about linux.

Until linux gets some drivers, works faster then windows, has some support for apps, etc - I'm not gonna bother.

Sure, I could install ubuntu to do some word processing or MP3/internet... thats it. No real games, no printing, no wifi... every distro needs it's own little site for FAQs and support... I'm sorry but that is not how it should be.

I'm sorry, I'll stick with my XP.

P.S. Probably gonna get flamed beyond belief and be told I'm ignorant and crap but hey, I got a life, if your OS is so good, why do you have to monkey around in prompts? That 80/140$ I spend on windows it for something that is guarunteed to work and requires very little effort from me. unsubscribing from threads FTW.

Here we have 2 posters showing exactly why Linux is still going strong. Poster A who doesn't like to tweak at all and Poster B who likes to customise 'til he can customise no more. Both posters have their needs perfectly served by Linux.

And colinstu - Nvidia has produced proprietary drivers for Linux for a few years now, go to site, download driver, install driver. And I would hardly call downloading an exe file "installing manually".

And since you have such disdain for Linux and the way it works, why on earth do you post on LQ?