The purpose of this thread?

The OP continuously ignores the information that most of us are not geeks, but normal people who choose not to use Microsoft. And keeps calling us software engineers!

Continuously compares Linux to Windows, which he or she claims has "few holes or glitches." (Those of us who have tried to use Windows for anything more than surfing the internet and looking at photographs know what a load of nonsense that is.)

Cites splash screens as an example of how bad/wrong/unintuitive Linux is.

Et cetera.


Perhaps it is time to stop feeding the troll.

MISTER LINUX; You Know, the Man with a touch of Brilliance or a Genius; does not like how fractured and running in circles, His "Idea" is doing. I do Not wonder why.
I think; and he probably thinks the same way that I do. [or, I think like him] About the Future of Linux.
There is a movie on Youtube, called: Why Linux Sucks, LFNW 2012; THAT supports my thinking.
Linux Software Engineers/Geeks/amateurs with Code, you will find that movie "Informative."

Have a Nice Day! Later, Gerald

Hello; or Niehow, as it is pronounced, in China.
For your information; there was not much of what you had to say that had much knowledge about the present subject.
If you are just "Trolling", do so elsewhere please.
Thank You, Gerald

I strongly disagree. What you want is not the one perfect Linux distro. When I read your posts I can only come to one conclusion: What you want is a Linux that is exactly like Windows, just because you had a hard time learning it and don't want to do that again for Linux. It also seems that you didn't read the "Linux is NOT Windows" article I gave you the link for (or you maybe simply didn't understand it). So you ask others to read the whole thread, but aren't reading the information that is given to you?

I will ask you something: If Windows is so much better than Linux, why are you using Linux? Why not just stick with Windows if it fits your needs better? And why are you so concerned about Linux' marketshare?

Your printer probably needs some driver and / or configuration.

The reviews that we (geeks) write are mostly Linux supremacist propaganda. Since we are interested enough to write reviews about it, we delve deeper and deeper into Linux, until we think everything is easy and go around recommending Slackware to people who can barely use Windows.

Have you tried the easy distributions?

You're not using Ubuntu at least. That's good. I'm also looking for a simple to use and stable distribution for my mother-in-law, who currently uses Debian 6, but finds the support for Adobe Flash a little lacking. I've had to install Linux for them twice, both times because Windows crashed and could no longer start.

It's a funny story. The second time, they got a new computer with Windows on it, and were overjoyed that YouTube worked perfectly (which it didn't with Debian). A few months later she tells me: "The computer has crashed. Install Linux for me again!"

They use Debian with KDE. Debian is maybe not easy to set up but they have no computer knowledge whatsoever (cannot distinguish a web browser from the rest of the operating system, for example) and find it very easy to use... but that's after I've set everything up for them. I don't think they could install everything by themselves and make it work like they want it to. I guess that's what the problem is in your case too. It's easy once everything works but getting it to work is the tricky part.

Unfortunately I can't recommend any other easy choices. Linux Mint is based on either Ubuntu or Debian, so it's probably very similar to them. Ubuntu would be great (for non-geeks) if it wasn't so horribly unreliable, and Debian (stable) has too outdated software for newbie desktop users who require the latest Firefox, Flash et c.. Have you tried Mageia, CentOS? Salix is sometimes recommended as the simple / convenient version of Slackware. I haven't tried those, but I'm just saying: maybe try something else than Mint.

Though I am absolutely certain that you can get your printer working in Mint too.

You mention Fedora. It's Red Hat's testing distribution, that they base RHEL on. They give it to us for free so that we can beta test their real product for them. Why would you use that? Then you may as well sign up as a beta tester for Microsoft.

By the way, what's wrong with making a Linux distribution that behaves exactly like Windows? There's a Chinese distribution that does that: it's called Red Flag Linux and looks like Windows XP. I think it's a great idea: Linux appears scary because it's not what people are used to, so it makes it easier for them to migrate. Obviously I wouldn't want to see it in Debian, but there should be *some* distribution that attempts to make it easy for Windows users.

1 members found this post helpful.

Hello Soderlund, Thanks for being polite! lol

There is only one main reason that I like an OS to be like Windows; because that is what was on my original computer. Windows was Not "Intuitive" At ALL! I Would be Very Enthusiastic about Any OS that would be Easier than Windows was/is. Linux developers seem to be following in the same Hard-to-learn-non-intuitive path that Microsoft surveyed and followed.

In This "Day and Age" [Almost 2013] with almost Everything that we get; we want it to be as "Automated" as possible.

In My ignorance of how programming/Operating Systems/CODE actually works; I think that there must be an easier/more intuitive way to design an OS, that would please Me More, and Microsoft less.

There are only two Linux Distros that I have marked twice for review: Zorin OS6, and Pinguy OS....every "Review" seems to be either by the developer, or a Geek; so, of very small use to me. [for Newbie]

I reloaded this Mint 10; as I felt that my original had been "bloated" from downloading Everything that I thought might "Help" the OS Understand that it had a printer connected to it. LOL

My old middle computer [as I think of it, not the newest-not the oldest] still has a working Windows XP on it, so I may just use it for my printer, if Mint doesn't wake up this time around.
Later, Gerald

Tobi has already mentioned the Linux is not Windows article. In fact, he has done it a couple of times. Have you read it?

Please speak for yourself. (Read the article mentioned above)

Operating systems are not here to PLEASE you, they are here to perform certain tasks. Read the article....

Why do geeks review operating systems? I wouldn't want to read a review of a car written by a gardener who doesn't know much about cars. Would you? It would probably be something like:

That is why.

Edit: No offence to gardeners Just an example. It could've been any other profession.

Hey XMarine. It is impolite to call other people "geeks" when you're not including yourself as one.

And there's a very obvious thing you can do about what you perceive as the lack of "Linux reviews for non geeks." Start writing them yourself.

Haha! That's pretty similar to many Linux reviews, like this one: TuxRadar's best Linux Distro 2011

I think the Linux != Windows article is a little harsh on people who come from a Windows background. On one hand, we have a lot of people who preach "come to Linux, o people!", and on the other, there are some who say: "well if you don't understand it, you can just go back to Windows!"

I don't know what to think about that (other than hope that the same people don't say both), but the aforementioned article clearly belongs to the latter category.

And as for sycamorex; You Are Correct, as far as it goes, which is Not Far Enough!

I have just spent the last hour + trying to get my printer to work with Mint 10=no luck, so, I'll use my XP computer for email/printing.

Until an Operating System can PLEASE ME; since I am just One of Millions of ignorant people [Ignorant about OS's]that do and will use a computer for just: surfing the net/email/using a printer, or watching a movie.....;the popularity of Apple tells the tale. [Of "Numbers".]Using the basic UNIX System] [To my Understanding.]

Apple had a LEADER....which seems to be missing with Linux. No; I do Not own any Apple products, too overpriced for me.

Maybe you are right; dugan, sooo, My Apology to ALL of You People that are; or don't know that you are Software Engineers, for a non-geek to say "Geek."LOL

I wonder: if I could post "My Opinion of Various Distros" here?? Hmmmmm A review of distro's of Linux By a Newbie. Maybe.
Later, Gerald

All of the Linux distros are easy enough to operate, once you get the hang of them. Being proficient is a different matter, naturally. But that's true for all operating systems. I don't think any of them are as "turnkey" easy to operate from a "user" perspective as Windows or Mac systems. The Linux distros that try to be that kind of easy unfortunately end up obscuring the forest with all of their trees. I've tried them, and that was my experience, anyway. They mostly end up hiding and (effectively) negating the richness and power of Linux to all but those who are at least semi-geek enough to poke around beneath the covers. Instead of being ideal, they end up being a differently-decorated confining cell, with different-looking bars on the "windows". You're not running Windows, but you're still locked into a box that someone else built for you.

You don't have to be a geek to unleash as much power from Linux as you can manage. But you do have to care enough about your personal computing environment and its potential to want more than just what someone else chooses to give you. Most people don't care all that much, and they are perfectly happy to be limited to what M$ and O$X offer, and to pay richly for it too. Linux isn't for them. Don't sweat it.

Hi,
First, I suggest that you read LQ Rules. You have violated at least 2 LQ Rules within content of this thread;Nothing wrong with intelligent response on targeted thread content. But to incite by slang or disrespect to fellow LQ members will not be tolerated from anyone. Your are the OP of this thread yet that does not mean you can ignore LQ Rules & basic netiquette. You agreed to abide by the LQR when signing up to LQ. So please follow the rules.

May I suggest that you read the following after reading LQ Rules;
As to your last question, no you cannot post a review or opinion for "My Opinion of Various Distros" within <Linux-General>. But you can post a intelligent objective and constructive review within <Linux - Distributions> if you follow the LQ Rules.

Please feel free to contact me or the LQ admin if you have any questions.

If the review is sufficiently intellegent, objective and constructive, then it might be worthy for LQ Articles. But I'd question whether a review of that quality is still "non geek".

A very informal here-are-my-immediate-thoughts review would fit best in his LQ blog.

1 members found this post helpful.

Thanks for the reply, dugan.

Observations from a newbie living in the "real world":

Anyone that thinks Linux is anywhere near, even remotely as usable, easy to set up, functional "out of the box", and as easy to use as either Mac OS or Windows is extremely self-deluded, and they really need to realize and wake up to the fact that the vast majority of people want nothing to do with manually configuring anything, and they expect things to simply "work out of the box" with little to no effort required on their part, and this is what Mac OS and Windows provides to a great degree, but not Linux.

Beyond that there are no "real" Linux alternatives to many software programs for those other OSs, and people have already invested a considerable amount of time and money with what they are already using there to begin with.

Also there is a lot of snobbery, exclusivity, and a superiority complex among Linux users. They are far too often impatient and rude to newbies looking for help. People seem to think that's OK, because it's just the "geek" culture and mentality, well I say BS on that, and look where it's getting the community and Linux in general; nowhere!

Out here in the "real world" I know not one person that uses Linux or has any desire to. I myself have only "dabbled" in it off and on over the years, but have never been able to stick with it for many of the reasons I'm mentioning here, and I could never use it for business purposes and still can't by no fault of my own but doe to the inherit deficiencies in Linux. I am however attempting to give it another shot here right now for some general desktop use, but there’s no way I could use and depend on it exclusively, and that’s surely not going to change anytime soon if ever. I keep coming back and checking up on the progress and state of Linux every few years, and every time it’s about where it was the last time I checked, and here we go again, and that’s really a damn shame.

Linux is designed by geeks for geeks, always has been and still is, although Distros like Mint and such are really trying to make strides in changing this, not many are really doing a very good or even close to an acceptable job of it.

So since Linux is still really a "geeks only" OS, you won't see any non-geeks using it, and as a result you won't find a lot of non-geek reviews of it. Anybody that claims they aren’t a geek and uses Linux is either self-deluded or a bold faced liar. Average people (non-geeks) do not and will not use Linux in its current state, period; that's just the way it is.

Linux is a dead-end OS for the desktop because of all this and more, and until all of this changes drastically, it never will be anything but dead to the masses. People simply don’t have the need, desire, or at the very least the time to invest in not only dealing with learning a very different OS, but one that is such a PITA to learn and maintain for the average person. Again, Linux has always been and still is a geeks only OS.

There is simply no good, reasonable, or compelling reason for the average person to switch from Mac OS or Windows to Linux, and they aren't and won't until things change drastically and significantly from what they still are today, and again, until then, Linux is as good as dead as a common desktop OS, that's just reality, that's just the facts, and none of this should be news to anyone in the community that’s been paying any attention over the years.

You say you love Linux and wish more people would use it, then pay attention to what average people; the non-geeks are trying to and have been telling you for years about why they can't and don't use Linux, and then do something about it instead of living in denial and blaming them for it all, which is only serving to perpetuate the problem.


Here's even more reasons why “Linux Sucks”, and even for advanced users:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh-cnaJoGCw