The machine is mine. Thanks for asking that.

Linux is best.

Ok-my mistaken concept.
Yes-Backup can recover a securely deleted file while trash can restores them.

Ok but how? Using an option from Trash can? Or using some programs (Includes CLI although it may be better with GUI, at least for beginners that uses only days in Linux.)?


Yes-especially after there is a need to upgrade my PC.


Why? Unwilling to waste disk space over "unnecessary features?" or does not like to waste time to delete a file?

Wait- I mean to secure delete files. There are cleaners that clears browsing history and cookies securely.I think it is good because after log out of Ebay,PayPal or any other banks in your country that is available for Online Banking, your credit card information or bank account information is always store in your temp files regardless of distro and if it is Linux or Mac OS 8/9/X or Windows 95 to Vista. (I heard some Online Banking needs Java and that does not seem to exist on Windows 3.1 or earlier.)

Ok-I wont force you then. Anyway my intention is to make it more targets to compare since both Solaris and Linux are Unix+Open Source.


No-I did not own them currently. Just for the sake of General Knowledge only.


Ok-I have seen an article http://www.techthrob.com/tech/securedelete.php and it said that Ext3 is simply unrecoverable. However, how many pass is this? It was to be said that it is possible to recover a file with erased 14 passes. (Also on this article stated above.)


I have no comment on this.

I know of a way you cant recover a file from deletion, but it takes out your entire hard drive with it
After this is done, all hopes of getting any data back is gone, this little piece of script writes random junk to the whole drive then zero writes it, it does this with 20 passes. so it really writes to the whole disk 40 times, after this is complete (it will take days) nothing will be recoverable, I don't care how good you are at disk recovery

Obviously that was a joke...sorry if it came across like I was being serious.

Actually, writing it on paper is just as bad as storing it electronically. If it's important enough that I would want to write it down, I memorize it. Sure, sometimes it takes a minute to recall the item that I'm dealing with, but it's not THAT difficult to retain a few hundred chunks of information mentally. It drives my wife nuts sometimes when she asks me for some information, and I remember it easily but won't transmit it over the internet (which is just as bad or worse than storing it on your computer) or phone. Really, I guess I'm just paranoid (being a victim of ID theft will do that to a person).

This is along the lines of my belief that human beings are capable of vastly more than computers are (hence my belief that instead of running some crap desktop that abstracts everything for me, I learn how the code works and use the CLI). Again, perhaps I'm just weird, but I believe that once we start relying on computers to handle personal info security, then we've screwed up. If I can retain sensitive information mentally, then I certainly won't be writing it down or storing it on my computer.

Edit - ok, in all honesty I do not memorize anything that I could potentially generate with an algorithm (say, passwords). I just memorize the algorithm and use that to "figure out" what password I need (say, to encrypt files that I don't want other people seeing). Yes, if someone ever figured out the algorithm, I'd be screwed...and that's why I don't ever tell anyone the algorithm...haha. It works pretty well, actually, as I haven't had to reset a password due to "algorithm failure" in quite a while.

Is the source code available for that recycle bin feature? Then I guess it could be altered to provide a "secure delete" that would make people comfortable...

How do you think "guru's" started off? As gurus?

Everyone has to deal with learning curve, regardless of OS or program (some learning curves aren't very steep, but they're still there). Just because the learning curve is steep for *nix CLI, does that mean everyone should stop learning it?

Now you've finished with that encryted file what do you do next?

1. Hit the delete key and take comfort in the knowledge that even if the file is recovered it's encrypted anyway.

or

2. Secure delete it to make recovery of said file nigh impossible!!

So true. The power to control (and have total access to / ownership of) your system is something Winblows users struggle to comprehend.

The only limit when using CLI is your level of knowledge.

@ussr_1991 GnuPG does provide a shredder on the desktop to securely delete files (I think it's only a 35 pass wipe).

And the limits of the environment, which depends on how it was programmed. But typically it stretches far beyond the graphical interface's capabilities, and mostly users' nerves.

If you really wanted to securely delete data, you wouldn't shred it, but instead use strong magnetic fields to mess up the magnetic media (or equivalent for other type media), then smash it into pieces and melt down in a couple thousand Kelvins temperature. And maybe eat in your porridge, to make sure nobody wants to touch the thing after that..

It would be nice to see how people reacted if some new version of Windows presented the users with a whole new command line environment, along with all the apps (well, their equivalents) Unix/Linux users are familiar with already. Like expanding DOS to the next dimension.

Oh yeah, there is that as well.

That's when they'll start shipping winblows with a 'Panic Now' button.

I don't remember Java being available for Windows 1.0 or 2.0. In 3.11, however, I remember using early versions of Netscape Navigator and Java. Back then Java mostly allowed minor audio and animation effects because internet connections were still primarily dial-up with 33.6Kbps. T1 was still new and Cable and DSL hadn't started yet.

If you use Firefox then everything is saved in it's Cache folder. You can use the portable version of Firefox that already has Cache disabled or edit the appropriate entry in about:config to disable it. Then tell it to always clear private data, which will include cookies and history, when it closes. I always set mine up to not remember what I type in fields or passwords. And in Linux I have my Firefox cache directory completely deleted during shutdown.

If your worried about sending financial information and credit card numbers over the internet, the best security is to just not do it. But if you must, and you feel you want to thoroughly erase the evidence, use the dd command I previously posted, with as many passes as you like, after deleting those temp files. The command, modified for single line, is:
You can apply this to any partition by putting the appropriate /dev/hd** in front of fileconsumingallfreespace

That reminds me of the office worker who writes his/her logon password on a sticky note and leaves it on the monitor, and then acts surprised that someone else was able to login to their computer. We, the human race, need to keep our brains active before we forget how to use them.
I share your belief. It'd be interesting to take a poll asking what people did for productivity or recreation before computers. I love computers and I think it's fun to tweak and troubleshoot them, but I would never trust them with my personal identity information. I'll admit that I keep some passwords in my pda. But when I started that I made sure the app I store them in uses encryption and requires a master password to open it. I've actually written a poem about mankind's dependency on technology becoming our own downfall. I also wrote an amusing one about Bill Gates.
That'd be great! Long live DOS !!!

pop quiz hot shot: what do you do?, what do you do ?

What I don't like about some software:
The support life span is about 18 months to 2 years. By support I mean, updates to system libraries that are needed to run your programs. If you are running a system version that is "end of life" and you want to update your system libraries, you're out of luck (No updates/upgrades for you!) unless you upgrade your entire system -- something that end users are very wary of and can introduce new problems and/or bugs where there weren't any before. Without these brand new library versions, you cannot get updates to some of your software that you love, like for instance, Gimp, Inkscape, and Blender. To upgrade some of these libraries, you would need to be an expert, which the average computer user isn't. I only want to update 3 or 4 apps, that's all. Also, I cannot try any new apps out like, Audacious, for example.

My husband bought SuSE 10.0 for me after I was mentioning about trying out Linux and he saw it for about $70 at Comp USA. I thought I would be able to stick with this version for many years, not just 2. That was about 2 1/2 years ago. I have spent this past 2 1/2 years learning about Linux and getting everything set up the way I want it. I wouldn't want the past 2 years to go to waste because of upgrade introduced problems.

I just get so annoyed with the answer, "You should upgrade your operating system" each time I have a problem with an application and ask about it in some forums. Don't tell me that. Just tell me how to fix my problem.

Endusers want the ability to *upgrade* whatever *software* they like *whenever* they want, whether it is 1 year from the day they installed their OS or even 10 years later, they don't want to hit this library dependency roadblock (dll hell - the Linux version).

If ALL the dependent libraries were so simple to install with just: ./configure, make, make install, at a terminal (Konsole - without going into run level 3), I would do that in a heartbeat and that would be the end of that. But I read about installing glibc (for example) and the instructions mentioned going into run level 3 and there might be a kernel panic after installation, that totally turned me off to trying to update it.

If this problem were fixed, if endusers can count on keeping the system version they have *and* be able to update all their favorite programs/apps as they like, then I think Linux will go a long way on the desktop. I still like Linux and would like to see the way software is handled (as mentioned above) improve. Meanwhile, my 2 1/2 year old system is working nicely and I'm still enjoying all the "old" app versions I have. I use my Linux computer more than my Windows computer.

And how is this any different from what happens with versions on other platforms, they all come to an end at some point.

That is what the package manager is for, it should help to alleviate any dependency issues automatically for the average computer user who isn't an expert.

Yes you can, just update the required libs. Try out office xp on winblows 98 without a Major upgrade.

Why would the past 2 years go to waste? You sound competent enough to know what's changed and you certainly know where to go for help

I agree with you here, sometimes an upgrade of the app is all it takes.

Erm..Good luck with this one!

What's wrong with runlevel 3?

And there might not have been a kernel panic.

I refer you to the response I gave to 'Endusers want the ability to *upgrade* whatever...'

Precisely, you don't have to upgrade at all if your system does all the tasks you want it to do.

** Warning **

In the final analysis, you will however be assimilated

You should use CentOS, I believe it supports a version for 5 years or something like that, and Ubuntu LTS is support for 3 years on desktop and 5 years on server

Copy the whole thing,even for (( i = 0;i<20;i++ )); do?

Anyway-Good solution. I expect to spent days for it if I need to change PC. (Upgrade)

Ok-then take it as a joke then. I am not fussing about it.



Ok-good memory work = unlikely to suffer from "old people idiotic disease" (Sorry, I cant remember the exact term for "老人痴呆症". Those chinese can help me to translate it. Thank you.)




Well, I think these desktops are open-source software. So I think it is possible to get it. (But I am wondering how to use these source code.)



You are right there, babies born in France does not speak French at all at the point when they were born. So, the Gurus started from a beginner. But to be a guru, it is different from being an administrator. A guru can be (Surely) an admin but an admin might not be necessary to be a guru. I believe that a guru needs more than just study and uses a OS for years but the passion to know its fundamental. I dont think all people would have such passion because sometimes they dont work and possible to even break the system regardless of Unix or Windows.

?Not necessary. CLI even in windows or MS-DOS is still look scary for babies too (In a lost universe,where there is nothing except black and white. One wrong step and you will regret for life because you have went through the most scariest thing- Black Hole). I think you need to spent extra time to get things work in CLI than GUI regardless of *NIX or non *NIX OS.