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Old 12-29-2009, 10:49 AM   #856
hitest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianL View Post
If there are offshoots like Salix and Zenwalk that offer one piece of software per task, why not leave the original Slackware alone? Why make it a clone of an offshoot? Daft idea.
Agreed. Let us leave Slackware alone. Like it or not Slackware is designed for gear-heads, people who like to tinker, users not afraid to learn about their OS. The off-shoots like Salix and Zenwalk fill the need for people who want something more than Ubuntu.
I don't think my classification of Slackware is elitist, I think it is accurate.
The development cycle of Slackware works for me; Slackware-current has rock-like stability.

Last edited by hitest; 12-29-2009 at 10:51 AM.
 
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Old 12-29-2009, 01:25 PM   #857
Lufbery
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponce View Post
...now i simply launch a queue of nearly 250 (and looking on increasing) packages in sbopkg on a freshly installed slackware, taking a look now and then (like a tamagotchi ) at the output; some hours and it's all done.
You only have to build packages in the correct order, this is the queue I use.
Hi Ponce,

THIS is a great idea! I think it would be cool for more of us to share our sbopkg build queues. I would break mine down by package, but the idea is the same. If somebody really wants to build the Enlightenment window manager, then he or she can download the build queue, load it into Sbopkg and get rolling.

For that matter, I plan soon to start building QGIS on Slackware64_13. A lot of that build needs to be done with src2pkg, and I plan to save my build scripts and make them available after I successfully finish the build.

It might be cool to have a central repository of Sbopkg queues and src2pgk scripts similar to what's available at Slackbuilds.org.

Regards,
 
Old 12-29-2009, 02:43 PM   #858
slakmagik
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lufbery View Post
It might be cool to have a central repository of Sbopkg queues and src2pgk scripts similar to what's available at Slackbuilds.org.
http://sbopkg.org/queues.php

We haven't really promoted this AFAIK, and it doesn't have a full-tilt SBo-like infrastructure, but the seed's been around for awhile. If people want to contribute, they can.

I know Mauro was working on a sort of mass-queue or queue-set but that's still a WIP.
 
Old 12-29-2009, 03:41 PM   #859
sahko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsman View Post
I think that is a harsh statement. I think the Salix devs know how Slackware works quite well. One wiki entry is no foundation for such a blanket statement.
I agree and i wouldnt have made it if i couldnt back it up.
Heres a link to a Greek LUG forum thread where in its Slackware section, 3 months ago, a Salix developer (AFAICT its main packager) "helps" a user complaining about X freezing after login.
gapan's reply is "Ctrl+Alt+Backspace doesnt work anymore. Use Alt-Printscreen-k"
which never was the case on Slackware.
http://forum.hellug.gr/index.php?topic=4640.0
Note that this is ~2-3 months after Salix was made publicly available.
To cut a long story short and save everyone from any possible trouble, IMO Salix people are Zenwalk people, not Slackware. I dont this that's harsh but rather precise.
 
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Old 12-29-2009, 04:01 PM   #860
Lufbery
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slakmagik View Post
http://sbopkg.org/queues.php

We haven't really promoted this AFAIK, and it doesn't have a full-tilt SBo-like infrastructure, but the seed's been around for awhile. If people want to contribute, they can.

I know Mauro was working on a sort of mass-queue or queue-set but that's still a WIP.
Cool!
 
Old 12-29-2009, 04:09 PM   #861
gapan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sahko View Post
I agree and i wouldnt have made it if i couldnt back it up.
You really like your FUD, don't you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sahko View Post
Heres a link to a Greek LUG forum thread where in its Slackware section, 3 months ago, a Salix developer (AFAICT its main packager) "helps" a user complaining about X freezing after login.
gapan's reply is "Ctrl+Alt+Backspace doesnt work anymore. Use Alt-Printscreen-k"
which never was the case on Slackware.
If you had taken the time to translate the complete sentence that would be: "Ctrl+Alt+Backspace doesnt work anymore with the new xorg. Use Alt-Printscreen-k", which is entirely true. The Xorg devs have removed that functionality by default. The "patch" that Slackware uses is in a hal configuration file that just changes the default xorg behaviour. That certain user I was trying to help was actually complaining that Ctrl+Alt+Backspace doesn't work. Do you find it that odd that maybe he (perhaps unwillingly) edited that same configuration file undoing the Slackware patch? Are you that blind-sighted?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sahko View Post
To cut a long story short and save everyone from any possible trouble, IMO Salix people are Zenwalk people, not Slackware. I dont this that's harsh but rather precise.
To cut a long story short and save everyone from any possible trouble, IMO you are a liar and a nuisance. I don't think that's harsh but rather precise.
 
Old 12-29-2009, 05:32 PM   #862
gauchao
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Slack is perfect! I hope nothing changes here. RedHat opened the source to Fedora and a group of people took the wrong way making that "bleeding-edge" distro bug, sluggish and instable. Network Manager used to be a nightmare; LVM was another PITA; the graphical boot/login is ridiculous; the time to boot was unbelievably infinite; the "dependencies-resolving packages" gives you more trouble than light; the windows managers (KDE and Gnome, to be more specific) are full of bugs, monstrously heavy. You had to fight to get to bash out of those "fancy eye-candies". And every 6 months the nightmare reappeared - you had some of your problems solved (or simply you give them up), and there came the headaches again. I'm telling this because I mean: "don't change Slack" - I'd rather see the same good "old" Slack for a long time, stable, perfect, fast as a bullet, only with its security updates properly installed, than face a system with everything we dislike. Ah, and please, take KDE packages away and save some space in the DVD for more and more good tutorials, how-tos and free slack books. Thank you, guys. Sorry for the long post.
 
Old 12-29-2009, 05:59 PM   #863
gauchao
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Quote:
Another example is a boot splash screen. Most non-technical users recoil at the sight of stdout screen messages during the boot process. They get scared. Most of us discussing these issues never think twice about booting a Linux-based system. Most non-technical users want that stuff hidden from them.
Please, Woodsman, that would be ten steps backward. I don't want to have a ubuntu/windows-like system because people don't know Linux and don't want to learn anything, just to make them happy. Let them stay with their fancy distros. If they want to make their PCs a home appliance, I don't. I like my PC exactly the way it is supposed to work. Leave Slackware alone, please...
 
Old 12-29-2009, 06:05 PM   #864
gauchao
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Quote:
Agreed. Let us leave Slackware alone. Like it or not Slackware is designed for gear-heads, people who like to tinker, users not afraid to learn about their OS. The off-shoots like Salix and Zenwalk fill the need for people who want something more than Ubuntu.
That's it, hitest! You express my feelings! People can choose among zillions of distros (or their window$ XYZ), why mess up with our beloved Slackware?
 
Old 12-29-2009, 06:48 PM   #865
damgar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GooseYArd View Post
I'd like to see a 3-D first person installer.
I see your FPI and raise you a plasma-flame-thrower to get packages installed!
 
Old 12-29-2009, 07:29 PM   #866
GooseYArd
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damgar View Post
I see your FPI and raise you a plasma-flame-thrower to get packages installed!
that's hot.
 
Old 12-29-2009, 07:29 PM   #867
~sHyLoCk~
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Quote:
Another example is a boot splash screen. Most non-technical users recoil at the sight of stdout screen messages during the boot process. They get scared. Most of us discussing these issues never think twice about booting a Linux-based system. Most non-technical users want that stuff hidden from them.
FWIW, i have a nice Slackware bootsplash in my box, just to point out it's not impossible but you need to make it yourself. So new users will have to figure these things by searching, reading,understanding and experimenting it themselves.
 
Old 12-29-2009, 08:10 PM   #868
Woodsman
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Quote:
Please, Woodsman, that would be ten steps backward.
I have taken great pains to ensure that I have nowhere in this thread (or other threads) advocated such changes as the default. Continually I have expressed that such changes would be optional. Installing boot splash support would be optional. Graphical administrative tools would be optional. Colorized boot scripts would be optional.

Optional: Left to choice; not compulsory or automatic.

As I have been using Slackware for several years now, I fully appreciate that discussing changes to the Slackware design is, for some Slackware users, pure fricking religion. A Holy War.

Once again, these suggested changes would be optional. If anybody considers him or herself a propeller head who thinks a person who uses graphical tools is a wet anatomical body part located in between a woman's legs, then by all means, do not install those packages. What is so hard to understand about that?

For the people who like the Slackware design, but want a little help with some graphical tools, they can install those packages.

The challenge is that many such people do not know how to compile software or build packages. Nor do they want to. They want the underlying design of Slackware and only want some simple graphical tools and the availability of precompiled packages.

Adding some of these packages does not change the design of Slackware. The additional packages only enhances Slackware for those people who are less technically inclined. There is no need for a Holy War.
 
Old 12-29-2009, 08:17 PM   #869
vigi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianL View Post
If there are offshoots like Salix and Zenwalk that offer one piece of software per task, why not leave the original Slackware alone? Why make it a clone of an offshoot? Daft idea.
I too am very happy with slackware, and am not suggesting an alternative system - only another optional desktop.iso file to appeal to a greater audience. I am finding it very difficult to understand the objectives of slackware, if not to become more popular?

The slackware spin offs call themselves distros, and Zenwalk regards itself as a separate OS. Most distros I have tried, are simply customizations, with a different mix of applications. The only difference I notice with Salix, is Gslapt included by default? What is the point of allowing so many spin offs - Ubuntu, Lubuntu, Xubuntu, Kubuntu etc etc etc.
 
Old 12-30-2009, 01:14 AM   #870
brixtoncalling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsman View Post
Once again, these suggested changes would be optional. If anybody considers him or herself a propeller head who thinks a person who uses graphical tools is a wet anatomical body part located in between a woman's legs, then by all means, do not install those packages. What is so hard to understand about that?

For the people who like the Slackware design, but want a little help with some graphical tools, they can install those packages.

The challenge is that many such people do not know how to compile software or build packages. Nor do they want to. They want the underlying design of Slackware and only want some simple graphical tools and the availability of precompiled packages.

Adding some of these packages does not change the design of Slackware. The additional packages only enhances Slackware for those people who are less technically inclined. There is no need for a Holy War.
Apparently Woodsman doesn't realise that we, the righteous Slackware users, recoil at the thought of graphical utilities desecrating our installed systems. HERETIC!

Come on people... are we masochists who must degrade Ubuntu and other distros for having a different, easier way of doing things? I love Slackware to death and have little need for it to be easier to install, configure or use. But if it were, would I stop using it? No, but I probably wouldn't use most of them.

Am I really so insecure that Salix devs' providing pre-compiled packages is cause for scorn and derision? No.

Do I think the Slackware team avoids gui config apps out of ideology or because they are prioritising their time on more important aspects of the distro? No.

Sbopkg, the darling of unofficial Slackwaredom, makes all of our lives easier. And we respect it only because it is ncurses and not Qt? No.

Woodsman is no iconoclast. He's making a perfectly reasonable suggestions on how Slackware could be better for everyone. Wicd (including the gtk front-end) is a wonderful tool for Slackware, and I bet there are even more out there.
 
  


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