I really doubt Linus would ever allow that to happen.

Making linux "alittle" easier for newcomers would be good, and has the newbies learned more they can start doing things a more advanced way, I am very proud of myself, I have been using the terminal to open programs, I know thats easy, but I was not use to doing that.. even when I first got into linux..

Yay! I love doing the same in the terminal in OS X

I can't fine the OSX terminal on on school macs.. where is it? We have 10.1...

Finder>applications>Utilities>Terminal

ah the terminal, the funest part of any computer (lol im very used to using terminal cuse teh first computers i used were terminal so it just comes natrualy for me to type in a cimple comand rather then spend like 10 minutes going tho butons and other trash thats unnessesary, but given somtiems usuful

From WinME onwards, it removed the original stuff to make it more "user-friendly". Then people started restarting in DOS, and they took away that too.

freekygeek55: on some macs, the computer admins at the school have removed it. beats me why, its just a temrinal. i asked my local admin the same thing, and he told me he had removed it. we're using 10.1 also.

I don't see the big deal in dumbing it up. people use their PC's as a tool to get other thigns done not as soemthing to have to figure out. The last thing 90% of the people out there want to do is to have to figure out how to install programs through linux or figure out how to set up their drivers correctly. You people want the fall of Windows but untily ou make Linux easy to use for everyone that won't happen. There is a reason why people don't care to try linux and no its not just because its forced onto them.

well, i am a when it comes to Linux. i believe that an easier install would help Linux become more universally acceptable. that kind of install doesn't have to change the heart or operation of Linux. it doesn't have to "dumb down" Linux for anyone. you could look at an install program as just another app that starts up.

also, i belive a more fundamental idea comes into play when you talk about Linux. that is the Windowization of a person's view of computers. Linux is another model and way to work with computers. that is something that needs to be taken into account when someone switches from windows to linux.

personnally, i'd like Linux to become more of an alternative to Microsoft. choices are nice. in fact, my goal is to finally make the switch and never look back. most people just want to use a computer, not configure it. that is surely a paradigm shift for Linux users. up until recently, Linux is mostly used by powerusers. of course, if Linux does become more of an alternative, then maybe Microsoft will start sueing Linux distributors. just read the headlines in the Netherlands.

IBM's coming out with a new "Blue Linux", a distro. created for the desktop. i believe the main goal, since its for the desktop, is to create an easy distro and another alternative to windows. although suse and mandrake are already doing this, IBM will do it better.

i've been going through installs of different "easy" distros, mandrake, redhat (and maybe next week fedora)....

i get frustrated over not being able to get things working, when i know how to do it on windows. so i try to learn, read and understand how to do it in linux, but man, most of the stuff i find to read is so archaic that i have trouble understanding it. luckily it's only a second computer, and it's not like i do anything important on it....so i can reinstall the os and try again...

but then once it's installed and working in some order, i sit there and go....now what. the programs i want to use, i don't know what they are or how they work. then trying to install programs is really frustrating if it's not an rpm or i have to install some file for a program to work...

it is frustrating, and this (personally) is the reason why windows user won't switch....they are use to the simple life.

Really? That's interesting to me.

I've been working with computers heavily since about '94. I've been doing computer programming heavily since '96. I have mostly worked within a Windows environment but have done the old lilo boot between RH 7.something and Win '98. I've been stuck managing the net server at one job (I guess because we're programmers we automatically know networking) and became fairly used to NT because of that. I've dealt heavily with 2000 and XP as well. I've spent a decent amount of time on Macs and have used Linux from the web server command line a great deal. I'm no expert in things outside of the Windows bubble but I have enough experience not to be an absolute idiot when it comes to Linux or Mac.

Now, that being said, I think it would help the Linux community to offer a simpler install, as was suggested. From what I've seen so far the 9.2 Mandrake install is not too bad but I am having problems. Mandrake has gotten further than XP on the install (I tried to reinstall XP to clean it out before trying the Mandrake route) so I have to give them credit there. The Mandrake install though, whether some wish to admit it or not, does get more complicated than a Windows install. This can be avoided by simply offering the user a quick install that makes some of the choices for you. They do expect you to think and to be aware of more than Windows. This isn't a bad thing but a real simple idiot install would not be a bad thing. It would bring more users to the Linux environment. It would also give those of us interested in learning the ability to get into the system and start learning. We're probably going to learn more inside the Linux environment than working on the install.

[cynicism]
But then an idiot that doesn't get past an installation
hopefully wouldn't show up here ;) and give up,
frustrated ...
[/cynicism]



Cheers,
Tink

The learning is a fun thing -- I just love it! Somehow while helping my mom with that horrible norton (crappy service GLAD I DON'T NEED IT) it crossed my mind that a simple, crappy webtv browser can be SOOO crappy and yet absolutely invulnerable to ANY security threat.