"C'mon! You think you're the only one on this planet who knows how to do this sh*t?"

sundialsvcs · 12-10-2012, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baldy3105

Can't remember where I heard this but it springs to mind -

A test to measure how indispensable you are.

All I know is, the only thing that sucks worse than perceiving yourself to be "indispensable," is for someone else, such as your boss, to have the same opinion of you.

clifford227 · 12-11-2012, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sundialsvcs

All I know is, the only thing that sucks worse than perceiving yourself to be "indispensable," is for someone else, such as your boss, to have the same opinion of you.

If your good enough, then you can have a high opinion of yourself.

If your not good enough, then improve.

Better still, find an area where you're naturally talented and become the best in that area instead.

onebuck · 12-12-2012, 04:47 PM

Hi,

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnsfine

That is a term I made up myself, originally for something that happened to me when I was in high school and tutoring students in the MBA program at UMass Amherst. That MBA program misunderstood the growing importance of computers in business and required MBA students to take Basic and Fortran programming courses. (Yes computers turned out to be vitally important, but programming was not the aspect of computers those students needed to learn).

After tutoring in Basic one semester, I agreed to tutor the same students in Fortran the next semester. I knew nothing about Fortran at the time, but assumed I could learn it all in a few hours by reading the manual (I probably could have). I procrastinated and didn't get to the university book store to buy the manual until it was out of stock. So I showed up for the first tutoring session without a clue about Fortran.

Given hard working students who had clearly read the right parts of the Fortran manual before even seeking my help and given homework assignments that they could not figure out how to code in Fortran (after getting A's in Basic): I started by asking them "how would you do that in Basic?" and when they didn't quite know, I asked some actual Socratic method questions to remind them they really did know. Then I pointed out specific small parts and asked "how would you do that piece in Fortran?". I saw that as "fake" Socratic, because I didn't know the answer myself, but I was confident they did know and just needed to apply the knowledge.

I ended up tutoring the entire semester without ever seeing a Fortran manual. By the end of the semester, my students had paid me quite a lot for the privilege of teaching me Fortran (I got a part time job doing some Fortran programming soon after that and never did need that manual). But they learned a lot more and got better grades than if they hadn't hired me.

In education 'fake Socratic method' is well known. So you happen to hit the point somewhere and you were not aware of the actual implication or use. Lucky hit!

Teachers in many field of study do use 'fake Socratic methods' all the time. Plus do not forget Spin Doctors, who will do it all the time!

Nothing wrong with being a implementer along with a little conceit or should I say confidence then you can help others to end points when you spin information so it starts members to think holistically about the set therefor intrinsic to their problem

One needs to be very cautious and understand that the level of information exchanged does not impede. Good managers are good listeners that can control the situation by digesting the information then presenting queries to the right members of the group in the manner necessary for that person. Beating one's chest all the time will get you more problems since no one will approach a person so conceited. Respect for a manager or project leader is earned by a learned set of relations within the group.

Teaching is a honorable position;

Quote:

"It is one of the most beautiful compensations in life…that no man can sincerely try to help another without helping himself." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

BTW, FORTRAN represents (formula translation) and is spelled FORTRAN not 'Fortran'. Maybe you should have looked at that 'FORTRAN' manual. Just thought it would be nice to show error so you can at least seem to know that even you can make one or two as we mere humans do.

Myself included, I have learned over the years from many students that would present a query that would require me to really lay the problem out and present a well thought out answer. Be it theoretical or practical when teaching someone you had better know the field of study in order to provide good thoughtful information exchange concerning the field since you are building on another persons knowledge base not just understanding one point.

I do find this thread very interesting!

sundialsvcs · 12-12-2012, 05:09 PM

I still have my FORTRAN-G manual and, yes, my card-saw. My "POP" manual that was printed on a line printer... on green bar. A proud card-carrying member of the "oops! club." (Dumped an entire box of cards on the floor such that they scattered all the way to the opposite end of the room.) Knows why the rightmost columns of a card were reserved for sequence numbers.

(These kids today... they've got the Internet, but we had the fun.)

Footnote: "POP" = System/360 Principles Of Operation. Yes, sometimes the extra "O" was included.

"It don't mean a thing if it ain't got blinkin' lights ..."

chrism01 · 12-12-2012, 06:54 PM

Certainly a classic saying "If you want to learn something (properly), teach it to someone else".
That's when you find out if you really know it or just think you do

onebuck · 12-12-2012, 07:28 PM

Hi,

IBM 360/20 was one of my early machines. Only when the lamp is out on the panel and should be on, talk about bugs and damn peanut bulbs.

I've picked up my share of cards. Really never cared for 'Unit Records', damned to hell in that room. You had to wear ear plugs or go nuts from the mechanical noise.

Talk about feeling the beat! I felt sorry for the people in the punch room.

We even had to use the old ASR-33 and talk about clumsy typing. Paper tape was just another way to get cut and I am not talking about cutting your teeth. Do you remember how you would single step through the 'boot' to sometimes kick in a peripheral by toggling input at the processor? Or singling through a program for debug? I really do not miss that era, love my new equipment that 'just works' and performs the way I wish. And when it doesn't then the tools available to diagnose then repair is a whole lot easier now. Be it hardware or software issue to debug today is a lot easier with available resources.

I remember my first experiences with spinning disk, SMD was new and we thought 'Damn big storage for 10MB' that cost was only $10K for certified Gold disk packs. Drives were around $50K each and those babies were big and expensive for what you got for storage.

We maintained our equipment, I was given the responsibility of keeping things up and ready for both hardware & software. So hard drive maintance was one of my responsibilities which included all aspects.

I did learn a lot while in the field for that period.

Fun! Fun! .... more Fun!

sundialsvcs · 12-13-2012, 11:00 PM

Two fun memories: (1) Keying in a boot program on binary switches, and (2) Watching a 10-megabyte disk drive (roughly the size of a small clothes washer) in "Maytag Mode" ... shortly before the aforesaid device vibrated itself to, and then over, the edge of the raised floor.

(Giving an entirely new and very-literal meaning to "hard disk crash.")

Yup. Fun memories. But I wouldn't want to do it again. Except for the blinking lights. I do miss those. (I'm sure "there's an app for that...") You turned off all the lights and, by gawd, the place you worked was cool! In a hopelessly nerdy sort of way . . . but you didn't mind. And still don't.