Big difference between Unix systems? Which one as OSX replacement for a developer?

YesItsMe · 01-04-2018, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JacobPhelps

they all try to be unix/posix conform if possible and not senseless I guess

No, GNU/Linux does not try to be Unix/POSIX-conform. That's why they invented the Linux Standard Base, a NIH version of "POSIX for Linux".
Which they also gladly ignore...

jlliagre · 01-04-2018, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YesItsMe

The "time machine" is Apple's approach to Solaris's "time slider"...

Correct although I believe time machine came first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by YesItsMe

No. That GNU dude (RMS) hates Unix principles, so does that Lennart guy. "GNU" means "GNU's Not Unix" - for this one reason: It does not even try to be like Unix.

I beg to differ. What rms hates is closed source/proprietary software but he doesn't hate (or love either) Unix. He considered Unix to be "fairly clean" and "ok overall as a model" enough to select it as the standard to follow to start building his operating system.

GNU indeed mean "GNU is Not Unix" but only to make clear it shares no line of code with the "real" Unix (i.e. AT&T). GNU tries to be as close as possible to Unix design and standards with few exceptions.

YesItsMe · 01-04-2018, 09:24 AM

I can't find the exact quote right now, sorry. About Time Slider/Time Machine: It seems that Apple had it first indeed. But I prefer the Solaris approach - it is so much nicer to use.

jlliagre · 01-04-2018, 09:35 AM

Here is a quote from Stallman ( https://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html ):

Quote:

I never used Unix (not even for a minute) until after I decided to develop a free replacement for it (the GNU system). I chose that design to follow because it was portable and seemed fairly clean. I was never a fan of Unix; I had some criticisms of it too. But it was ok overall as a model.

and another one from the GNU manifesto (1985)

Quote:

Why GNU Will Be Compatible with Unix?

Unix is not my ideal system, but it is not too bad. The essential features of Unix seem to be good ones, and I think I can fill in what Unix lacks without spoiling them. And a system compatible with Unix would be convenient for many other people to adopt.

sidzen · 01-04-2018, 09:56 AM

gentoo

cynwulf · 01-04-2018, 11:16 AM

I'd say that the "primary system" may be stuck with macOS, due to the specific proprietary software requirements others have mentioned. I can't see much point in you changing it.

The "secondary system" could be anything. I'd start there and just install some 'mainstream' Linux distributions to begin with. You could install a *BSD, but be aware that there is a learning curve - they don't generally come ready to go "out of the box".

The shell situation shouldn't be an issue, if you do decide to opt for a *BSD, bash is available in ports for FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD and DragonFly - all assuming your scripting involves "bashisms" and bash is specifically required?

All of the *BSDs have some kind of Bourne Shell (sh) as well as tcsh in the base system. OpenBSD uses a Korn Shell (pdksh) as the default shell.

JacobPhelps · 01-04-2018, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YesItsMe

As you especially asked for a "developer" replacement for the rotten

macOS, here are my two cents:

What exactly is rotten on macOS ?

YesItsMe · 01-04-2018, 02:19 PM

macOS is the living proof that you can make flawed BSD systems. Latest example: Whoops, my calendar has 13 months.

JacobPhelps · 01-04-2018, 02:35 PM

ok

Thanks to all who participated on this thread.
I think this is a great community.

I will start a NAS/Home Entertainment project maybe also with a Raspberry Pi this year and then Linux or BSD will be used and I will probably open a thread for discussion or presentation.

cynwulf · 01-04-2018, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YesItsMe

macOS is the living proof that you can make flawed BSD systems. Latest example: Whoops, my calendar has 13 months.

Well Darwin is a BSD userland and a XNU (CMU Mach descendent) kernel. I'd say it's possible to make a mess of everything. That's their prerogative and all entirely permissible under BSD style licences.

I'm not sure Android is much better...: https://www.linuxquestions.org/quest...ml#post5793526

YesItsMe · 01-04-2018, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cynwulf

Well Darwin is a BSD userland

macOS was mostly BSD-like once, but the userland is gradually being replaced by GNU stuff (e.g. bash).

Quote:

Originally Posted by cynwulf

I'm not sure Android is much better...

Android is a Frankensteinism: A somewhat minified version of the Linux kernel running a NetBSD userland under one or two (Dalvik and ART were both there for a while) almost-Java VMs. That allows for quite creative issues by design.