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Old 02-15-2005, 03:50 PM   #1
MadSkillzMan
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What do you think linux needs to replace Windows?


Hey guys i got to thinking, what does linux need to become a primary desktop? I dont know about you guys but i sure wish it would, as then many companys would start writting their software for it. Me being a video editor, you know thats not one of linux's things.

Now most of us can handle ourselves just fine. But i like to think in terms of "what if my girlfriend had to use this? what if my parents needed linux instead of microsoft for some reason? and im not there to fix everything?"

Im hoping some linux programmers read this and get ideas.

So with that said heres what i think it needs:

EASIER package install. I know its easy with .rpm and such, but make it BUI like windows setup.exe junk. RPM managers, SuSE's YaST are alright. In fact YaST is reallyeasy, but what about double click-install apps you download?

DEPENDENCIES! No linux newbie can handle gentoo. Now i know FreeBSD has something similar to portage? im going to try it later. Yes i know im just attaking something thats been hated for years.

GUI installer. Personally i dont care, i feel at home with all text. So far SuSE and mandrake have the most friendly installers.

Auto detect hardware: i know thatsa tough topic. but some distros find every peice of hardware on my system, whereas others need EVERYTHING installed.

GUI in general i have NO complaints. i love the linux gui's, be it Gnome, KDE, XFCE

FileSystem: Ive seen distros that install to NTFS. No swap or anything. Id like to see more of that, but those distros dont have NTFS Captive support (go figure)

Grphiacal kernel compiles: couldnt there be a GUI thing where you drag your module files over into a "window" and it fits it in there, click "compile" does it, boom your done.

Thats all i can think of at the moment. I like linux, but again id love to see it replace windows, and these are just some things that i wish would happen. Now im dusting off the old C++ books and id love to contribute in my spare time, so im no leech. Ive contributed the impossible SiS Xabre xinerama config.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 04:08 PM   #2
KimVette
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NLE for the professional is VERY doable on Linux - but perhaps not for the hobbiest if you want commercial tools - good packages tend to start at $3K or so.

There is one inexpensive NLE app for Linux called MainActor but honestly, I tried the trial, and I've seen much better in FREE software for Linux.

THere is another option - which appears to be better than MainActor, and it's free. It's called Cinerella and can be downloaded from http://heroinewarrior.com/cinelerra.php3. The great thing about Cinerella is not only is its GUI as good as the low-to-midrange NLE apps on Windows and OS/X, but it also supports render/rip farms, and it's all free of licensing costs! They claim it's not for consumer use, but by that they mean it's pro quality, and not a low-end piece of crap.

Last edited by KimVette; 02-15-2005 at 04:17 PM.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 04:09 PM   #3
IsaacKuo
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I think that Linux needs more people who complain about package management and dependencies to try out Debian based distributions.

There's a REASON why Lindows and Xandros and Knoppix and Ubuntu and Mepis and other distributions attempting to make easy home user desktop operating systems started off with Debian under the hood. Easy software installs is that reason--easier than Windows Setup any day!

In particular, Mepis is good for a newbie who needs a simple out-of-box experience with straightforward Windows networking connectivity.

For someone who has had enough experience with Mepis and/or Knoppix and/or Kanotix and/or other Linuxes to know what software he wants, Debian Sarge is good. However, I wouldn't recommend Debian Sarge for a newbie because its default install is a bit spartan and mediocre.

There's no "wow, this is fun" factor with Sarge the way there is for Mepis or Knoppix.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 04:20 PM   #4
320mb
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Quote:
What do you think linux needs to replace Windows?
it'll never happen..........because most people/kids want games that work..............and after what happened to "tux racer" -- commercial game developers won't invest money for linux at all............Sunspire Studios is out of business because the freeloading cheapskates refused to support the commercial version! one can still get tux racer off ebay..... someone bought the rest of their stock and is authorized to sell it all...........
 
Old 02-15-2005, 04:21 PM   #5
MadSkillzMan
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See ya i know theres CInerella and Main Acotr 5, but IMO they dont compare to premeire. Then again cinerella does have the cluster render which makes mre REALLY happy. At the moment im just freelance, id like to learn stuff the professionals use. And if cinerella is it, then ill give it a try again. But we dont have things like after effects, particle illusion, combustion, etc..and my card wont run maya so thats out.

Ubuntu, DONT GET ME STARTED! i wasted 2 hours on it last nite and i will never even touch that distro again! It doesnt even allow you to setup a proper root account, the XF86Config is TOTALLY wacked out. i editied, X wouldnt start, tried to load my backup, said i didnt have permission. entered the general user PW, rejected it. Also the LILO it installed screwd my MBR. I told it to install to /dev/fd0, and it said it did, next thing i new i couldnt get back into windows.

Ive tried debian. THe install is shaky, but its well worth it. I love the whole FTP install.

Im just saying, think in terms of when you wer a noob, the debian install is text (atleast the FTP is)

Package management is great i cant argue that. Now whats the package management freebsd has?

How this for awsome, mac osx users can have portage ( i have it, i love it)
 
Old 02-15-2005, 04:42 PM   #6
IsaacKuo
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Ubuntu does let you set up a "proper" root account if you want, although you do have to know how to do it (or know how to look up how to do it).

The way Ubuntu handles root and sudo by default is rather strange, compared to most Linux distribution (including other Debian based distributions). However, it's not anything strange for someone familiar with sudo to handle.

In any case, a newbie shouldn't be messing root login anyway. It's better for a newbie to learn the proper way to do administration with sudo from the start rather than logging in as root.

I personally haven't tried out Ubuntu, though; I don't care for GNOME, and prefer to stick with the standard Debian repositories.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 04:47 PM   #7
IsaacKuo
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BTW, most Knoppix variants use knoppix-installer, which is graphical. Mepis uses its own installer, which is also graphical but looks slicker--more newbie friendly.

As I understand it, Ubuntu uses a slightly modified Debian Sarge installer. I suppose Sarge's installer is good for maximum control, but a newbie just wants to press an install button and see progress bars go. That's where the all-or-nothing install of Knoppix variants is actually not a disadvantage.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 05:28 PM   #8
MadSkillzMan
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the thing about ubuntu, Sudo only works while logged into Gnome. I needed to access stuff without gnome, wouldnt let me. Infact it refused to let me restart my computer without root privilages.

And thats jsut the thing, i agree newbs shoulnd learn administrative properties first, but this thing was just overall frstrating.

As for the games, yes i agree, linux wont go far without gamers support. Thats why im thankful i can play quake 3 and wolfenstein on my computer. IIRC, the new crossover office supports directX. If i get a chance im gonna throw premeire at it and see how it handles.


Would it be possible ( i know this is just like wine) to have a program that takes your windows install CD, and just pulls files from it that it might need to run certain apps? Of corse youd pay for windows and such. I know thats like wine/winex, but justa thought.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 05:39 PM   #9
IsaacKuo
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Ubuntu is rather loud about their GNOME-only support. As I said, this is a reason why I've avoided Ubuntu so far.

For a newbie this could be okay, since a newbie wouldn't have a compelling reason to not use GNOME.

Actually, the only problems I've heard of outside of GNOME in Ubuntu is with KDE. KDE administration tools assume a traditional root account. This isn't a problem with "sudo", but rather a limitation of KDE's implementation of "administrator mode".
 
Old 02-15-2005, 05:57 PM   #10
KimVette
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadSkillzMan
See ya i know theres CInerella and Main Acotr 5, but IMO they dont compare to premeire.
I agree. Neither MainActor nor Cinerella crash every 30 seconds.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 06:50 PM   #11
MadSkillzMan
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got me there Kimvette. I take it your quite experienced? Main actor i couldnt get to work on 9.1, i had the trial. It would crash the system. Premeire pro 1.5 (the rest SUCK) is pretty solid. Although its my hope to move to mac soon., since the os supports everything i do, and on top of that i can compile my favorite unix apps.

I just tried to load suse9.2 on my spare drive to find the drive developed a click of death GR!
 
Old 02-15-2005, 08:26 PM   #12
KimVette
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadSkillzMan
Premeire pro 1.5 (the rest SUCK) is pretty solid.
Everyone I know who bought Premiere Pro went back to Premiere. Premiere is bad, but Premiere Pro is the spawn of Satan.

If you want to stick with mainstream operating systems, check out Ulead Media Studio Pro or switch to OS/X and use Final Cut Pro. Both are very capable, and far more reliable than Premiere. Adobe product management should feel ashamed for letting that unstable software go out the doors.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 09:28 PM   #13
MadSkillzMan
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alright well me and kimvette have gone way off topic..

PPro7.0 i hated
PPro1.5 i love.

Ulead aggervated me, as the plugins wer limited. Also i found ulead crashed more than anyting, especially when doing timeline veiws. I almost had ulead startup in linux. Plugins are a big plus for me. Boris Red, Sapphire, photoshop plugins working in premeire/aefx. I am hoping to switch to mac. I prefer the professionally used NLE's, simply because people are intimidated (when they dont know about it) and think you hold some high knowledge. Magic bullet can never be replaced.

I will say i read about cinelerra, i cant diss it. I was amazed with the color correction it offered, the feature that fixes up pixelated footage, its mac like integration with the desktop. No use in convincing me, id switch to it if i could, but then id have nothing to take care of particles, lightning, film mimicing. I do editing/SPFX for a indie film. I looked at cinelerra a few years ago, and thought nothing of it. Now its becomming more of an option to me. I honestly think its gonna get picked up eventually and evolve into something great.

Currently i got my hands on CinePaint for windows and its way better than uleads CGI infinity.

Id be enclined to switch to linux all aorund for this stuff, since windows locked me out of a 2gig folder containing about 43clips of random SPFX clips me and my bro did. Wont let me veiw/read/edit/write..nothing. even after i did all M$'s tweaks to take ownership.
 
Old 02-15-2005, 09:37 PM   #14
speel
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadSkillzMan
the thing about ubuntu, Sudo only works while logged into Gnome. I needed to access stuff without gnome, wouldnt let me. Infact it refused to let me restart my computer without root privilages.
not true i use the terminal all the time with our X running sudo works fine
 
Old 02-15-2005, 09:39 PM   #15
MadSkillzMan
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i killed my xf86, i couldnt get into gnome. just BW text, and it wouldnt let me do a thing. i didnt have a chacne to set a root PW. But even windows asks you to setup admin privilages on install.
 
  


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