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Old 12-03-2004, 11:01 AM   #1
cat-21
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Samba is ruining Linux


I have been working with SuSE for a couple of months now and from my standpoint I feel Linux's weakness is in a network/domain environment. My problem with Linux is having it connect to Windows Machines or other on my Network. While it can view the domains and computers it can never attach to them. I know this is samba's problem and not SuSE's so I don't blame them. Basically samba.org has got to get their stuff together as they seem to be the weak link in the Linux puzzle. I feel SuSE should take over and build this thing right as samba obviously can't. If you google around practically every distro is suffering from one of two errors in network related function and it's samba-related.

1. Unknown error condition in stat : Network is unreachable

2. The process for the smb://(machine name) protocol died unexpectedly

There was over 10,000 references to these errors and pages and pages of people complaining over these problems with either fixes that didn't work or no fix and them stating they've abandoned their testing and are moving on to other tasks. In most cases these people gave up on it and wen't back to Windows. So in a nutshell samba is killing future Linux customers due to there disenchantment and turning them back to Windows. When I saw the SuSE distro I was very impressed with their accomplishments. They have a very polished and professional distro. Just like so many other people who saw Linux, they were sold until samba screwed SuSE by creating sub-par networking. Samba's the weak link in the Linux puzzle, if SuSE was smart they would dump them for good and go in-house before they ruin their future customer base.

I work in IT and alot of people would love to get heavier into Linux in general. Basically all of their biggest gripes are over networking problems. People who need domain functionality would have totally abandoned Linux if it hadn't been for smb4k giving the fix they needed unlike Samba, so you have them to thank for keeping a small number of companies from totally scrapping the Linux game entirely for another 5 years which is what Linux doesn't need right now.
 
Old 12-03-2004, 11:07 AM   #2
XavierP
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Linux has long had network capabilities - from the beginning (not something that can be said about Windows). Microsoft have had a long history of taking standards, like TCP/IP, and 'breaking them'. This means that we can't connect Windows servers to non-Windows clients without many hacks - like, for example, AppleTalk.

Microsoft will not release their code to enable Linux to be able to connect to them natively or with simpler hacks, so the SAMBA project was born. The SAMBA project has to try to figure out how they can connect without reverse engineering or other hacks. They do the absolute best they can with the limited information available.

Many people on LQ (and in the wider Linux community) connect to Windows domains. So really, your phrasing was incorrect: Microsoft is the weak link.

Welcome to LQ, btw
 
Old 12-03-2004, 12:36 PM   #3
NYCmitch25
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Re: Samba is ruining Linux

Quote:
Originally posted by cat-21
[B]I have been working with SuSE for a couple of months now and from my standpoint I feel Linux's weakness is in a network/domain environment. My problem with Linux is having it connect to Windows Machines or other on my Network. While it can view the domains and computers it can never attach to them. I know this is samba's problem and not SuSE's so I don't blame them. Basically samba.org has got to get their stuff together as they seem to be the weak link in the Linux puzzle. I feel SuSE should take over and build this thing right as samba obviously can't. If you google around practically every distro is suffering from one of two errors in network related function and it's samba-related.

1. Unknown error condition in stat : Network is unreachable

2. The process for the smb://(machine name) protocol died unexpectedly

Obviously you are trying to fit Windows solutions into linux.. I used to do the same thing when I was a real newb... (Now I'm about 1/2 newb lol) Windows domain stuff is garbage. I actually install openSSH on windows and Linux and have little issue..

Also you should connect directly to a machine via IP address instead of using the Machine Name. That doesn't even work all that well in windows.. and it doesn't span over Routers.. (it's using broadcasting)...
 
Old 12-05-2004, 06:41 PM   #4
cat-21
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Thanks for those quick replies. I find the answers interesting as Mac computers are integrating into a Windows domain much easier than Linux and I figure Microsoft probably would be more threatened by Mac integration rather than Linux as Mac represents the most stable and best Unix based distribution in the world surpassing Linux in stability, features and seniority in the OS game. It's also alarming when Samba is referred to as a "hack" into a Windows system so to speak as it gives the impression of like when people download software from Kazaa and use cracks to register it.

As I may have said here before I'm really impressed with the strides Linux has made considering that it's open source and not profit driven like Windows or Mac is. I figure in 5-10 years it will be just like Mac in it's integration into Windows and vice versa. Judging from the comments Mac must have Windows source code info since AppleTalk is old news. I figure Linux will be next pretty soon, though I guess the "open-source" nature of Linux may worry Microsoft where as Mac isn't open-source so security is greater in protecting Microsoft information. Both Windows and LInux need to work together for both to survive. Each OS has their place in the market and it would only be foolish if either one didn't accept that. Linux won't kill Windows, only Microsoft can do that to themselves. IBM has made changes in these new market conditions, eventually Microsoft will also have to comform to the new and ever changing computer world.
 
Old 12-05-2004, 07:44 PM   #5
scuzzman
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Quote:
Originally posted by cat-21
It's also alarming when Samba is referred to as a "hack" into a Windows system so to speak as it gives the impression of like when people download software from Kazaa and use cracks to register it.
Here you mis-use the term, and then use it correctly. In this context, hack means to tweak something to make it work. If i couldnt get a program to work, I'd have to edit the config files, the source code, basically port it to my system. This is hacking. Crack means to steal/intrude/etc...

Last edited by scuzzman; 12-05-2004 at 10:09 PM.
 
Old 12-05-2004, 10:04 PM   #6
cat-21
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Wow, sorry, tough crowd in these Linux forums.
 
Old 12-05-2004, 10:08 PM   #7
scuzzman
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It was not meant to be rude - you have my apologies...
The post has been edited...
 
Old 12-10-2004, 03:49 PM   #8
jaredthane
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So... back to the point...
How can we get this to connect. I'm sure the Suse developers put this functionality here to be used... how do we get it to work? I've also seen many questions about this, but as of yet, no answers. The reality is that although I love linux, I'm surrounded by a windows world and I need to connect, easily. I was so excited when I saw this functionality, and so disappointed when it broke. Any suggestions on how to make it work?
 
Old 12-10-2004, 04:29 PM   #9
trey85stang
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Quote:
Originally posted by jaredthane
So... back to the point...
How can we get this to connect. I'm sure the Suse developers put this functionality here to be used... how do we get it to work? I've also seen many questions about this, but as of yet, no answers. The reality is that although I love linux, I'm surrounded by a windows world and I need to connect, easily. I was so excited when I saw this functionality, and so disappointed when it broke. Any suggestions on how to make it work?
your trying to connect from linux to windows... This is not a samba related issue.. sorry. You must connect via smb because that is the protocol that windows uses.

You might want to post up a little more information (and possibly in a new thread in the networking forum.. if you are looking for help.

Also.. sounds like you are trying to connect to a machine via nautilus or konqueror.. I personally have never been able to make that work. Try mounting the share you want to connect to from teh command line.
 
Old 12-10-2004, 05:11 PM   #10
jaredthane
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Yeh, konqueror. I can do the command line but I wish I had something faster, something GUI I think I'm going to look into NFS at home where it's Linux/Mac, but that doesn't ease things at work were it's pure M$. I tried LinNeighborhood on several installs but it never compiles... well, tht's another story... thanks... pout pout. ;-(
 
  


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