LinuxQuestions.org
Visit the LQ Articles and Editorials section
Go Back   LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Non-*NIX Forums > General
User Name
Password
General This forum is for non-technical general discussion which can include both Linux and non-Linux topics. Have fun!

Notices

Closed Thread
 
Search this Thread
Old 08-25-2013, 10:47 PM   #46
ntubski
Senior Member
 
Registered: Nov 2005
Distribution: Debian
Posts: 2,446

Rep: Reputation: 829Reputation: 829Reputation: 829Reputation: 829Reputation: 829Reputation: 829Reputation: 829

There was a story about octopus(!) tool use (coconut shell).
 
Old 08-26-2013, 12:05 AM   #47
k3lt01
Senior Member
 
Registered: Feb 2011
Location: Australia
Distribution: Debian Wheezy, Jessie, Sid/Experimental, playing with Slackware 14.
Posts: 2,643

Original Poster
Rep: Reputation: 554Reputation: 554Reputation: 554Reputation: 554Reputation: 554Reputation: 554
Just reminding people this thread is called "Discussion of Evolution", this means if you choose to take part you want to discuss the topic and not just post 1 liners with a link that may or may not be useful. So tell us your thoughts of Evolution and the human species with regards to the scientific process and why you think what you think.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 01:48 AM   #48
Randicus Draco Albus
Senior Member
 
Registered: May 2011
Location: Sitting in front of my computer.
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 1,132
Blog Entries: 4

Rep: Reputation: 279Reputation: 279Reputation: 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by ntubski View Post
There was a story about octopus(!) tool use (coconut shell).
Very interesting, but not surprising. We have known for a while that octopi are smart animals. It is good there is now some empirical evidence to make the "if it cannot be physically measured it does not exist" people happy.

*It is a sad day when academic writing has words like octopuses, instead of octopi.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 03:33 AM   #49
nigelc
Member
 
Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
Distribution: Mageia 4
Posts: 300
Blog Entries: 4

Rep: Reputation: 52
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randicus Draco Albus View Post
Very interesting, but not surprising. We have known for a while that octopi are smart animals. It is good there is now some empirical evidence to make the "if it cannot be physically measured it does not exist" people happy.

*It is a sad day when academic writing has words like octopuses, instead of octopi.
Octopus is a word of Greek origin the plural does not end in "i"
It is not a second declension Latin word:
Quote:
dominus, –ī
master m.
Singular Plural
Nominative dominus –us dominī –ī

Genitive dominī –ī dominōrum –ōrum
Dative dominō –ō dominīs –īs
Accusative dominum –um dominōs –ōs
Ablative dominō –ō dominīs –īs
Vocative domine –e dominī –ī
It is quite incorrect to say "octopi"
 
Old 08-26-2013, 04:28 AM   #50
brianL
LQ 5k Club
 
Registered: Jan 2006
Location: Oldham, Lancs, England
Distribution: Slackware & Slackware64 14.1
Posts: 6,970
Blog Entries: 52

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Randicus
You can use octopodes, if you really want to impress people.
http://oxforddictionaries.com/defini...opus?q=octopus
 
Old 08-26-2013, 05:51 AM   #51
Randicus Draco Albus
Senior Member
 
Registered: May 2011
Location: Sitting in front of my computer.
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 1,132
Blog Entries: 4

Rep: Reputation: 279Reputation: 279Reputation: 279
Cephalopod sounds even better.
The ability to change skin colour as a form of camouflage is a tremendous evolutionary advantage. Especially the octopus. I saw one on a television nature programme change colours almost instantaneously. I would be very interested in some insight into the biological mechanisms that are used. If anyone is familiar with it, feel free to enlighten me. It should not be off-topic, because I interpret the OP to include general discussion of evolution, not only ours.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:28 AM   #52
Arcane
Member
 
Registered: May 2006
Location: Latvia, Europe
Distribution: random
Posts: 287

Rep: Reputation: 164Reputation: 164
Quote:
Originally Posted by k3lt01 View Post
Just reminding people this thread is called "Discussion of Evolution", this means if you choose to take part you want to discuss the topic and not just post 1 liners with a link that may or may not be useful. So tell us your thoughts of Evolution and the human species with regards to the scientific process and why you think what you think.
In that case are we talking about Homo Sapiens evolution and homo gene that is unique(key word) for some reason or Evolution in general for every species on Earth?
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:34 AM   #53
rokytnji
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2008
Location: Waaaaay out West Texas
Distribution: AntiX 13 , Various Puppys (MacPup,Slack0),MX-14
Posts: 2,577
Blog Entries: 16

Rep: Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827
Ok. I am a guy who has been kinda tuned to nature all his life.

I personally keep 5 dogs and 2 cats to keep life interesting.
Dogs are very smart as far interpreting what I want from them and
believe it or not. I have my cats trained the same way also.

Reward training makes this easy. Now. I've heard of clam shell tools
and sticks for termites and bannana leafs for umbrellas. In other words
I guess what I am trying to get at is that if a reward is the end result
of using a tool for one certain task. OK.

So what my Biker brain is getting so far is that what makes a brain evolve
is the reward waiting after the end of a thinking process action.
Then what reward is had when art or I don't have the vocabulary I guess
to explain (music?) comes into play?

Curious as always. Otherwise I would not be a Linux user.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:42 AM   #54
rokytnji
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2008
Location: Waaaaay out West Texas
Distribution: AntiX 13 , Various Puppys (MacPup,Slack0),MX-14
Posts: 2,577
Blog Entries: 16

Rep: Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827
Errr, I am not getting my point across too well.

If I break out my Harmonica. My dogs listen but with a ? look on their faces.
My Cats will just run away
Not because I am a bad player.

Because they have no concept of abstract organized images (art) or sound (music)
to get any kind of pleasure from it. In other words a reward.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:44 AM   #55
Arcane
Member
 
Registered: May 2006
Location: Latvia, Europe
Distribution: random
Posts: 287

Rep: Reputation: 164Reputation: 164
@rokytnji: Interesting example. Are you sure we are on same page. Sounds to me you are speaking about superstition rather than evolution.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWo3kTYb8W0
For those who like text here is part of video about pigeon experiment
http://vidallena.org/skinpal.htm
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:48 AM   #56
rokytnji
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2008
Location: Waaaaay out West Texas
Distribution: AntiX 13 , Various Puppys (MacPup,Slack0),MX-14
Posts: 2,577
Blog Entries: 16

Rep: Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827
I am very very very far from being superstitious. I think and live here and now and am more
of a outdoors tyoe than a indoors type. I am just curious is all'
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:48 AM   #57
Randicus Draco Albus
Senior Member
 
Registered: May 2011
Location: Sitting in front of my computer.
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 1,132
Blog Entries: 4

Rep: Reputation: 279Reputation: 279Reputation: 279
Quote:
Originally Posted by rokytnji View Post
Then what reward is had when art or I don't have the vocabulary I guess
to explain (music?) comes into play?
The first hypothesis that jumps into my mind is visual art can serve the purposes of communication, leaving behind a record for the children and grand-children, or perhaps empathetic magic. (If I create a gazelle, I might have a better change of killing one.) All three results are rewards. ??? Maybe, maybe not.

Music gives people pleasure, which is also a reward.

Edit
Oops. I did not see your follow-up post.

Last edited by Randicus Draco Albus; 08-26-2013 at 08:51 AM.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 08:54 AM   #58
Arcane
Member
 
Registered: May 2006
Location: Latvia, Europe
Distribution: random
Posts: 287

Rep: Reputation: 164Reputation: 164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randicus Draco Albus View Post
{...}Music gives people pleasure, which is also a reward.
Not really true..music pleasure is much more different from casual rewards. Just like other media. Tell me then how can children learn foreign language(i learned basic english this way myself so when i started learning english at school i already knew lot of stuff - if i would be exposed more who knows..some people say they learned a lot by plain watching) watching just cartoons and movies and other TV material then if it is just reward? Art is something much more complicated yet brilliant result that prooves something is missing..

Last edited by Arcane; 08-26-2013 at 09:00 AM. Reason: ye ye you can learn to talk but you will still fail to write
 
Old 08-26-2013, 09:07 AM   #59
rokytnji
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2008
Location: Waaaaay out West Texas
Distribution: AntiX 13 , Various Puppys (MacPup,Slack0),MX-14
Posts: 2,577
Blog Entries: 16

Rep: Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827Reputation: 827
Before I go outside and get off the net. Just another thought popped into my head,

People have a concept of time. How did that happen.
My pets don't plan for what they are going to do next week.

Boy, The questions this thread could bring up. Evolution is weird.

Edit made me grin. I know. A serious thread but I figured to be myself and have some fun.

evolution.jpg

Last edited by rokytnji; 08-26-2013 at 09:19 AM.
 
Old 08-26-2013, 09:58 AM   #60
brianL
LQ 5k Club
 
Registered: Jan 2006
Location: Oldham, Lancs, England
Distribution: Slackware & Slackware64 14.1
Posts: 6,970
Blog Entries: 52

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Creativity and imagination. Those are what separates us from other animals. But how they might have evolved, I haven't a clue.
 
  


Closed Thread

Tags
anthropology, archaeology, evolution, science, scientific method


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:24 PM.

Main Menu
My LQ
Write for LQ
LinuxQuestions.org is looking for people interested in writing Editorials, Articles, Reviews, and more. If you'd like to contribute content, let us know.
Main Menu
Syndicate
RSS1  Latest Threads
RSS1  LQ News
Twitter: @linuxquestions
identi.ca: @linuxquestions
Facebook: linuxquestions Google+: linuxquestions
Open Source Consulting | Domain Registration