I agree with everything TobiSGD just wrote,
if anyone wants to test systemd with Alien Bob's work on KDE, please do so, also systemd for Slackware needs improvement, and we want to make sure it can run also with Alien Bob's KDE.

https://github.com/Dlackware

1 members found this post helpful.

ReaperX7, for your info I do like Slackware - but I will cease using it if Slackware adopts systemd. Just like I left Arch, Fedora, Debian, CentOS for the same reason. I have tried using systemd and I do not care for the way it functions, or its architecture. If a day comes where all of Linux uses systemd, well, I'll cease using it altogether.

I won't fork a Linux distro because I have no intent of contributing to GPL software. However, I have no problems forking FreeBSD if the time comes, as much of my infra depends on it now.

Dunno about a mass exodus or systemd; I think the sailing ship remark by Gazl [edit: sorry it was Didier] was spot on. Perhaps some hard work would be better than extra rum rations.

Having said that, I've been playing with Arch recently. It's a quite nice distro that certainly likes to keep things neat, though I sense the level of bonhomie on the Arch forum is not quite at the LQ level. Certainly more tense, to use the recent description, than the protypical Slacker attitude. Obviously never a handholding distribution will Arch be either, nor a place to run from systemd. But I like the latest software and running -current doesn't quite get that itchy spot I can't reach.

I say all this not to bore you all (that's merely a side effect), but because in my travels I noted the following sort of problem which has been discussed here previously and is unavoidable with a parallelizing init system. Basically, a race condition, see the last section of https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/NVIDIA under the title of "Xorg fails during boot, but otherwise starts fine"

A fix is provided, involving some mucking about with udev to make sure systemd doesn't start X before the Nvidia driver is started. Duh.

Is that a bug or a feature? You be the judge. Well, back to work.

2 members found this post helpful.

Oh my. I've been poked by the soft cushion.

2 members found this post helpful.

I tried to get over myself once. I laid down, but I was unable to achieve an out-of-body experience. I then realised I am trapped inside the twisted reality in my head.

Little debate goes into analyzing the pros/cons? This is, as I understand it, one of several long threads that have beat the topic to death. I've seen a number of reasonable points made regarding the pros. It appears you have not. There are also reasonable arguments on the con side.

I took some time (WAY more than I should have allotted) and read the entirety of this thread. There appears to be no reason to visit the previous ones based on the commentary that this thread rehashed the others.

I'm willing to accept change. Can't avoid it. Linux based operating systems have given me a job for a number of years, and I've enjoyed the opportunity. I owe a great deal to those that have put in the work to develop these systems, and greatly appreciate those efforts.

I work in the financial sector, in networking security. My workgroup also gets to work on developing/implementing the various systems we use for monitoring, logging, or whatever else we need. I really do love what I do. I couldn't ask for a better mix of challenges that I enjoy.

My feeling is that if systemd is something that can't be tolerated by a certain faction of the community, competing systems will evolve or perhaps be maintained. Our world is always changing. That's fine by me.

mmmnnnn...beer

This is the best answer systemd has turned into religion, the best answer is always to improvise, adapt, and overcome.

And I'm real sorry to hear that. Maltards and other mental floss I can deal with but soft cushions are way out of my league. I'll ask Jeremy to appoint a committee to determine the proper response. We're looking at probably twenty rules to combat this, depending on if it's the plain stuffy North-American Pillow or the much feared Eastern-Pacific Cushion. Of course if it's been recently cried upon, as I suspect, all bets are off...

5 members found this post helpful.

I was always partial to "crucify the leaders!" even though your solution is my tagline at OCN XD

How about a mass exodus from this thread?

5 members found this post helpful.

Unfortunately there is no way out of a black hole.

Let's just hope it doesn't absorb the whole Slackware forum

I never posted in this thread. ... o wait! Heeeelp!

1 members found this post helpful.

Is no distro safe? I think I will be going the way of the BSD or stay with LFS where I have a say what happends on my hardware, if slack gets infected.

I have avoided the following software like the plague because of the authors policy or attitude towards people with altenitive ideas.

- pluseAudio (JACK2 + JACKNET2)
- avahi (mDNS) (yes I know you can't use mDNS between subnets, if I wanted to I would give the device a dhcp address!)
- systemd (SysVinit + rsyslog + dcron + dhcpd + iptables + eudev + lxc)
- udev (eudev)

The way I see it, if enough people boycott these, RedHat's imperistic ventures will be well on there way to being over. No company should have direct say on how Linux is formed, the license is GPL not RHELPL (sorry have to pull a Microsoft with there MSPL). Linux doesn't belong to RedHat so why are they pulling the strings for every distro? Let RedHat deploy systemd, they can keep wayland too as far as I am concerned pn their own distro, I see no reason why Suse, Arch, Debian, now Slackware NEED to use it... Linux has been about choice for a long time, well what happened to it?

2 members found this post helpful.

Wayland isn't a problem - but Weston is because of udev dependency. I don't use udev, I use mdev currently on Slackware. It was a lot of work, and I can't run a full DE. Doesn't bother me one bit.

I've never been a huge fan of the GPL myself, so I'm at a perfect place to fully jump ship to BSD, but I'd rather not, because if I stop using Linux at home, I'm not going to use it at work. RedHat has its shareholders interest at heart, and so they're poised to take down Windows, and in the process they're turning to "the dark side" moreorless.

None of these distros need to use systemd. The distro developers just have chosen to use it (or set it as default, in Debian's case), which is totally up to them to do. Just as you have the choice to use distros that have chosen not to use systemd.

That you have the choice in Linux implicitly also gives distro developers the choice to decide how they develop their vision of how a Linux distro should look like. This includes all distros, those like Suse, Arch, ..., that have decided to opt for systemd, those distros that have decided against systemd, like CRUX or Slackware, and those distros that let the user decide which to use, like Gentoo, Void or Debian.
The problem is, at least for the distros that have not opted for systemd or to provide more than one option, that choice can only exist when there are actually more than one option. So to be able to make a choice the available options must be maintained, or new options must be developed, when not enough options are available.

Choice is not something that comes from nothing, choice must be worked for.

1 members found this post helpful.