i wonder if you read the OP before making this comment.

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I take particular issue with warnings being issued in some cases - warnings which are private and between the LQ member and the issuing moderator and public reprimand being used in others - with no clear reasoning (at least for the members on the receiving end) as to why one is preferred over the other in those particular circumstances?

If someone is pulled up over language, for example, whether privately or publicly, they should know why a certain response was used over the other.

From experience, I've been pulled up over language in the past, maybe three times, it was public. I've been pulled up for "trolling" a few years ago - that was almost certainly because the moderator in question was biased - I had simply made a parody of that moderator's favourite Linux distro. That minor misdemeanour warranted an actual infraction (which remains to this day).

I think Jeremy makes a good point in that this cannot be everything to everyone - so while it's not going to be an idiotic and banal "chat" free for all, it's certainly not ever going to be this utopia of professionalism and dryness that some of you want either.

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I still don't quite get why "professionalism" is seem by some as a bad thing, and it most certainly doesn't need to be associated with dryness. You can be relaxed, friendly, amusing, chatty and still have a professional attitude.

2 members found this post helpful.

I hadn't said that I see it as "a bad thing", just not a necessity for participating here. I must remind you that many of those posting are not necessarily professionals, but should not feel excluded by an atmosphere which they may not be familiar with.

Well, I'm certainly not a professional! I'm a hobbyist. But I gather a lot of other members are too.

Ok, I don't think that folk are understanding me very well here (not the first time that's happened of course ). I'm not saying that we have to be actual professionals, I'm saying that it's good to adopt a professional approach. For example, we should always remember that our aim is to answer questions and solve issues, that should be the focus, the number one priority of every technical thread, even if the poster we are replying to says something we don't like or agree with or is using a distro we don't like. You may say "that is obvious" but it is something that is oft forgotten.

Of course, there is an educational aspect too - we are showing people how to phrase questions, include relevant information, search the internet for responses, use LQ's CODE tags, make regular backups, etc., even though these may be ancillary to the actual question asked, and that's a good thing.

However, the key aspect is to try to be courteous and helpful, not to use LQ in order to project our internal frustrations and anger onto others. There are other forums that exist for that.

My tuppence anyway.

The problem is that everyone's definition of professional differs as wildly as their reasoning for being here and participating. Not everyone has the same reasons for being here as you or I. It can only be a good thing if you want to conduct yourself in such a manner, but I'm not sure if should hold it up a bar for others to strive to reach.

For example, I am not here as a volunteer tech support. Thus I do not see the need to maintain a "professional" approach. I am also not trying to lead anyone nor "educate". For me at least, a member with 5000 posts, years under their belt is no different to the person who joined the site today.

I will engage in thread which I find interesting and which cover a subject which I have at least some experience of. I will not dive into a thread on a subject I know nothing about, to try to "educate" someone on proper post construction or use of the forum search/search engine.

On your last paragraph we are in full agreement, not that it matters, but I also think a "customer services" approach towards someone who is simply being a first class dick head, is quite simply dishonest and patronising.

And by my definition "professionalism", on a medium such as this one, often encompasses that style or approach.

As with many free software project's mailing lists, this is not simply a "support channel" (my main point all along) and people are here for various reason - to get help, to give help or just interact with peers find new and interesting ways of doing things. The latter occurs when people are allowed to interact freely - even in the technical threads - and that's when you will see people going the extra mile.

For purely questions and answers, technical only and "professional", "there are other forums that exist for that" - most of them are called, "server", "stack", "fault", "exchange" something...

(Apologies to the OP for continuing to drag the thread off on this tangent...)

4 members found this post helpful.

I think it would be better to stop using the word "professional" when talking about this. It's too easy to misunderstand "act professional" as "act as if you're getting paid, even though you're not", which implies "act like a slave".

2 members found this post helpful.

Which word would you recommend as a replacement?

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I would have thought that we were more holistic and friendly in our approach than forums like that (which also have their place, don't get me wrong). In fact I know we are.

On your other point, if someone is genuinely being a first-class idiot, which doesn't happen very often in my experience, then the mods can deal with it. Entering into a flame war with the poster in question does no good at all.

On a positive point, I've noticed that our reactions to naïve newbie Kali users is better than it was before. I think that the sticky has done a great deal to help that, so thanks to the folks who put it together.

2 members found this post helpful.

I tried to exaggerate a post in order to prove a point.

Did no one get that?


Yes, the wording was disagreeable. The style was provocative.

Do you want a forum that lets members post like that?

From the response I'd say no.

1 members found this post helpful.

Oh for the love of God ...

This is not about semantics, word play, differing interpretations of ink blots. Act like decent human beings, stop being keyboard cowboys/smart-asses, speak/write as if you were in the presence of a well respected person (grandparent, priest, rabbi, monk etc....). We can do this even when someone is knowingly jerking our chains or trolling.

It really is not that difficult.

Heck, check the Linux News post from yesterday, even Linus is taking a break from maintaining the kernel to assess his attitude/behavior and how he relates/communicates with others.

2 members found this post helpful.

Apparently not, and it's also telling that no one who read it thought you weren't serious.
A few things:

• You are a moderator; you need to LEAD BY EXAMPLE.
• People can respond to posts or not, as they see fit. What you consider 'disagreeable', 'provocative', or 'disgusting' (from wording in another of your posts), won't be to others.
• We also don't want a forum where moderators send nasty PM's to members (in fairly large amounts), dole out infractions for made-up violations about how to be nice/posting content, or try to impose their OWN will on members, rather than enforcing the rules the site-owner has laid out.

You claimed in your post that the work-environment you had was something akin to a professionals-utopia; sorry, but it sounds like a place for mindless drones to flourish.

As you've told me pointedly in PM's, I can go to another forum. So can you.

4 members found this post helpful.

"LEAD BY EXAMPLE."

"it sounds like a place for mindless drones to flourish"

There you go folks.

ChuangTzu's suggestion of "decent" seems to fit:

walk into a bar?