Dual boot with Windows 10 with existing Linux Mint
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Distribution: Mint Cinnamon and LXLE + VirtualBox bunch
Posts: 35
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Originally Posted by yancek
I am not surprised that you needed the windows partition marked as active or bootable, that has historically always been necessary with windows but not with Linux.
I'm surprised that windows somehow removed your Mint install on a logical partition. It is possible to install windows on a logical partition but not without it's boot files on a primary partition so you would need to create a primary boot partition for windows or install the entire system on a primary partition including boot files.
I guess I expect any windows user to be aware of that and also, that partition was marked active in your GParted images. I would certainly expect that the windows installer would be able to do both, create an ntfs partition and mark it active. I last installed windows 10 about a year ago and used the custom install option and had 5 Linux distributions on the drive and none were overwritten. The MBR was of course, as expected but that was an easy fix.
Creating an ntfs partition from unallocated space (for example where you had LXLE) would then require an ntfs format and marking bootable/active since you would have had to delete the partition with LXLE first. Deleting the partition would also. I would not expect simply formatting the LXLE partition from a Linux filesystem to ntfs to do that but from your post, you have not done that. There was really no need to delete, you could have simply formatted sda1 ntfs rather than ext4. That's what I expect anyway. I don't pay much attention to active/boot because I don't really use windows.
Could you post an image from GParted? I'd be curious to know what your partitions look like now with both Mint and windows 10.
The Windows installer could handle all circumstances, when it came to its own wellbeing. It installed on an NTFS partition whether it was a reformatted or a new created, active or not active... and also installed on unallocated space (where it also created a system partition). But it was only when installed on an already boot flagged NTFS space it would leave the Mint partition alone... and not make the GParted output look like this: https://www.dropbox.com/s/veghv7u1ws...eted2.png?dl=0
If something had been overwritten by Windows in the installation, that wouldn't have seemed like a mystery to me. If everything beside it had been deleted I guess I could have seen some logic there too. But when the Mint volume was the only thing deleted and the space left empty... that was (and still is) more than I can see any logic in.
Linux is more and more becoming a first choice for me too, but I will still need Windows for some of my work purposes. The primary reason for this Windows installation is just to be a platform for Microsoft Office with VBA. It will still boot up with Linux first in the list.
Thanks for posting the images. Makes no sense to me but, I rarely install windows so don't really know what to expect. Since you have it the way you want now, all is good.
Distribution: Mint Cinnamon and LXLE + VirtualBox bunch
Posts: 35
Original Poster
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Originally Posted by yancek
Thanks for posting the images. Makes no sense to me but, I rarely install windows so don't really know what to expect. Since you have it the way you want now, all is good.
After this I will never assume that I have a clue about what to expect after a Windows installation either. That time is behind me.
I got curious about one thing you said though... multiple distributions. What would the result be if I instead shrinked the LXLE partition and installed Windows beside it? What would happen to the other two... or one... or none?
Windows beside the two might actually be a better idea if I can make that work. I do use LXLE from time to time and I don't need all that space for the Windows activities which this one will be used for.
I'm not really sure why you got the result you did, it's not what I would expect and I don't think that having two or more Linux systems would change anything. What I did when I installed windows 10 on a system with multiple Linux installs was to use an already existing ntfs partition which had been created in windows, changing the active partition from the already installed windows 7 partition to the new partition on which I wanted to install windows 10 then selecting the "Custom" install option when booting the windows 10 installer. Using the Custom option, I was able to select the partition I wanted because I knew the size. This installed windows and I was able to boot it. I then had to use a Linux Live usb to re-install Grub to the MBR on the Legacy system and was subsequently able to boot all Linux systems as well as both windows 7 and 10.
In your situation, sda1 with LXLE was marked active/bootable and I would have thought that simply formatting it prior to or during the install would have enabled you to install windows there and not bother Mint on the logical partition. You would have had to use a Mint DVD/iso to re-install Grub.
Installing windows to unallocated space in this situation was probably not the best idea as it would then create a new partition table during the windows install and windows generally does not include Linux partitions. This is a common problem with some windows 10 major updates also. This being the case, seeing the Mint partition as unallocated would not be unusual but I'm not sure why the swap partition was still seen.
If you want LXLE also, it should be easy enough to use Disk Management in windows to shrink windows and install it to the new unallocated space creating a primary partition there.r
Distribution: Mint Cinnamon and LXLE + VirtualBox bunch
Posts: 35
Original Poster
Rep:
Quote:
Originally Posted by yancek
I'm not really sure why you got the result you did, it's not what I would expect and I don't think that having two or more Linux systems would change anything. What I did when I installed windows 10 on a system with multiple Linux installs was to use an already existing ntfs partition which had been created in windows, changing the active partition from the already installed windows 7 partition to the new partition on which I wanted to install windows 10 then selecting the "Custom" install option when booting the windows 10 installer. Using the Custom option, I was able to select the partition I wanted because I knew the size. This installed windows and I was able to boot it. I then had to use a Linux Live usb to re-install Grub to the MBR on the Legacy system and was subsequently able to boot all Linux systems as well as both windows 7 and 10.
In your situation, sda1 with LXLE was marked active/bootable and I would have thought that simply formatting it prior to or during the install would have enabled you to install windows there and not bother Mint on the logical partition. You would have had to use a Mint DVD/iso to re-install Grub.
Installing windows to unallocated space in this situation was probably not the best idea as it would then create a new partition table during the windows install and windows generally does not include Linux partitions. This is a common problem with some windows 10 major updates also. This being the case, seeing the Mint partition as unallocated would not be unusual but I'm not sure why the swap partition was still seen.
If you want LXLE also, it should be easy enough to use Disk Management in windows to shrink windows and install it to the new unallocated space creating a primary partition there.r
I tried it last night, starting with the way I had any hopes for, and the shrink/add seemed to work just as fine as replacing. I got myself a Windows, a LXLE and a Mint (in that order) and with the earlier mentioned grub fix I got it all to work the way I hoped. But the GParted output told me that something wasn't right about it:
Today I tried again, to doublecheck, and the output showed the same thing. But when I instead did the shrinking from the right of the resize bar (placing Windows between the two Linux OS') it was no problem doing it and get it all working, with a GParted output that didn't raise questions: https://www.dropbox.com/s/he96yuent3...dows3.png?dl=0
So this last one might be what I really want to do have. I've done it without problems a couple of times and feeling optimistic about it, so now I think I'm done experimenting just for curiousity. I wonder how many times I have installed Windows these last few days. The configuration wizard is carved into my spine and I have done it a couple of times without taking my eyes from the TV.
The image you posted with Details from GParted indicates that the ntfs partition was not mounted and could not be as the two programs mentioned at the end of the output were not installed. Also, windows 10 defaults to hibernating and no Linux system will mount a hibernated filesystem partition. If you want to do anything from Linux on that partition, read write or use GParted, hibernation will need to be turned off.
I would not expect that it would be a problem having windows on sda3 rather than sda1 as both are primary partitions, shouldn't be. so I don't know what else might have been the problem.
Distribution: Mint Cinnamon and LXLE + VirtualBox bunch
Posts: 35
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The more I hear guys explain things to me, the clearer it becomes that I don't know that much myself... and the clearer my own limitations become, the harder it becomes to push the button. But finally I shut down VirtualBox and now I have that Windows installation where I want it... with the other stuff intact. https://www.dropbox.com/s/961kz8xq3x...nally.png?dl=0
So thank you guys for your time, your answers and not to forget the moral support.
Distribution: Mint Cinnamon and LXLE + VirtualBox bunch
Posts: 35
Original Poster
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Another question about this then:
Can I get these volumes to mount automatically when I start the computer? They start up as unmounted but as soon as I open them (in Computer), they get mounted... become drives in the file explorer and put shortcuts on the desktop.
You need entries in your /etc/fstab file to have the partitions mount on boot. There are hundreds of posts here at LQ many of which have examples. If you can't find any helpful, google should give you thousands. Google separately for windows partitions as the entries will be different. Usually, the major distros will mount ntfs on click in the /media directory. I would not modify any windows system files from Linux, potential problems with that.
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