First let me say that I have been using Dell hardware since it was called PCs Ltd (a screaming 80286 8 MHz machine). I have 2 Dimension 4600s, a Poweredge 400SC and an old Dimension XPS R450 running currently. Today I saw an offering on techbargains.com which I followed to the Dell site. Looks like quite a deal:

Insprion 530 (basic econobox)
Quad core 6600
4 GB 800 MHz RAM
500 GB SATA drive
DVR RW drive
128 MB video
Windoze XP Home
$689

So then I looked to see what I could get in a comparable Linux box. The same basic config based on a Vostro 400 (small business econobox) came to $1169.

Four hundred and eighty dollars more! Just to throw away the Windoze CD.

Gets better still... Found this little footnote "DVD-ROM drives may have write-capable hardware that has been disabled via firmware modifications." So for $70 Dell will not turn a DVD-RW into a DVD-ROM. Sounds like IBM back in the '70s.

End of rant.

Ken

That's awesome. We try to save money by using Linux, but get f*cked over in the end.

The Man always wins.

Brandon

Just rewrite the firmware on the drive to re-enable them. All you need is the manufacturer id and you are away.

Generally you just reflash and reboot. It does say on most manufacturers sites not to flash OEM drives, but if the drive in question is the same model as the retail one i'd happily reflash it.

Or alternatively just source a cheap dvd rewriter from newegg or similar.

The comparisons I have seen---and done myself--are much closer.

Dell has every right to set their marketing strategy and you have no obligation to deal with them. There are now several other companies selling Linux boxes in various price ranges--or you can build your own. (These are desktops, right?)

I was recently surprised and gratified that some of HP's "business" laptops have an option for no Windows--savings $75.

To complete the reality check, note that, if I counted my time at--let's say $1 per hour, I have lost a whole bunch of money switching to Linux. Was it worth it? Absolutely!!

Phew! For a second I thought that some day we'd have not only to rewrite the software, but to also create the hardware, but thanks v00d00101 for reminding that the hardware does what the software tells it to, so we're safe here.

You don't have to go with Dell, or any other company that does not meet your needs because they depend on the people, and not the other way around. And the people's decisions are creating the market.
So you don't fight with the companies - you fight with the people; the public opinion or standards (Linus would probably call it public stupidity / lack of knowledge / unconsciousness).

Another example like yours, taylorkh, could be BestBuy. I mean if you want to buy a PC with Linux OS on it, the hardware that goes with it is like from... B.C. (before calculators). At the same time any PC with any version of Windows OS is very up-to-date. And there are probably hundreds of such examples, but it matters little.
Just remember: don't yell at the companies, but at the people that make all these uneconomical decisions that distort the market.

My neighbor is a computer newbie, and I wasn't too surprised when she told me that they sold her a laptop with 512 MB RAM and Widows Vista on it...(I think the optimum for Vista is like 2 GB of RAM, so imagine the speed of this machine).
It's like with buying food that is only good for one day from the moment of purchase... It's cheap, but not very safe.

It looks like the fewer people know about what is better for them, the more control Microsoft has over the market (some people don't even know that there are other operating systems besides Windows, or even that there is something like an operating system on their computer). So sharing knowledge is pretty important.

I don't blame Dell for their marketing strategy, I simply take advantage of it. I have ALWAYS purchased a very minimal configuration from them and added my own components. My Poweredge server came with 128 MB RAM and a 40 GB drive for $299. I added 512 MB of RAM I had removed from one of the Dimensions when I upgraded it, the 80 GB drive from the Dimension (which was replaced with 2 Ultra 160 SCSI drives) and later added 2 x 360 GB SATA Barracudas from newegg. I have also "build" several PCs from scratch however I would rather buy a stripped down commercial box and add stuff.

As to the DVD-RW castrated into a DVD-ROM - I though that was hilarious. It reminds me of a story about IBM mainframe printers - I think in the late '60s. Basically IBM would lease the printer to a business for say $200 per month. It would print say 200 lines per minute. IBM would then provide "free" programming assistance to the business which generated the need for more printing capacity. The sales rep in his blue suit would tell the businessman "looks like you need another printer." The businessman groans - another $200 per month. Then the salesman says "wait - I just remembered there is a field upgrade available for your printer - it can be increased to 400 lines per minute and will only cost your $350 per month." This makes business sense so the businessman agrees - he saved himself $50/month. The IBM field engineer then simply shifts the drive belt in the printer to a different set of sheaves and increases the speed. $150 more profit for IBM at no additional cost.

Ken

Well it is common practice to castrate hardware. Like Intel blew a fuse in a 486DX (with numeric coprocessor) so it became a 486SX (without numeric processor)

And not just in computer technology, unbleached diapers and coffee filters for example are just not bleached during the manufacture. One step less right? yes, and the unbleached version is more expensive than the bleached exact equivalent.

Of course it is insane that a computer with the label Linux compatible is more expensive. I am afraid you just have to swallow and buy the Vista PC, reformat the HDD, and put the disc in your microwave.

jlinkels

I forgot about the 486SX. That was one of the better ones.

Ken

I'm looking for a Laptop to use Linux on.
So I'm Scrounging around all different types of sites looking for a decent priced one.
I was looking at Dell's Site and was messin with their Config setup and was noticing something else quite interesting.
Norton AntiVirus 90 day Trail comes with it {NO CHARGE}
But to remove it cost $10.00
As well as Trials of several other Programs, both added to SLOW your PC to a crawl at {NO CHARGE} but each one could be Removed for $10.00 a pop.
Nice setup all they have to do is NOT put them on when loading the HD and charge us $10.00 a pop to remove something they never put on to begin with.
Are they dealing with "SUCKERS"?
Yes most people would rather pay them $10.00 a pop to NOT put something on their HD while the PC is being loaded.
Instead of taking a Extra 20 minutes once they get the PC to uninstall them theirseleves.
And put on what they want....
As for the offerings of Linux Boxes yes I agree completely, BUT I've always built my own Desktop's.
I know that's not everyones Cup of JAVA so to speak But..
It's the BEST way to get a GREAT Linux Desktop at a very good price.

Now if there was only a GOOD way of building your own Linux Laptop we'd be in Business.... Cheaply that is....

And the RANT Continues...

It is more expensive for a manufacturer to pull a laptop out of the production process and not put windows on than putting in a standard HDD with windows.

It might comfort you to know that OEM windows licences cost does not even come close to the retail price of windows.

Check tuxmobile.org to find suitable laptops. I am very happy with my Lenovo.

jlinkels

How are you getting f*cked over???? Linux is free ; software is free ;My experience with most people is they are too lazy to do what it takes to learn linux.. Like install drivers for dvd , printers and other hardware. To install decoder software for windows mediaplayer is 90.00 dollars and when it breaks (AND IT WILL OVER AND OVER)) you will pay another 90 dollars each time... I just download and reinstall libdvdcss2 and wahla!!! starwars & icecream time;;; The cost 20 minutes.. Your car breaks , if you don't learn to fix it your self ,you pay 95.00 an hour to a mechanic that took the time to learn.. Same with computing ,but linux is free..And as far as The Man winning???? Umm Thats all about to change..They are now losing there greedy profits and running scared..Especially microsoft.....

Yes I heard that Lenovo are good..For the past 3.5 years I have been running Ubuntu on 5 Panasonic toughbook laptops P4 w/768 80gb HD's all are dualboot boxes with XP ,PCLinux2008 ,Ubuntu, DSL, knoppix,all run great..Ubuntu and pclos run the best..

Ummmmm--Why are we exhuming a 10-month old thread?? Whatever the situation was then, it is different now.

I am going to close this and suggest that the issue be taken up in a more recent thread--or, if none is found, start a new one.