The Faith & Religion mega Thread

Originally Posted by bluegospel You ask a lot of questions that I just don't have time to answer.

If you don't have the time to answer why are you making up a thread with a challenge to people for evidences of evolution? You should have known that you have no time beforehand.

You are just a troll, I will not answer to anything from you in this thread until you come up with some answers or the admission that you don't know the answers.

Originally Posted by bluegospel But the plan before the fallen angels, and before fallen man, was to give life to a specific number of human souls; as the plan for the married couple was three kids.

You're just making crap up. None of that is in the Bible.

Originally Posted by moxieman99 You're just making crap up. None of that is in the Bible.

Even if it would be it would just show up a failure of god's omniscience.

Originally Posted by bluegospel But the plan before the fallen angels, and before fallen man, was to give life to a specific number of human souls; as the plan for the married couple was three kids.

So I voted in the "firm believer" category and check this thread every now and then. Just saw someone quoting this line and I was like "whaaa.....????"

As a firm believer in Christ, I would also like to know where this came from. Not claiming that I know everything, but this sounds really sketchy. (Although from reading the last little bit of this thread, I doubt I'll get an answer).

Isn't Bryan Fischer's view about american standard ?

Originally Posted by spudgunner So I voted in the "firm believer" category and check this thread every now and then. Just saw someone quoting this line and I was like "whaaa.....????" As a firm believer in Christ, I would also like to know where this came from. Not claiming that I know everything, but this sounds really sketchy. (Although from reading the last little bit of this thread, I doubt I'll get an answer).

I doubt it's explicitly stated but it's intimated in passages like Deut 32:8, and Psalm 147:4

Originally Posted by bluegospel I doubt it's explicitly stated but it's intimated in passages like Deut 32:8, and Psalm 147:4

You are psychotic, Bluegospel. Here's the two passages. There's nothing "intimated" about specific numbers of souls or having three children. Face it, you are mentally ill if you read those passages to mean what you said:

He determines the number of the stars; he calls them all by their names. Psalm 147:4

When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel. Deut.32:8

Originally Posted by bluegospel I doubt it's explicitly stated but it's intimated in passages like Deut 32:8, and Psalm 147:4

I was gonna comment on this but then I had to go driving for work... someone beat me to it. I can kind of see how you get some of what you said out of those two verses (although I'm still hung up on the 3 children thing... reference for 3 children please?) if you take these verses as they are and really work on it, but if you take them in the context of the rest of the passage that they are found, your interpretation starts sounding a little silly.

Originally Posted by spudgunner I was gonna comment on this but then I had to go driving for work... someone beat me to it. I can kind of see how you get some of what you said out of those two verses (although I'm still hung up on the 3 children thing... reference for 3 children please?) if you take these verses as they are and really work on it, but if you take them in the context of the rest of the passage that they are found, your interpretation starts sounding a little silly.

Unless you want to start equating souls to stars and the children of Israel to the number three (there being more than three stars) -- neither of which is in the Bible -- you, spud, are almost as wacko as Bluegospel.

Originally Posted by moxieman99 Unless you want to start equating souls to stars and the children of Israel to the number three (there being more than three stars) -- neither of which is in the Bible -- you, spud, are almost as wacko as Bluegospel.

I personally do not equate souls to stars, especially given this particular context, but seeing as how the lots of people interpret the Bible different ways, I understand the possibility (although I think it's wrong). I'm also not equating the children of Israel to 3 (12!=3, unless I missed something in math class), and am still waiting on some sort of explanation where this particular number of 3 children per married couple comes from/how he came to this conclusion.

Originally Posted by spudgunner I personally do not equate souls to stars, especially given this particular context, but seeing as how the lots of people interpret the Bible different ways, I understand the possibility (although I think it's wrong).

If the bible were "the true words of god", it shouldn't and wouldn't be open to human interpretation. What we've seen over the last 2000 years is the constant process of reinterpretation of the bible to go with the current state of (historical/scientific)knowledge of particular times. I think (I might be wrong here) the general direction over the last couple of hundred of years is to interpret the bible in a less and less literal way trying to assign some metaphorical meaning to the bits that might not conform to moral standards of the times. As far as I'm concerned, it's a work of literary fiction, alongside with the Greek myths, etc.

Originally Posted by sycamorex If the bible were "the true words of god", it shouldn't and wouldn't be open to human interpretation. What we've seen over the last 2000 years is the constant process of reinterpretation of the bible to go with the current state of (historical/scientific)knowledge of particular times. I think (I might be wrong here) the general direction over the last couple of hundred of years is to interpret the bible in a less and less literal way trying to assign some metaphorical meaning to the bits that might not conform to moral standards of the times. As far as I'm concern, it's a work of literary fiction, alongside with the Greek myths, etc.

The interpretation has definitely been changing with the times, there's no question about that. I can't really provide any more answers or explanations about these changes as I haven't studied the changes throughout history.

Originally Posted by moxieman99 You are psychotic, Bluegospel. Here's the two passages. There's nothing "intimated" about specific numbers of souls or having three children. Face it, you are mentally ill if you read those passages to mean what you said: He determines the number of the stars; he calls them all by their names. Psalm 147:4 When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel. Deut.32:8

"the number of the children of Israel" in the second passage is also interpreted "the number in his heavenly court," as for example in the New Living Translation; in the Dead Sea Scrolls, "the number of the Sons of God"; in the Greek, "the number of the angels of God."

"Angels/Sons of God" are quite often designated as "stars." "Sons of God," are used interchangably to speak of the descendants of Adam's son Seth (or Jews/Christians), or of angels.

It's clear in Scripture God thinks of his people as his children. It's natural to make the association I made.

As for the insult, oh well. Even Jesus' close family thought him mad at at least one point. If the Lord of creation can be ridiculed, how much more a poor wretch like me!

I'm Agnostic

Originally Posted by bluegospel "the number of the children of Israel" in the second passage is also interpreted "the number in his heavenly court," as for example in the New Living Translation; in the Dead Sea Scrolls, "the number of the Sons of God"; in the Greek, "the number of the angels of God." "Angels/Sons of God" are quite often designated as "stars." "Sons of God," are used interchangably to speak of the descendants of Adam's son Seth (or Jews/Christians), or of angels. It's clear in Scripture God thinks of his people as his children. It's natural to make the association I made. As for the insult, oh well. Even Jesus' close family thought him mad at at least one point. If the Lord of creation can be ridiculed, how much more a poor wretch like me!

Here's your problem, Blue: You are slathering human desires and interpretations and wishful thinking onto the word of God and then claiming that that whole thing is the word, without bothering to note the distincition between God's word and man's.

Sing and dance all you want, but there is nothing in the Bible about God's plan being to create a specific number of souls, nor people to have three children. You lied.

That, of course, leaves out the entire question of whether the Bible is God's word (I say "No."), but let's remove man's accretions before we talk about what God said, or says.

As for ridicule, the difference is this: Jesus removed human attachments to God's word. You, on the other hand, are saying stupid things and attributing them to God. Know your place.