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Old 02-27-2024, 07:33 PM   #766
sundialsvcs
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You can call it a "rant" if you like, but I don't think so and I don't intend it as such.

I am very simply stating that we actually know far less about "how this planet works" than we might like to admit. But, the sooner we admit it to ourselves, the better off we will all be. A very significant part of "science" ought to always consist of "wonder." Because this place really is – as the song says – "a wonderful world." Which we do not understand.
 
Old 02-27-2024, 09:50 PM   #767
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In all fairness, sundialsvcs, your statement is basically so but I think we must be cautious about such generalities because it isn't as if we know nothing, and we have over a million years of progress in accumulating knowledge and building on that progress. For example, Earthbound Physics is extremely well understood, partly because there are so few variables. Biology and all it's subsets are very well understood, down to the molecular, atomic, and to some degree the sub-atomic levels. There is certainly more to know but what we do know is by no means trivial. Even things with a vast amount of variables, like Climate and Weather have seen very substantial gains.

I know I'm older than most here, but I recall when Weather reports even on same day basis was very hit or miss. In 2024, we get very accurate reports on an hourly basis and pretty darn reliable on a 10 day basis. We've mapped every inch of Planet Earth including the ocean floor and with ice cores, geology, etc. have a solid grasp on billions of years of Earth's History. Again, this is not trivial, and what's more, with modern computing and communication, we have access to a nearly unimaginable amount of this vast mount of knowledge at our fingertips.

A testament to all of the above is that at least 3 schoolkids, one in your home state of Tennessee at age 12, have built nuclear fusion reactors in their parent's homes from information they learned on the Internet. Especially when we have numbers of people doubting that the Earth is even essentially spherical (oblate spheroid) and/or only 6000-10,000 years old I think it behooves us to not trivialize what progress Mankind has made.

Perhaps the 1st job of Science is somewhat trivial since it is "only" curiosity and imagination, but immediately following that is where the first order of business resides, trying with all our resources to disprove it. Across-the-board, offhand skepticism without putting in the work is useless.
 
Old 02-28-2024, 06:02 AM   #768
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I think today's fortune cookie kind of summed up the attitude sundialsvcs holds on many topics
Quote:
There is no TRUTH. There is no REALITY. There is no CONSISTENCY.
There are no ABSOLUTE STATEMENTS I'm very probably wrong.

Last edited by business_kid; 02-28-2024 at 06:12 AM.
 
Old 03-06-2024, 10:54 AM   #769
leclerc78
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https://news.slashdot.org/story/24/0...ough-in-the-us

computer chip manufacturing in the US could fuel demand for dirty energy…
 
Old 03-06-2024, 11:07 AM   #770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leclerc78 View Post
https://news.slashdot.org/story/24/0...ough-in-the-us

computer chip manufacturing in the US could fuel demand for dirty energy…
Which could mostly be met on-site if the parking and structure were covered in solar power collection. Even driveways and sidewalks can be collectors. That much collection might well be able to supply a majority of the power required by the plant using ONLY clean energy, and pay for itself within five years!
 
Old 03-06-2024, 11:41 AM   #771
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Quote:
solar power collection... power required by the plant using ONLY clean energy,
So what about night time and clouds? You need a nice steady source of energy for this operations.... Not just when the sun shines and the wind blows . Same with silicon production, you can't just stop the power during silicon rod making. So it goes. I see the man made climate change theory (cooling/warming depending on political winds) is still the rage ...

Last edited by rclark; 03-06-2024 at 11:42 AM.
 
Old 03-06-2024, 07:18 PM   #772
wpeckham
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rclark View Post
So what about night time and clouds? You need a nice steady source of energy for this operations.... Not just when the sun shines and the wind blows . Same with silicon production, you can't just stop the power during silicon rod making. So it goes. I see the man made climate change theory (cooling/warming depending on political winds) is still the rage ...
#1 That is why I did not say that it would supply ALL of their power.
#2 in the area I live there is a perfectly calm period of an hour or more exactly three days out of a year on the average. Recent years, possibly due to climate change, have been more windy than the long term average. Also STACK turbines generate power even in a dead calm!
#3 Good solar collection generates some power during the dark of night as long as the sky is clear, and if it is cloudy there is wind.
#4 I never said they would disconnect from the grid. If they generate more power than needed it can go to the grid, and when they under-perform on power they can pull from the grid. This is how most current business work that have on-site generation.
#5 If you really want more detail about how this all works, ask some of the people who live in countries that have made it their standard. They made it work, and work well, and save energy, save money, and save carbon. We in the USA look pretty primitive and slow by comparison when it comes to green energy and efficient heating and cooling.

This is not hard, or rocket science, it is being done. We just need to do MORE of it and apply it to these factories.

PS: I visited Springfield Arms several years ago, and the entire parking lot was covered by solar. Most of the business office are powered entirely with their on-site solar. (The offices that are not normally used at midnight, i suppose.) IF they can make it work, so can others.
 
Old 03-07-2024, 07:00 AM   #773
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No need to do the Maths. The approach here is to sell your 'Green' power (Solar or wind) to the grid when the power is there, and buy from the grid when your power vanishes. As long as you generate more than you sell, you can be viewed as 'Carbon Neutral.'
 
Old 03-27-2024, 10:39 AM   #774
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpeckham View Post
[url]https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-09-07/california-s-wine-industry-faces-climate-tipping-point [url]
This is a major US crop, and critical to the economy.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9914188/ Rice is imported to the USA and is an important food staple, but it is a critical food component for half of the world population! https://climate.nasa.gov/news/3124/g...a-study-finds/ General grain crops such as wheat and corn/maize are in trouble, but not yet critical. Critical may be reached in less than ten years. If you wait until you are starving to react it will be too late. These crops are not only directly food, but also the food sources for our domestic meat animals!...


Quote:
Originally Posted by wpeckham View Post
The article is from 2021. We are seeing effects predicted for 2030 already NOW. ...
Not in any major exported field crop and most people suffering hunger are in war zones or areas that already suffer periodic drought.

The study to which your link refers is behind a paywall so I only looked at the abstract but if corn production is going to start a precipitous fall in yield by 2030, "declines becoming apparent by 2030,", it better get on with it or studies such as this one will start to look like some of Al Gore's more 'fantabulous' climate predictions of 20-30 years ago. I've said repeatedly that there has to be an 'upper limit' to production but most major crops show no sign of slowing down.
I'm sure wine is important to California and the 1/2M people in the industry but if you look at it in perspective it's 1.5B year in exports pales in comparison to the 50+B we export in corn and soy products

"U.S. soy complex exports—whole soybean, soybean meal and soybean oil—added $39.8 billion to the U.S. economy in marketing year (MY) 2022/2023 on a volume of 67.6 million metric tons (MMT). The shining star: U.S. soybean meal exports broke records for both volume and value at 13.2 MMT and $6.91 billion, respectively." https://www.feedstuffs.com/market-ne...conomy-in-2023

"U.S. Corn Exports in 2023 Total Export Value $13.14 Billion 3-Year Average $16.78 Billion"
https://fas.usda.gov/data/commodities/corn


"Total U.S. wine exports in 2022 reached $1.463 billion, a slight increase of 0.4% in value from the previous year."
https://wineinstitute.org/press-rele...ts-and-the-eu/


Not only did the U.S. set a new per acre production record for corn in 2023 (177.3), so did the Worlds second leading Country - China.
"In 2023, China experienced a record corn production of 288.84 million mt, up 4% on the year, according to the National Bureau of Statistics, erasing early concerns that extreme heat and typhoons have damaged crops in key producing regions. Jan 3, 2024", and No. 3: "Projections indicate total corn production in Brazil for the 2022/23 crop year will be a record 4.9 billion bushels (equivalent to 125 million tons), an increase of 10 percent over last year. The total includes the first, second, and third crops. The United States produced 13.7 billion bushels (equivalent to 348 million tons) of corn in one crop in 2022, almost three times that of Brazil, according to data from the USDA." https://farmdocdaily.illinois.edu/20...ng-nation.html

Maize production in China between 2013 and 2023(in million metric tons)
2013 - 218.5
2023 - 288.84
https://www.statista.com/statistics/...tion-in-china/

"In the 2023/24 global rice market, production was lowered 340,000 tons to 517.8 million, still the highest on record. ...Total global rice supplies in 2023/24 are projected at 692.6 million tons, up 1.6 million tons from the previous forecast, mostly due to a higher carryin estimate for India." https://www.ers.usda.gov/webdocs/out...%20for%20India.
 
Old 04-07-2024, 10:53 AM   #775
leclerc78
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‘Simply mind-boggling’: world record temperature jump in Antarctic raises fears of catastrophe

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...e_iOSApp_Other
 
Old 04-07-2024, 05:01 PM   #776
enorbet
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Here's an analog to ponder. Let's assume for the sake of a fantasy argument that you are by far the most wealthy and powerful person on Planet Earth. The roof on your home covers most of an entire county. You kitchen is the size of 2 football fields. How long do you suppose you can defecate on the kitchen floor before it becomes a problem?

This isn't just about climate. It's about population numbers who still employ what passes for waste management from 100-200 years ago or more when Earth's population was 1/3rd or less than it is now..

Last edited by enorbet; 04-07-2024 at 05:03 PM.
 
Old 04-07-2024, 10:21 PM   #777
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I belong to a group that consists mostly of University educated people, sadly not a single one - except me of course - cares about the world. I asked, and some of the best answer is 'I will die long before that day'. And they have kids and grand-kids.
 
Old 04-10-2024, 03:27 AM   #778
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rclark View Post
So what about night time and clouds?
There's a 150 megawatt battery in South Australia: https://hornsdalepowerreserve.com.au/ It is charged by solar panels and wind farms. There is a live data graph which shows you when it is charging and discharging.

I'd suspect that the reason this isn't done in America can be found in this little nugget on that website: "In 2019 the battery reduced electricity costs by $116M through the provision of Frequency Control Ancillary Services (FCAS). Thanks to HPR, average Regulation FCAS costs have been reduced by more than 90% meaning major savings for all South Australian energy consumers."

It can be done. They don't want you to believe it.
 
  


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