Novel execs destroying a great distribution

KimVette · 11-09-2005, 03:34 PM

Check this out:

http://www.crn.com/sections/breaking...leId=173600703

Quote:

Suse Linux Founder Exits Novell

By Paula Rooney, CRN
1:19 PM EST Wed. Nov. 09, 2005
Suse Linux founder Hubert Mantel announced his resignation from Novell Tuesday in a mass e-mailing.
Mantel said in a brief letter, sent to recipients in a Suse mailing list, that he could no longer work for the company, which acquired Suse in January 2004.
"Too late for me. I just decided to leave Suse/Novell," Mantel wrote. "This is no longer the company I founded 13 years ago."
A Novell spokeswoman confirmed Mantel’s resignation but gave no further details. “We can confirm that Hubert Mantel has tendered his resignation to Novell. However, this departure does not impact Novell's Linux strategy or our ability to execute on that strategy,” she said in an e-mailed statement.
Mantel's exit is the latest executive departure from Novell’s Nuremberg, Germany-based Suse unit. In October, former Novell EMEA (Europe, Middle East and Asia) and Suse channel chief Petra Heinrich announced her exit and took a new position at Open-Xchange, an open-source e-mail company based in Germany. And in May, former Novell EMEA president and onetime Suse president Richard Seibt left Novell.
Mantel said Novell likely will fill his role at Suse, which was similar to those of Linus Torvalds and Andrew Morton in the development of the Linux kernel. Mantel also indicated that he sent his letter of resignation to Novell's upper management.
"I have been the maintainer of the Suse kernel for more than a decade now," Mantel wrote. "I'm very confident the Novell management will find a competent successor very quickly. After all, there are lots of extremely skilled people over there in the Ximian division."
Mantel’s departure also comes less than a week after Novell announced a major restructuring that would result in 600 layoffs. It’s unclear if Mantel's resignation is related to the restructuring.

Novell's latest moves seem to be designed to destroy the distribution. As it is, their decision to dump KDE from SuSE has already prompted me to begin revisiting Mandriva as a solution for both internal use and for product (preconfigured computers, both workstation and server). I was very interested in selling SuSE-powered computers, but not when Novell execs are seemingly intentionally destroying what was up through 9.3 an excellent (possibly the best) Linux distribution. I'm not going to offer customers a solution whose future in in question.

{edit: OOo 2.0 gold just became available (wasn't there Monday when I checked), OOo rant deleted}

fouldsy · 11-09-2005, 03:43 PM

Do seem like quite sad times. I started out with Linux using SuSE 6.2, started out working on the SuSE helpdesk a few years back, and implemented it widely across servers + workstations in my current role. There just doesn't seem the stability with them anymore. For all the PR spin is trying to keep things moving, looks like they're moving more to the Enterprise servers + desktops and forgetting about SuSE's roots on the home desktop. It's a shame as SuSE used to be distro I'd recommend to many new users, but Ubuntu has had that honour recently, and it seems that OpenSuSE was the way of Novell saying "Right, here you go. Do what you want, we're not intereseted."

Of course, you don't know what Novell have planned, how much in the news is accurate and how much is opinion of the writer, especially with many places simply quoting each other, something I dislike when the sources are personal blogs. I just hope all the work so many people have put in for so many years doesn't end up fragmented and dis-jointed. Maybe the replacement will help focus SuSE again, or maybe OpenSuSE will become more apparent + structured. I hope one of the two comes soon!

Pcghost · 11-09-2005, 04:00 PM

Novell is famous for screwing things up. As long as opensuse continues to keep KDE susified I will keep using it. If I see all opensuse effort being focused on Gnome I won't look back and will use Kubuntu exclusively for my desktop needs. Currently all Novell is saying is they are standardizing on Gnome for SLES and NLD, neither of which I use or care about.

Don't be stupid Novell. Prove everyone wrong just this once please.

xbennyboy · 11-09-2005, 07:28 PM

They're not getting rid of KDE, nor are they gonna de susefy it. KDE has always been SuSE's biggest selling point. Their version of KDE is by far the best. I don't think that after putting all that effort into KDE they're just gonna abandon it. I mean that's just stupid.

bigrigdriver · 11-09-2005, 09:46 PM

Guess it's time to start looking for another distro.

I've been through this before. You find a distro you like: few if any problems, while it seems users of other distros have nothing but problems. Then comes the merger, and your distro goes belly-up (I used to favor OpenLinux until SCO took over and did a header off the high board into an empty pool and splattered their brains). I searched for two weeks before settling on SuSE.

Now that may be going down the drain. It remains to be seen what becomes of OpenSuSE. I'll keep watching; I'll also keep searching for an alternative I can live with.

reddazz · 11-10-2005, 03:04 AM

The problem here is that if SLES and NLD are going to be based on GNOME, there could be less emphasis placed on improving KDE in the Suse/OpenSuse project. Apparently quite a few KDE devs have left (allegedly ousted) Novell, so it seems like Suse may suffer in the long run. I have been a long term fan of Suse, but if this whole saga continues, I am going to move back to Mandriva permanently, at least they support KDE and GNOME reasonably well without too much bias to either one.

onjoo · 11-10-2005, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by reddazz
The problem here is that if SLES and NLD are going to be based on GNOME, there could be less emphasis placed on improving KDE in the Suse/OpenSuse project.

This is what I'm really being afraid of... KDE rocks, although Gnome has been getting better, KDE applications and the thingy in general just works better atleast for me.

All these key people leaving Suse will affect the distro, but I guess Novell is just implementing their new business strategy and i hope we are going towards in this process.

I have to admit, after Novell got Suse some things have really improved. One good example would be the Opensuse and open sourcing the whole distro. Ok by this Novell can kick some more people off the lists, but I hope it will help SUSE to become even better.

Then there are things like NLD , crippled version of great distro. I don´t like the idea of NLD at all. If this is going to be the future of suse, Im going to change my distro.

Suse main benefits are easy-to-use feeling all over the place big thanks to KDE and YAST. My reasons to choose Suse have been great features and good package selection. If we are going to see a Gnome based Suse in the near future with lack of support and packages as in no eval versions, only open source edition. Thats bye bye Suse.
Mantel leaving from Suse I can understand, but i guess it won´t affect the distro in any way.
Kernel in Suse has always just been there, hey come on, how many normal suse users really make their own kernels? Maybe will be getting now the newest versions of kernel with YOU , not just the small patches.

TigerLinux · 11-10-2005, 07:58 AM

too sad.
but gnome is not a bad choice too.

broch · 11-10-2005, 08:06 AM

Well the one thing left for me is going back to slackware, now when slamd64 is available and suse 10.0 is a disaster I don't see much choice left.
For me Gnome is ugly and slow, so I will stay with KDE.

RedShirt · 11-10-2005, 08:26 AM

I think many people are entirely misinterpretting the message.

From the Computer World which arrived at my office yesterday they had interviews with SuSE's new CIO, who mentioned that specifically this whole reorg is deisgned to refocus more efforts into Linux. They aren't taking anything they currently have away. For SLES, yes they are changing the DEFAULT Desktop from KDE to Gnome, but they are not getting rid of KDE, nor are they going to cease KDE development. This means KDE will still be available, and supported, even on SLES, but will still be the default on desktop versions of SuSE.
They felt they needed to refocus their goals, and linux came out as a higher priority than before. I feel this is a very good thing, my self. Good for linux, and good for those of us using SuSE.

reddazz · 11-10-2005, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by RedShirt
I think many people are entirely misinterpretting the message.

From the Computer World which arrived at my office yesterday they had interviews with SuSE's new CIO, who mentioned that specifically this whole reorg is deisgned to refocus more efforts into Linux. They aren't taking anything they currently have away. For SLES, yes they are changing the DEFAULT Desktop from KDE to Gnome, but they are not getting rid of KDE, nor are they going to cease KDE development. This means KDE will still be available, and supported, even on SLES, but will still be the default on desktop versions of SuSE.
They felt they needed to refocus their goals, and linux came out as a higher priority than before. I feel this is a very good thing, my self. Good for linux, and good for those of us using SuSE.

This contrasts a recent comment made by a Novell exec on eweek.

KimVette · 11-10-2005, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by RedShirt
This means KDE will still be available, and supported, even on SLES, but will still be the default on desktop versions of SuSE.

Where did you hear or read that? Everything I've read indicates that Gnome will be the default desktop, but "the KDE libraries will be available" - for all anyone knows, based on those quotes they'll provide Qt and KDE-libs and that's about it - because from the wording in everything I've read about the changes at Novell that is what is being implied.

Quote:

Originally posted by onjoo
Kernel in Suse has always just been there, hey come on, how many normal suse users really make their own kernels? Maybe will be getting now the newest versions of kernel with YOU , not just the small patches.

Anyone who runs the latest chipsets, anyone who wants an optimized kernel, and anyone who upgrades to the latest bleeding-edge x.org is going to be modifying and recompiling the kernel.

RedShirt · 11-10-2005, 11:53 AM

I just did my own kernel, and plan to do it every major version.

Back to the issue though, as I said in ComputerWorld which comes to my office, they did an interview with the new management at SuSE, and some of the major customers, about all these stories. He talked about the vision and goal of the layoffs and reorgs, as part of a larger restructuring and refocus. They focus heavily on the SLES impact to larger customers, and managemnt.

I wish, I wish I hadn't tossed that magazine after I was done yesterday, the janitor is too efficent. There was another article right below the 2nd page of this one, which I did, however, find it online: Users Reamin Loyal the Novell Despite Turmoil
The box article talked more about changes to Linux than the management.
This Sidebar isn't the one I was looking for, but is interesting.

I found 2 others detailing the changes: Novell Customers Concerned about Layoffs, Prise Roadmap and
Novell Details Layoffs, Restructing Plan.

Quote:

The cuts are part of a wider restructuring designed to focus Novell's product development and consulting resources on areas such as Linux and open-source technology, as well as identity and resource management software.

Quote:

Also last week, Novell named Ron Hovsepian president and chief operating officer and gave him direct responsibility for product development, marketing, sales and services. Hovsepian, 44, is a former IBM executive who joined Novell in June 2003. He had been head of global sales and services since last May. The No. 2 slot that he is filling at Novell had been vacant since former Vice Chairman Chris Stone left the company last November.

"Novell did need to do something at the leadership level," said Gartner Inc. analyst John Enck. "There's been quite an absence since Chris Stone left."

"Hovsepian has overseen results in the North American sales force, and with Messman getting older, it will be good for Novell to have somebody as good as Hovsepian in place," said James Taylor, president of The East Cobb Group Inc., a Marietta, Ga.-based integrator of Novell products.

unionjak · 11-10-2005, 12:47 PM

hello,
just my two pence worth...its not good that novell are in a position to have to lay people off and it certainly isnt good for the people themselves. However, if it means that suse 10 will become 11, 12 etc then hard decisions are being made for the long term future of not just suse, but novell as well. As for gnome becoming the default anything let alone destop for suse 10 etc is just plain wrong.

zostrianos447 · 11-10-2005, 01:50 PM

I think it makes sense to set up Gnome as the default desktop for an enterprise os, just as I think it makes sense that most home users like KDE as the default. KDE (using a default install) has alot of bloat that is not absolutely needed to administer a server or business desktop. I personally prefer blackbox as a default desk for all of my linux needs. It is sleek, has low memory requirements and with the proper libraries installed can run just about any KDE or Gnome application. And, as I'm sure you all know, there are more than a few servers setup with no X at all, pure command line for apache, mysql and php. So.... whatever, all it takes for an install to KDE is choosing the right radio button when it asks you which desktop to install. Boo hoo, cry me a river. If a person cant be bothered to read a few sentences and then "point and click" then fork out the money for windows (I know I have!)

I've been using SuSE for about 4 years off and on (depending on what hardware fancies my tastes at the time) and I keep coming back when I want linux running on my rig. It's easy to install, stable, and a person is not required to edit a heaping pile of config files or "make > World" Hopefully SuSE will continue to create a top notch linux distro that pleases both the enterprise and the home users.

I will say that I'm a bit pissed about not being able to get my new graphics card configured under SuSE. This is probably the DEFACTO reason that linux will always be chugging along right behind windows as the OS for multimedia and entertainment on the desktop.

Thermaltake Xaser III
Thermaltake Silent PurePower 480 Watt
ABIT AI7 rev.19
Intel Pentium 4 3.4E
1024 MB PC3200 DDR
250GB Hitachi Deskstar SATA (x2) RAID0
ATI Radeon X850XT
Creative Audigy2 ZS Platinum
NEC ND-2510A DVD +/- RW
Linksys WMP54GS
Belkin 900VA
SuSE 9.3 Professional
Windows XP Professional SP2