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View Poll Results: You are a...
firm believer 173 28.41%
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Old 01-29-2016, 04:35 AM   #5446
jamison20000e
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Many's fear of the (unavoidable) future is from trusting\learning *** and not "truth!."

Tinkerbell can not fly (this is kids #!is((yes, unless they're named "Tinkerbell" and controls some apparatus.?!)))

The Atheist Experience - matt dropping logic bombs on callers https://youtu.be/15a3EQgmnXA LOL by the way!

Edit by date: if you think your stories are the true religions because their some of the oldest, then you weren't taught how to reason? Tho, we're all human so only stories... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reason

Last edited by jamison20000e; 02-08-2016 at 08:17 PM.
 
Old 02-09-2016, 11:38 AM   #5447
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How come this cartoon is still valid threat? So if we live friendly life and help others we still count as sinners and go to hell? I really hope there are third options then cause if Heaven and Hell is like that then i rather choose none! Also average human can do nothing about sin removal or fix or whatever.

Last edited by Arcane; 02-09-2016 at 11:40 AM. Reason: typo
 
Old 02-09-2016, 01:55 PM   #5448
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Frankly, the entire "you're damned from the get-go" thing strikes me as a very-Roman Empire version of "the carrot or the stick." If this "all-loving God" absolutely cannot stand the notion that you might screw-up, why didn't He change the design of human beings ... and/or why did He create them in the first place? Etcetera.

We live our entire lives surrounded by morons who screw-up ... just like we do. Somehow, we manage to put up with it. Why can't He? Especially when we "were His idea to begin with?"

Whups. Something just flipped the BOZO bit, and it's not turning off anytime soon.

Frankly, to me it simply smells of (Roman) Imperial crowd-control. A convenient way to corral the plebeians who, as a rule, were illiterate. The mere fact that someone was "reading a book" would have lent quite an air of authority to them, and by-and-large people love rituals anyway. They also love to be right, and to exercise control over other people, and to condemn other people.

Quite a contrast to: "Neither do I condemn you. Go, and sin no more."

Most disturbing to me was when author Tim LaHey (sp?) made a ton of cash from his "Left Behind" series. Dreadful as the thought may seem, there obviously were a lot of people who loved the idea of them (of course, of course ...) sitting on the celestial bleachers while "the rest of the world 'got theirs,'" even relishing the gruesome notion of "rivers of blood rising as high as a horse's bridle." (At "5 pints apiece," you do the math.) Of course, it never occurred to them that they might be the ones "left," nor that presumably billions of other human beings would be suffering so extremely. That, to me, is bloodthirsty pandering to brutal, craven thoughts of vengeance, and: "well, that's certainly not the voice of my Shepherd."

Anyhow ... I have little use for such things, and such thoughts. I have my own ideas about God and deities, and they/He "are certainly not like that!"

So, if I turn out to be wrong, just remember who's "keeping the light on for ya, down in the furnace room," when you turn a celestial switch on your way to your singing lessons. You tell the Eternal Narcissist how incredibly great He is, just as you've been doing every hour of every endless day for the last umpty-zillion years , and meanwhile I'll be listening to heavy metal.

Hell might be hot, but at least it's honest.

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 02-09-2016 at 02:12 PM.
 
Old 02-09-2016, 02:38 PM   #5449
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I'm sorry:

Twenty first century "sin," we still just make it up as we go!. Some are: Amish, Ethiopian, English-teachers, lairs, followers(leaving (like your video) ignorant little circular pamphlets laying around as litter for me to throw-out,) Kardashians, Dilbert-fans, someone who tries a different religion every 10 years and believes them all, someone who tries a different religion every 10 years and doesn't believe any of them, &c...\https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religions_and_spiritual_traditions ...and, why is that? See no speak no hear no

Last edited by jamison20000e; Today at 10:42 AM.
 
Old 02-09-2016, 06:23 PM   #5450
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Actually, I have n-o problem ... no problem whatsoever ... with "spiritual traditions." I fully recognize these to be a fundamental part of human life "since, well, forever." Therefore, I do not condemn these practices.

However, I do condemn and reject ... any and every interpretation of those traditions, which "condemns and rejects" any other person ... damns them to Hell with neither escape nor even a fair trial, and makes their life on Earth utterly miserable in so doing.

When I see one person doing that, to any other person, no matter what his "justification" may be ... "this is not the voice of my shepherd," and therefore I shall not choose to follow ... nor, frankly, to have anything whatsoever to do with, that insufferable, self-sanctimonious a*shole him or her.

... and if, someday, I find myself toasting in a very-hot place for a very-long time, then, c'est la guerre.

Meanwhile:
Quote:
"Brother (Sister), I have no idea if you are bound for Hell or not. ("Do I look like God to you?") Meanwhile, is there something I can do for you now, while you are here and I am here too?"
Yeah, I like the sound of that. Yeah, I like it much, much better. That sounds like a familiar voice that would prompt me to move across a pasture.

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 02-09-2016 at 06:25 PM.
 
Old 02-10-2016, 05:55 AM   #5451
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sundialsvcs View Post
Frankly, the entire "you're damned from the get-go" thing strikes me as a very-Roman Empire version of "the carrot or the stick."
Amen to that!

I'm reminded of a conversation I had a while ago with someone who believed that not only will those who don't "make it" end up in a fairly "traditional"-sounding Hell, but God had actually chosen to send certain people there by not influencing them in the other direction. Perhaps because I'm a fairly pathetic debater, I didn't make what later seemed the obvious point: if he was right then God appears to want me to go to Hell, in which case I should cheerfully head down the steps knowing I was serving Him by doing so.

I mean no disrespect to people who believe the above (and fwiw, the individual in question is one of the nicest guys I've done business with and I really do wish him well), but I can't see how to reconcile that belief with any of (what's left of) the books of the Bible, or with any serious conception of a loving - or just - or even mildly interested - God.

Come to think of it I could say the same about several allegedly Christian traditions that I've heard spouted over the years.
 
Old 02-10-2016, 08:53 AM   #5452
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When I hear people like that "spout," I first-of-all remember that they might well have been steeped in that particular fire-brand of "religion."
Quote:
"In a world filled with violence and uncertainty, certainty is very appealing, even if it is violent or pointless."
But when I step back and consider what (if anything ...) I am going to do about it, I simply remember the bit about "by their fruits shall ye know them." And, "My sheep know My voice, and a stranger's voice they will not follow." In many ways, these verses are saying, "trust your gut." And so, that's what I do.

If you're condemning me to hell ... that is to say, "according to you" ... and you seem to be happy or at least smug about that (because you're so sure that you're not going there) ... then: "I don't know you!"

Aside: Certainly, one of the problems with trying to "follow Jesus' words" is that those words are so-obviously so-heavily redacted. There are fascinating books on "the quest for the historical Jesus," speculating as to where (and when) these four scant "official" books ... and a precious-few other ones ... actually came from, and what might have been done to them in the many centuries that followed. If you want to somehow believe that the text is "pristine," that's your prerogative, but ample evidence indicates otherwise ... "just what 'otherwise(s)'" being the chosen topic of discussion. Everyone, it seems, had a hand in wanting to put words in that man's mouth, and to tell obviously-conflicting versions of his life-story. (Much the same thing happened with Moses, Buddha, and Muhammad.) "And so, here we are."

The "truth," today, cannot be objectively obtained – the data is lost, but, "trust your gut and maybe listen for still, small voices." It's a shame that no one "back in the day" ever invented a digital-signature algorithm that could be applied to papyrus or clay tablets . . .

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 02-10-2016 at 09:00 AM.
 
Old 02-10-2016, 02:28 PM   #5453
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As someone who feels pretty firm in reality (when I want to be,) I view a body as the machine it is. Until we are 25*ish nourishment of ALL kinds is key.?!^ Everything we learn collectively, environmentally and\or individually is programming, plain and simple—oh also many problems.

Add: whether enslaved by what you are or what I am,,, makes no difference... evolution, why not?

Last edited by jamison20000e; 02-10-2016 at 09:13 PM.
 
Old Today, 10:22 AM   #5454
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People who preach AND atheists actually behave like this teacher does from 2+2=5. Truth exists and does not care if we like it or not. Too bad some people not only do not want it but also try to prevent others from discovery.
 
Old Today, 10:35 AM   #5455
jamison20000e
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Lot's of types of both of those groups of humans, aren't there; preachers and\or atheists that is... probably infinite like they say?

What definition of truth are you using, the ones referring to FACTS or???
 
Old Today, 10:47 AM   #5456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sundialsvcs View Post
Actually, I have n-o problem ... no problem whatsoever ... with "spiritual traditions." I fully recognize these to be a fundamental part of human life "since, well, forever." Therefore, I do not condemn these practices.

However, I do condemn and reject ... any and every interpretation of those traditions, which "condemns and rejects" any other person ... damns them to Hell with neither escape nor even a fair trial, and makes their life on Earth utterly miserable in so doing.{...}
Bingo! Nailed it! What is the point of such Deity who does not treat everyone equally and not provide all possible options like:
- be in heaven by force and by choice
- be on earth with and without sin
- be in hell by force and by choice
- you get the idea for rest
However opposite is also stupid. I don't have anything against possible God or Devil but their beef between each other is not human fault!!! As example: Maybe God wanted test Devil when asked to bow before God creations not to punish or make slave out of..just few options. Endgame is still the same. Plus soul market idea is absurd! Why sell something that you might not own to begin with or get something you should get free to begin with! Truth is not the problem - the people who control it for business and other interests are!

Last edited by Arcane; Today at 10:48 AM. Reason: fixed
 
  


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