Senate has prayer covered as health benefit in new bill:

http://www.latimes.com/features/heal...tory?track=rss

Are you sure you picked out the right forum? I don't see on that page words such as ``Linux'', ``Windows'' or ``versus''.

LQ has offtopic covered as in it's own forum:

http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/general-10/

It is sad how science is being undermined by religion (USA) or politics (UK)

Or--more generally--how knowledge is undermined by ignorance, or excellence by mediocrity.

I've never seen this metaphor before, but it occurs to me that major sectors of society are "liquefying"---in this context meaning that everyone in the group starts operating at the same relatively low level. Take an iceberg that was 50 feet above the local mean sea-level. Let it melt, and the mean level barely rises at all. Excellence is **melted** by mediocrity----without mediocrity gaining anything.

Lol.. That's a good way to put it.

Seriously, though. Isn't what you describe the whole basis of people's approach to socialism in the first place? ( I don't mean "true" communism, or socialism at all.. I just mean, it's what people want. Not what Karl Marx wrote, but what they actually push for.)

We can't all be winners, so we should instead all be equally as crappy?
(except for numero uno, of course, who most likely develops a bit of a God complex.)

There is a real trend for magical thinking in government, which is weird since we all have easy access to loads of science. Reagan had an astrologer (sounds like an easy job for loads of money and no heavy lifting to me), Blair had his rather attractive crystal lady and throughout the various ranks there are seemingly intelligent people discussing homeopathy as though it was a real science and offered real cures.

Remember this: when someone says homeopathy is valid because it's natural and been in place for hundreds of years (quite apart from the fact that every word of that is bullshit) just tell them that in real science doctors have a word for ancient cures that work: it's called "medicine" and the rest is just crap.

In this case, it's a bit of both, as it appears from the article that they're catering to the Christian Scientists in their states. Of course, doctors of homeopathy have been medicare providers for some time now, and as they say, the central concepts of homeopathy run contrary to chemisty and physics. At least prayer is neutral in that respect, which could be seen as being not as bad as supporting homeopaths, but prayer isn't healthcare and doesn't belong in this bill any more than free bologna sandwiches.

Funny we were both thinking about homeopathy: must be telepathy! (not yet funded by CMS)

http://whatstheharm.net/index.html - prayer and homeopathy can be as harmful as each other if they are used instead of real medicine.

HMMMMMM why does "The Christian Science Church" paid treatments remind me of another church that is widely accepted to be the biggest global scam of all time. ( Scientology) Another shake a chicken and use paid sessions to cleanse your soul of the evil doing monsters. I guess it just goes to show you that everyone who sees how well it workds to get money for bullshit will jump on the band wagon.

Personally I think organizations such as these should be put into a blender and poured directly into the sewer. Because that's where this shit belongs.

Erwin Chemerinsky, dean of the UC Irvine School of Law, said the provision raised serious questions about government support of religion.

"I think when Congress mandates that health companies provide coverage for prayer, it has the effect of the government advancing religion," he said.

The legal issue, however, may not be cut and dried.

Michael McConnell, who heads the Stanford University Constitutional Law Center, said that "as long as patients are the ones who choose, and religious choices are given no legal preference or advantage, the proposals would appear to be consistent with constitutional standards."

An excerpt from the article shows that this may lead to a lively discussion about the legality of the provision.

I do believe that prayer has power, I don't necessarily believe that "paid prayer" is legitimate, but again I haven't tried it.

I think free bologna sandwiches are good too, but in fact would agree that they could be harmful if substituted for medical care. For me, it isn't about whether or not you value prayer or not, any more than whether or not you want bologna sandwiches. Neither belong in a healthcare bill. No wonder CMS is going broke, wasn't paying for powered wheelchairs (one of the greatest sources of medicare fraud too) enough for them? Now they have to sponsor a church?

How about little league? I believe in the value of kid's sports, and in fact getting the little buggers off the sofa and outside instead of on their PSP or whatever even has health benefits, but it doesn't belong in a healthcare bill.

Where does it stop?

From the reports I have seen of scientific tests, people get worse when they're being prayed for. From memory, being told that a number of strangers are praying leads patients to chill out and rely on the prayer rather than concentrating on their own well-being (the mind being a wonderful thing).

The most charitable thing that can be said about the power of magical thoughts, sorry, prayers, is that it does nothing by itself and can be of some comfort to believers.

Why do I suddenly feel more and more in favor of strict and ruthless suppression of religion? Oh, I know why, because of these retards!