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-   -   Linux=Chaos... Someone needs to fix the Linux problem (https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-distributions-5/linux%3Dchaos-someone-needs-to-fix-the-linux-problem-334271/)

ebsbel 07-25-2005 08:15 PM

Well it would be nice if Linux could get a little bigger part of the market, so that hardware manufacturers have to make linux drivers, or they would loose a to large group of users. That would mean a little less frustration when installing linux and getting all your hardware to work.
Quote:

Linux is not for everyone and isn't ready to be given to your grandmother .. so let it be !!!
I think that linux is pretty close to being easy enough for someones granny to use. The hard part is setting up the hardware and solving the initial problems you often run into. Why do so many people tell me to leave linux the way it is? Do they want it to be hard to handle and user-unfriendly? Why is there so much resistance against making a real easy to use linux? As I posted earlier, linux is evolving, and quite rapidly this last year. I understand that many people are happy with linux the way it is today and there will always be distros that are complicated enough for these people, but for those who find it hard to use and configure, why not make a really user friendly distro?
Is there a free version of Linspire like there are many versions of RHEL that are free, i e CentOS, Whitebox, StartCom, etc?

aysiu 07-25-2005 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ebsbel
I think that linux is pretty close to being easy enough for someones granny to use. The hard part is setting up the hardware and solving the initial problems you often run into.
Well, the second part is right. If someone sets up the Linux installation and configures all the hardware detection problems, it is easy enough for Granny (or Grampy--let's not be sexist... ageist is okay, I guess). When set up correctly, Linux is just as point-and-click as any other operating system.

Quote:

As I posted earlier, linux is evolving, and quite rapidly this last year.
I agree. I tried Linux for the first time a year ago, and it was too difficult for me to install and use. This year, though, I've had nothing but success in getting Linux up and running (okay, not easily, but success nonetheless). Software installation is easy, dual-boot setup is easy, and hotplugging is flawless.

Quote:

for those who find it hard to use and configure, why not make a really user friendly distro? Why is there so much resistance against making a real easy to use linux?
There are people working on these things as we speak. I've found Mepis and Ubuntu to be the most user-friendly distros out there. Mepis is very close to being flawless in terms of its user-friendliness, and Ubuntu is close, too, if you don't mind using the command-line a little.

Quote:

Is there a free version of Linspire like there are many versions of RHEL that are free, i e CentOS, Whitebox, StartCom, etc?
Well, it's a little complicated. I got Linspire for free using a coupon code (LycorisWelcome), but that can be used only during certain times of the day (I think it's 7:30-1:00... not sure if it's specific to a certain time zone), and you'd still have to pay their subscription fee to use Click-N-Run. I tried using apt-get/Synaptic, but it doesn't really work with Linspire.

mlinuxk 07-28-2005 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skrilla
Another problem... the linux community speaks to the rest of the world as if we know about all of this. 80% of computer users don't care about the jargon and all they want is something that is easy and works. For example: When I browse through Suse 9 Enterprise I see a lot of programs that have short names and no way of explaining what they are. So I have to do an internet search for ever app. This is not fun and I don't have time for this. If you want to cater to the market then something needs to be done about the way you present your products. I've been a Windows Technician for almost 10 years. At least 3 years as of recently have been with SMB and Home Markets.
Having a choice is great! But giving a windows users a choice will just confuse them. I understand the origins of Linux and what is has become.
I guess the biggest reason why I present this to you all is because I'm among the huge percentage of the market that is NOT EDUCATED on Linux. This is NOT my problem nor is it the rest of the market's problem. This is the Linux Community's problem and we think something should be done.

If I and others cannot get the help we need from the Linux Community then I will have to enter the development end and change things myself. I am not here to destroy the foundation of your precious OS nor am I hell bent on World Domination.
Truth: Linux is clunky, chaotic, but has so much potential.


Windows is familiar because you have been using it. Windows is designed for people who don't know anything about computers and is easy to use. It costs a lot of money!! I for one think BG has enough money and he may have ripped off unix in the beginning, it was here before ms-dos. The best way to learn linux is to use it. It's free, but tinstaafl, you will have to want to learn Linux. It is like any other skill it takes time to learn. Besides, you can't open the hood and look into the microsoft program like you can with linux. Linux is for real computer geeks. RTM, man, RTM. It gets easier with time.
You can find anything about Linux u need to know on the internet

aysiu 07-28-2005 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mlinuxk
Linux is for real computer geeks.
Maybe in general, but if people are willing to pay money for a Windows knockoff, Linspire is definitely not for computer geeks. You pick what distro best suits you--Linux has something for everyone.

mlinuxk 07-29-2005 12:16 PM

I purchased a computer from Walmart on line with Linspire. It was very similar to Windows. It costs money, had a multidigit license code and it crash the first time I ran it.

aysiu 07-29-2005 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mlinuxk
I purchased a computer from Walmart on line with Linspire. It was very similar to Windows. It costs money, had a multidigit license code and it crash the first time I ran it.
Is your experience typical? When I used Linspire 5.0 I didn't have to enter any multi-digit license code, and it didn't crash on me.

phil.d.g 07-29-2005 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skrilla
I guess the biggest reason why I present this to you all is because I'm among the huge percentage of the market that is NOT EDUCATED on Linux. This is NOT my problem nor is it the rest of the market's problem. This is the Linux Community's problem and we think something should be done.
Whos we? I'm afraid it is very much your problem. People aren't going to learn the stuff for your benefit. If you want to use something your familiar with stick with Windows. There are OS products for the user who just wants to check their email, check their items on ebay, etc namely Windows, OS X, and even some Linux distributions - Ubuntu springs to mind.

BTW when you become old enough to drive did you demand your driving license because learning to drive wasn't your problem, it is the communities' problem?!

I find Slackware very user friendly, not so much the other distros - I like a clean and mean setup, I much prefer the CLI over the GUI, for example I burned some of my mp3's to a CD for my car's stereo; I popped my blank CD in entered two commands, one to make an iso image and one to burn the image, much faster and easier than clicking around in Nero BurningROM or X-CD-Roast for 10 minutes

I wouldn't say Linux is for geeks, if I put Ubuntu on my brother's computer he wouldn't noticed except that the start menu button has somehow managed to get from the bottom right of the screen to the top left. As long as he can use a word processor, internet, email he's happy. And don't turn round and say he wouldn't be able to set Linux up because if he were to buy a computer it would already have Windows on and he wouldn't need to set that up either.

ebsbel 07-29-2005 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skrilla
I guess the biggest reason why I present this to you all is because I'm among the huge percentage of the market that is NOT EDUCATED on Linux. This is NOT my problem nor is it the rest of the market's problem. This is the Linux Community's problem and we think something should be done.
What he means is that if Linux is going to win the distro war against windows, Linux needs to educate the windows users and start making easier to use distros. I have realized that many users don't think that there is an OS war and that Linux and windows should co-exist - each OS being good at their respective tasks. "Linux is a windows alternative and not a windows replacement." - I disagree with that. Linux is definetily ready to replace windows for many if not most users. The only issue is really support for various hardware, which really can make linux buggy and hard to set up. I also think that Bill G has enough money and I would love to see a lot of windows user convert to linux as much as I would hate it if MS would take over the market in new to computer developing countries.
Many linux users feel that new users should educate themself to such a level that they can handle the linux system. I feel that that is a rather old fashioned statement. Computers were originally made to solve complex differential equations. This saved a lot of time for the scientists, since calculations were made automatically and much faster. Then new applications appeared that made computers useful in many other ways, but the point is when computers do things automatically it saves time for the users.
Let's see what the founder of linux has to say about this:

" It also makes me personally convinced that if we are still talking in a big way about operating systems fifteen years from now, something is seriously wrong somewhere. ... Statistically speaking _nobody_ wants an operating system. In fact no-one even wants a computer. They want a magical toy that can be used to browse the web, write term papers, play games, balance the check book, and so on. The fact that you need a computer and an operating system to do all this is something that most people would rather not think about. ....where is Linux itself, and open source in general, in all this? You won't even know. It will be inside all those ... machines. You'll never know it, but its there, making it all run. " --Linus Torvalds

He says that a computer should just work and you shouldn't have to be concerned about what is inside, behind the apps. I guess that's the future for the operating systems.
It will take some time before we get there, but I hope linux gets there before MS. So the linux community better start making user-friendly apps and intelligent configuration guis.


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