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Old 10-09-2023, 04:52 AM   #1
Exaga
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Question Slackware AArch64 on the Raspberry Pi 5


SO! Hahahahaha

Here we are! We've been talking and thinking and dreaming about it for years, and the Raspberry Pi 5 is finally on the horizon and heading in our direction.

What are your plans, thoughts, impressions, of this new addition to the Raspberry Pi family? What will you do with it and/or will you even be investing in one?
 
Old 10-09-2023, 06:58 AM   #2
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Briefly, I like the A-76 cores, more ram, and the higher throughput generally. They did well to keep the price down.

I am underwhelmed by the silence on and lack of a video driver. The Pi 4 promised 2x4k monitors, but the community could only drive 1xhdmi monitor with the framebuffer! There was no acceleration. I don't believe the Pi 5 "HDR support" until I see it. There's no Pi 5 GPU driver that I have heard of. I am not inclined to buy until there is, even if it was only $5 euros. It doesn't matter what it supports unless we can drive it. I hope everyone takes that stand. And don't point me at RPI OS please.

Likewise, I'm underwhelmed by the 4 core, 4 thread cpu. Now 2.4Ghz is better, but the extra speed has been achieved with extra current, so the wafer fab is the same large size. The principal part of that current is CPU current. The formula that applies is:
Code:
Wattage = ½CV²F
, where C = (FET) capacitance V = Volts and F = Frequency. If the Pi 5 had smaller wafer fab size than the Pi 4, the C would be reduced. But the C hasn't been reduced, and the F has been increased, so the current is up. I can only approximate as I'm not comparing like with like (2711 vs 2712). An approximation like that tells you that 8 cores are not thermally possible for Broadcom until they update their wafer fab. I imagine they need that weird case to move the air around.

Things like wifi6 or faster bluetooth don't cut much ice with me, because you don't find faster/APs so wifi6 is a dream. Internet feeds don't do wifi6 speeds. I can't imagine myself transferring Gigabytes a few metres across the room via bluetooth either.

If Slackware Arm doesn't have something based on the RK3588 (octa-core Arm A-72) or one of those SolidRun mini servers, I imagine you'll buy a few for compiling. I won't unless there's good graphics.

Last edited by business_kid; 10-09-2023 at 01:20 PM.
 
Old 10-09-2023, 07:21 AM   #3
mralk3
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It's nice that the Pi 5 will include cryptographic extensions. I also like the cortex-a76. More RAM, OpenGL 3.1, with the video core stuff. However, there are alternatives to the Raspberry Pi 5 that have similar (or better) hardware specs. For example, the Orange Pi 5/B/Plus that comes with a 8 core rockchip CPU. The Quartz64 models from Pine64 also look good as far as RAM capacity goes. Both of which are already fairly well supported in the upstream kernel.

I think I would need a specific use case to motivate a purchase. Something that other boards do not already do well.
 
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Old 10-09-2023, 01:19 PM   #4
business_kid
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mralk3
I think I would need a specific use case to motivate a purchase. Something that other boards do not already do well.
Alarm bells rang for me when the Raspberry lot paused the Pi 5 project in R&D. I'm a retired hardware guy, but they had to start work on the Pi 5 just after the Pi 4 was released. If you have a good idea in Electronics, it's out of date by the time you build it from scratch. Lead times are too long. So it will replace the Pi 4, not add to sales.

The trouble with the Orange Pi & RK3588 stuff is price. You're nearly into low end pc prices by the time you get those sbcs equipped.
 
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Old 10-10-2023, 02:51 PM   #5
Exaga
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Was hoping to encourage some engaging conversation and ideas regarding Slackware AArch64 on the Raspberry Pi 5. I could have just tuned in to the Muppet Show and watched Statler and Waldorf instead. They're much more fun.

Has anyone else got anything GOOD to say or share about the question(s) posed in the OP?
 
Old 10-11-2023, 07:47 AM   #6
business_kid
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exega
What are your plans, thoughts, impressions, of this new addition to the Raspberry Pi family?
I'm underwhelmed and disappointed.
It's cheap and slightly up on the Pi 4.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Exega
What will you do with it and/or will you even be investing in one?
There has to be a video driver, or I won't do business.
 
Old 10-11-2023, 12:16 PM   #7
fatmac
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exaga View Post
SO! Hahahahaha

Here we are! We've been talking and thinking and dreaming about it for years, and the Raspberry Pi 5 is finally on the horizon and heading in our direction.

What are your plans, thoughts, impressions, of this new addition to the Raspberry Pi family? What will you do with it and/or will you even be investing in one?
Basically, no, I won't be getting one - to me, it only has a bit more CPU speed, & for that you will need to buy new power supplies, & new fan cooled cases for them.....
 
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Old 10-11-2023, 02:38 PM   #8
business_kid
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmac View Post
Basically, no, I won't be getting one - to me, it only has a bit more CPU speed, & for that you will need to buy new power supplies, & new fan cooled cases for them.....
I'm not even sure it has that much speed. Most Pi 4s will run at 2Ghz, or even more. Mine gets iffy above 1.8Ghz, but that was a 1.5Ghz model. It does seem to offer better throughput, but that is bottle-necked in most cases at the o/p.
 
Old 10-11-2023, 02:43 PM   #9
Exaga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by business_kid View Post
I'm ... <snip>
Yeah, whatever you say skiddo. At least Brent responded with some relevance, examples, and insight. I was underwhelmed too... after reading yours.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatmac View Post
Basically, no, I won't be getting one - to me, it only has a bit more CPU speed, & for that you will need to buy new power supplies, & new fan cooled cases for them.....
Fair point. For me it'll be something new to play with, which is a little more speedy and capable than the RPi4, that'll hopefully mean shorter build and turnaround times. Not just because of the CPU but also the increased floating point performance and memory bandwidth. Not even going to question how well Slackware will deal with it. Just looking forward to, and anticipating, doing just that.
 
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Old 10-11-2023, 03:41 PM   #10
netcrawl
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I was planning on buying a RPi4 8GB when I heard of the upcoming Rpi5 release. I'm going to wait for some reviews of the Rpi5 before I purchase one, but either would be for, yeah, "something new to play with..."
 
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Old 10-11-2023, 10:49 PM   #11
TheTKS
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I was getting ready to buy a Pi 4 when the announcement of the Pi 5 came out.

I don't need a 5, but I read enough about it to become curious and opted to pre-order a 5 instead of buying another 4. The predicted Oct/Nov delivery is soon enough for me, and I'll need the time to get my space ready for the new addition.

I'll have one Pi each running OpenBSD, Slackware and Raspberry Pi OS. I've got two 4s that I've switched between those three OSs, mostly for Arduino and ESP32 hobby work and occasional everyday desktop use.

I'll do the same with my new 5, which will run with RPi OS until whichever of Slackware and OpenBSD first produces a version for it, and then RPi OS will move back to a 4. I haven't been running Slackware on a Pi for awhile, and I would like to get back to it.

As for what else I would like to do with the Pis... so much to do, so little time!

TKS
 
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Old 10-12-2023, 12:36 PM   #12
sndwvs
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At the moment the favorite in terms of price/performance is rk3588/rk3588s, and orange pi 5/orange pi 5 plus is the most profitable solution for the price, even without mesa 4k support it can be played freely with 40% CPU utilization. Well, and other goodies in the form of NVME M2, 2x 2.5GB network connectors.
 
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Old 10-12-2023, 01:43 PM   #13
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I am excited about the RPI-5. Have one on order in fact. Probably end up with several over next few years... I am looking forward to be able to plug in 'any' USB 3.0 storage device and not having it choke (power wise). Unlike the RPI-4 with it's power issues. Also the PCI-e will bring interesting daughter boards in play. Has an RTC. Same GPIO. Who cares about the video.... not me. Most all my pi's (3s, 4s, etc.) run headless anyway, and none of the those that have a screen are used for silly games. So plenty fast for me. Plus it is a western product, not one of the knock offs coming from ali-ali-ali whoops ali express.

Last edited by rclark; 10-12-2023 at 01:47 PM.
 
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Old 10-13-2023, 05:18 AM   #14
business_kid
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So, it just seems to be displacing the RPi 4, but not expanding market share?
 
Old 10-14-2023, 05:55 AM   #15
Exaga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rclark View Post
I am excited about the RPI-5. Have one on order in fact. Probably end up with several over next few years... I am looking forward to be able to plug in 'any' USB 3.0 storage device and not having it choke (power wise). Unlike the RPI-4 with it's power issues. Also the PCI-e will bring interesting daughter boards in play. Has an RTC. Same GPIO. Who cares about the video.... not me. Most all my pi's (3s, 4s, etc.) run headless anyway, and none of the those that have a screen are used for silly games. So plenty fast for me. Plus it is a western product, not one of the knock offs coming from ali-ali-ali whoops ali express.
Yes, GPU is a big step up when considering the Raspberry Pi 4 has a VideoCore VI GPU @ 600MHz and Raspberry Pi 5 has a VideoCore VII GPU @ 1GHz. In terms of real world raw performance the RPi4 is 4.4 GFLOPS and the RPi5 is over 10 GFLOPS, according to Gordon Hollingworth. So in terms of GPU alone its capabilities have more than doubled, at least. With Vulkan 1.2 support in the offing it's got much greater potential than the RPi4 and that's very exciting indeed for me. We'll see what drivers and software are available on release, for Vulkan, but when all is said and done it's got a lot of promise. I really love the way things are going with Vulkan. It's a side-passion of mine and has been for quite some years.

Users might be slightly disappointed to learn about the RPi5's onboard RTC. It's not a standalone IC but integrated into the DA9091 power management (RP1) 'southbridge' chip that's regulated by an external 32.768kHz quartz crystal with a projected accuracy of 50ppm - which, IMHO is not great and roughly equates to ±5 seconds per day and ±30 minutes per year at 25' Celsius. Higher or lower temperatures for sustained periods will increase or decrease the accuracy. I cannot find any spec's or data on this RTC as it falls under the "propietary technology" banner crap. Not impressed with that myself, at all. My current RTCs are DS3231 and DS3234 which have an accuracy of 4ppm so this RPi5 RTC may be superfluous to my requirements straight out of the box.

I mostly run headless too but I will be looking to test and explore the graphics capabilities of this new device. Silly games will one day be possible with Vulkan, which has slowly been progressing and will one day release DirectX's chokehold in that area. Can't wait for that!
 
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