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-   Slackware (https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/)
-   -   Yes, you can remove Pulseaudio (with caveats) (https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/yes-you-can-remove-pulseaudio-with-caveats-4175597734/)

slalik 02-02-2017 05:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didier Spaier (Post 5663799)
I strongly disagree with the idea of removing Pulseaudio, especially because of issues that could be solved without removing it, or with a rationale like "I was happy with what I had before, why change?", or "I don't want to learn something new" or even worse "I don't want to use a software initially written by LP".
I have all 3 issues (I find them completely legitimate) and more:
4. I don't want a daemon constantly running and useless for me;
5. And the main issue: I like music (classical), I have good Genelec speakers and a good external sound card, so I want a bit-perfect output, pulseaudio is not able to give a bit-perfect output.

But I'm not complaining, it is very easy to deactivate pulseaudio (I described what I do in this post).

(Of course, to achieve a bit-perfect output it is also necessary to get rid of ALSA's dmix.)

the3dfxdude 02-02-2017 07:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didier Spaier (Post 5663799)
I strongly disagree with the idea of removing Pulseaudio, especially because of issues that could be solved without removing it, or with a rationale like "I was happy with what I had before, why change?", or "I don't want to learn something new" or even worse "I don't want to use a software initially written by LP".
None of that is what I am saying. What I am saying is that the software does not work correctly for properly managing my hardware. Please do not try to skew what we are saying into that this is a hate fest. Trying to skew our words is why these topics keep devolving.

Quote:
It would be way more constructive to properly document issues as they occur and try collectively to find solutions. That's one of the main aims of LQ, after all.
And along that, it is properly constructive to also document removing pulseaudio. It is a solution to be doing this, as many people are coming out saying.

FTIO 02-02-2017 08:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didier Spaier (Post 5663799)
I strongly disagree with the idea of removing Pulseaudio, especially because of issues that could be solved without removing it, or with a rationale like "I was happy with what I had before, why change?", or "I don't want to learn something new" or even worse "I don't want to use a software initially written by LP"....
Or in other words, it was written by a turd, is turd programming, and barely works here and there, and we should just spray Lysol on the turd sitting on our systems once in a while to make the turd smell a little less badly.

No thanks, I'll continue to call a turd a turd.

FTIO 02-02-2017 09:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkelsen (Post 5663789)
Possible solution from the Arch forums:

edit /etc/pulse/default.pa to comment out the line:

#load-module module-switch-on-port-available

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=207868

Another possible solution: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php...tel_sound_card
Unfortunately neither of those worked. Thank you though.

FTIO 02-02-2017 09:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didier Spaier (Post 5663799)
Let me remind you that there are available sources of information to help manage Pulseaudio and troubleshoot issues, like on ArchWiki:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PulseAudio
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php...roubleshooting

There is also a page on SlackDocs.
PA was not yet shipped in Slackware when it has been written but I assume that proposed updates including e.g. advice for a proper setup or solutions to common issues encountered using PA in Slackware would be welcome.

Last, as PA 10.0 has been released it wouldn't be bad to check if it solves some issues, see the release notes: https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Sof...io/Notes/10.0/
Unfortunately no help in those places either. Thank you too though.

coldbeer 02-02-2017 11:26 AM
...

orbea 02-02-2017 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Didier Spaier (Post 5663799)
It would be way more constructive to properly document issues as they occur and try collectively to find solutions. That's one of the main aims of LQ, after all.
While I would normally agree with you, the problems here are conceptual rather than functional and as was already mentioned it boils down to what you find more important, bluetooth devices or a mostly proven audio implementation. Personally I don't think that decision should be made at a community level, but at an individual level. :)

rkelsen 02-02-2017 04:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slalik (Post 5663832)
... I want a bit-perfect output...
Then why are you using ALSA at all? OSS will give you superior sound quality.

Unfortunately OSS hasn't been included in Slackware for a long time, but there is a SlackBuild available for it. Development is quite slow, so support for new soundcards is hit or miss.

slalik 02-02-2017 05:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkelsen (Post 5664179)
Then why are you using ALSA at all? OSS will give you superior sound quality.

Unfortunately OSS hasn't been included in Slackware for a long time, but there is a SlackBuild available for it. Development is quite slow, so support for new soundcards is hit or miss.
In my setup ALSA output directly to hardware, I think it doesn't change the sound quality. This is my /etc/asound.conf:
Code:
pcm.!default {
  type plug
  slave.pcm {
    type hw
    card STU
  }
}

ctl.!default {
  type hw         
  card STU
}
(STU is my external sound card)

rkelsen 02-02-2017 07:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by slalik (Post 5664196)
In my setup ALSA output directly to hardware, I think it doesn't change the sound quality.
The only reason you'd say that is if you've never used OSS.

the3dfxdude 02-02-2017 07:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkelsen (Post 5664179)
Then why are you using ALSA at all? OSS will give you superior sound quality.

Unfortunately OSS hasn't been included in Slackware for a long time, but there is a SlackBuild available for it. Development is quite slow, so support for new soundcards is hit or miss.
When was the last time you used OSS? I don't think I've used it since it was deprecated in the mainline kernel.

I did notice differences when I tried ALSA in the early days compared back to OSS. I think latency was an issue. But since both was available, it was easy to switch between, and it wasn't a big deal. The slackbuild description does ring a bell. But it's been so long, I don't know anymore if the difference is true--even though I still have the same sound hardware I bought to use when I switched to linux! Funny you mentioned development is quite slow, since there was just a release yesterday.

rkelsen 02-03-2017 02:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by the3dfxdude (Post 5664234)
When was the last time you used OSS?
When I last used FreeBSD... yesterday I think, possibly the day before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the3dfxdude (Post 5664234)
I think latency was an issue.
Latency is just one problem ALSA has.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the3dfxdude (Post 5664234)
But it's been so long, I don't know anymore if the difference is true
Oh, but it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by the3dfxdude (Post 5664234)
Funny you mentioned development is quite slow, since there was just a release yesterday.
After >2 years!

bateleur 02-03-2017 03:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by FTIO (Post 5663485)
My 78 year old mother lives out in the woods and brown/black outs happen quite often. I've got a cheap UPS on her 14.2 system to shut it down, but the problem with sound begins when she's started her system back up and wants to listen to news videos or videos sent to her in her e-mail by friends.

She can't. Her system for some reason, always starts up with no sound. She has to go into system settings and adjust things to make sound work again. This happens *EVERY* time she has to restart her system. It's a PITA and I've not been able to figure out why it's doing this or how to make it stop and just give her the sound so she doesn't have to keep piddling with this problem. It'll be soon she'll tell me to put Microshaft back on her system and I'll have to argue with her for days and weeks on end why it's a stupid idea to do that.

Not once in my several years of using Slackware and the years of other distro's before it between 2000 and then, has alsa never 'not' worked.

It's kind of a Catch-22, unfortunately, because I personally (nor anyone I know) use anything to do with bluetooth, but I do know there are some out there who do. I think it may boil down to 'which is more important'...good, decent sound that works all the time every time (alsa), or bluetooth for ?.
In KDE I have solved this by having KMix preserving sound between startups (there is an option for that and also for having start KMix when logging on, I have both checked on).

I don't have this option in XFCE, so I went to alsamixer in a terminal and discovered that for some obscure (pulse?) reason 'Auto-Mute Mode' was enabled. In case you have that as well, you should disable it. Press F5 to show all controls in alsamixer. Use the arrows to move to the <Auto-Mute> option and press the minus key (-) to change it to Disabled. Afterwards, you should run alsactl store as root to save this change. You could also try by making /etc/rc.d/rc.alsa executable, although this might not be recommended (?) (this used to work for me, until I disabled it and I got muted at startup again).

FTIO 02-04-2017 06:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bateleur (Post 5664681)
In KDE I have solved this by having KMix preserving sound between startups (there is an option for that and also for having start KMix when logging on, I have both checked on).
This has always been standard procedure for me at every installation of Slackware. Unfortunately it just isn't working on this computer with 14.2. I appreciate the input though, thanks.

selfprogrammed 03-09-2017 12:19 PM
I also installed Slackware 14.2 and immediately had severe problems with PulseAudio.
I am going to take my questions to a separate thread.
My observations are:

1. PulseAudio does not get along with PulseAudio. As installed the system launches a
pulseaudio (but not in system mode), and XFCE launches a pulseaudio.
The first instance uses up compute time, but does not produce any sound.
2. SDL does not work with pulseaudio.
3. KDE games like Pairs does not produce sound.
4. The X event sounds are not heard.
5. If I kill the first pulseaudio then the SDL sounds and X event sounds, and the Pairs
sounds are heard again.
6. Disabling the launch of pulseaudio by XFCE has no effect.
7. PulseAudio wants the audio group all to itself (Master-control-program thinking), but the audio group is needed for all kinds of audio access.

I don't know what problem PulseAudio was created so solve, but it seems to just be a way
for the ConsoleKit to take over managing sound devices. We really do not need another Master-Control-Program. I suspect most of the problems are indirectly due to the ConsoleKit blocking access.


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