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Old 09-28-2019, 09:24 AM   #16
Firerat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orbea View Post
If I recall enorbet uses the nvidia proprietary drivers and doesn't have the ability of using wine-nine-standalone, but other people who read this thread might find it useful. My basic impression is that D9VK hasn't had nearly as much time to mature as wine-nine-standalone or DXVK, in the future it likely will become more viable. Also eventually D9VK might be merged into DXVK.
yeah, I don't think D9VK is getting much attention

PBA worked well(ish) up to wine 3.16 ( broke in 3.18+ )
However OpenGL was still better with wow 3.3.5a
As retail clients no longer support OpenGL,people with older ( vulkan incompatible ) must use the older wine with PBA.
note , retail WoW is not D3D9, it is D3D11 ( or is it 12 now ? )


or they could try porting PBA back into 4.x

Last edited by Firerat; 09-28-2019 at 09:26 AM.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 10:36 AM   #17
mickski56
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If d9vk is working for the op, then gxAPI will be set to D3D9 as d9vk installs d3d9.dll d3d10.dll d3d10_1.dll d3d10core.dll d3d11.dll and optionally dxgi.dll in order to translate directX to vulkan. The output in #9 seems to suggest d9vk is indeed doing what it's supposed to i.e. translate d3d9 to vulkan. Whether this performs adequately is entirely another mater.

Also from the release notes

Please do not use wine's d3d9x or d3dcompiler with d9vk. They make invalid API calls and generate bad shaders. I cannot stress this enough.

Don't think that's the cause of the op's performance issues tho.
Some games perform better than others with wine/d9vk/dxvk.

I use dgVoodoo2 with dxvk just for laughs to get some d3d9 and earlier( different d3d* implementation = different bugs and features ) titles to play, again performance varies.

Last edited by mickski56; 09-28-2019 at 10:55 AM.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 12:10 PM   #18
orbea
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickski56 View Post
as d9vk installs d3d9.dll d3d10.dll d3d10_1.dll d3d10core.dll d3d11.dll and optionally dxgi.dll in order to translate directX to vulkan.
As I learned myself recently only d3d9.dll is used by D9VK, the others are there to ease the eventual merge into DXVK. In my D9VK build script I am building with d3d10, d3d11 and dxgi all disabled.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 12:23 PM   #19
mickski56
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#orbea have you tested many builds/games with winelib builds ? At various points in the past they didn't build/work very well sometimes. Which is why I went to the effort of installing mingw64 on 14.2.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 12:53 PM   #20
orbea
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickski56 View Post
#orbea have you tested many builds/games with winelib builds ? At various points in the past they didn't build/work very well sometimes. Which is why I went to the effort of installing mingw64 on 14.2.
I haven't tested very much with D9VK yet, but I have tested the few games I have with DXVK for a while and found good results. I would like to add mingw64 support to my build scripts, but there isn't a good SBo compatible source build to use and I'm not that motivated to spend the time doing that. I'm also personally not interested in using their binary packages.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 01:31 PM   #21
enorbet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firerat View Post
I think it was deemed to have failed as the OP doesn't have a grasp of what is going on with the basics.

They were getting frustrated that wow 3.3.5a was resetting the gxAPI back to D3D9 from D9VK that they were manually adding.

I have no idea why they thought WoW was going to understand a translation API which was written long after It was.

no grasp of basics.
I guess you missed my post explaining that even as D3D9 I discovered for certain that D9VK was being used. I don't lack understandfing of basics. I just don't jump to conclusions before I have evidence and I'm a firm believer in the old school meaning of hacking as in finding ways to optimize and re-purpose. You can make snide, condescending remarks about my experience and skills all you want. My ego doesn't need shoring up by ranking on others. A word to the wise....
 
Old 09-28-2019, 01:47 PM   #22
enorbet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickski56 View Post
If d9vk is working for the op, then gxAPI will be set to D3D9 as d9vk installs d3d9.dll d3d10.dll d3d10_1.dll d3d10core.dll d3d11.dll and optionally dxgi.dll in order to translate directX to vulkan. The output in #9 seems to suggest d9vk is indeed doing what it's supposed to i.e. translate d3d9 to vulkan. Whether this performs adequately is entirely another mater.

Also from the release notes

Please do not use wine's d3d9x or d3dcompiler with d9vk. They make invalid API calls and generate bad shaders. I cannot stress this enough.

Don't think that's the cause of the op's performance issues tho.
Some games perform better than others with wine/d9vk/dxvk.

I use dgVoodoo2 with dxvk just for laughs to get some d3d9 and earlier( different d3d* implementation = different bugs and features ) titles to play, again performance varies.
Yes I read those notes which is why I asked about what the consensus is for removing libraries that winetricks installs as it most certainly does not just toggle. I had to manually remove them from "~/.wine/c_drive/windows/system32".

Not only is it my understanding but also my experience that, up until now, OpenGL has outperformed DirectX9 for WoW, at least how it has been implemented in wine. Two things drive me to experiment. 1) Some earlier versions of wine performed better even on lesser hardware with OpenGL, and 2) D9VK is relatively new and is a work in progress and may at some point possibly overtake OpenGL. I frankly don't mind 20-25 FPS running around some spots like Dalaran since I'm aware that floating cities with vertically separated action are a bit buggy in many games that old, but lo FPS in 25man raids isdn't so much buggy as dependent on connection bandwidth and graphic performance. I've read and have experienced that many older games handoff less work to the GPU and are more CPU intensive and not improved by multi-core CPUs so I'm hoping to discover the best possible software to get the smoothest operation when it counts most.

If it turns out like Garpu has stated (which I can't confirm by booting to Win7) that DirectX9 is inferior to modern OpenGL in this specific use case, then I will jusdt have to accept defeat and live with what I have. That doesn't discourage me from trying and finding out for myself albeit with the added benefit of consulting others here.

So thank you for your positive post to help.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 01:54 PM   #23
Firerat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet View Post
I guess you missed my post explaining that even as D3D9 I discovered for certain that D9VK was being used. I don't lack understandfing of basics. I just don't jump to conclusions before I have evidence and I'm a firm believer in the old school meaning of hacking as in finding ways to optimize and re-purpose. You can make snide, condescending remarks about my experience and skills all you want. My ego doesn't need shoring up by ranking on others. A word to the wise....
you have no grasp of the basics
you completely miss understood d9vk

Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet View Post
Additionally why are you posting incompatible "guidance" in the Slackware sub forum as a Debian user who relies on automated package management and systemd with a disabled root account? Whatever twirls ur beanie, cousin, but your suggestion of "file /var/lib/pkgtools/scripts/*" fails here as Slackware does not have a pkgtools directory in /var/lib or in /var anywhere. The concept isn't bad but it does paint you as something of a guy with an axe to grind and a pose to support. Please, if you wish to comment in a Slackware sub-forum know some Slackware.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 02:05 PM   #24
enorbet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firerat View Post
you have no grasp of the basics
you completely miss understood d9vk

Originally Posted by enorbet View Post
Additionally why are you posting incompatible "guidance" in the Slackware sub forum as a Debian user who relies on automated package management and systemd with a disabled root account? Whatever twirls ur beanie, cousin, but your suggestion of "file /var/lib/pkgtools/scripts/*" fails here as Slackware does not have a pkgtools directory in /var/lib or in /var anywhere. The concept isn't bad but it does paint you as something of a guy with an axe to grind and a pose to support. Please, if you wish to comment in a Slackware sub-forum know some Slackware.
Oh now I see. You're still miffed about the latter from a different thread even after I apologized for missing that the one who started that thread is using a bash version that is not common to 14.2 but is to -Current. You do realize that cross-posting is not proper here, right? More importantly since I was man enough to be able to admit a mistake, which I consider an important first step to continued growth, how about you reciprocate and let that be bygones, no harm, no foul? In this case you have little grasp of what my knowledge, experience and skills are since you don't know me, so how about dialing down the offensive? We can agree to disagree about CLI vs/ GUI, which apparently is the Original Sin.

Now, can we get back to this thread?
 
Old 09-28-2019, 02:12 PM   #25
dugan
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My experiences with D9VK have been very positive.

But my advice to enorbet would be to start a new prefix, install DXVK into it, install WOW into it, set WOW to use DirectX 11, and let DXVK translate the DirectX 11 calls into Vulkan. That typically gives excellent results.

Last edited by dugan; 09-28-2019 at 02:16 PM.
 
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Old 09-28-2019, 02:17 PM   #26
enorbet
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Thanks, dugan. That's what I've read, too, and that keeps me checking it out from time to time and prompted this thread which has already resulted in some progress tht will facilitate continued checking as d9vk improves. I'm quite interested in Steams early incorporation but I'm not ready to meet their requirements just yet in hopes that becomes less demanding over time.
 
Old 09-28-2019, 02:36 PM   #27
mickski56
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I don't think it's necessary to remove libraries from wine, use WINEDLLOVERRIDES
I think all the directX games I run I Start from scripts that contain amongst others the lines.
For d9vk scripts will contain

WINEDLLOVERRIDES="*d3d9,*d3dcompiler,d3dcompiler_42,d3dcompiler_43,d3dcompiler_47=n" \
WINEARCH=win32 WINEPREFIX=~/.wine_<something> wine "${HOME}/.wine_<something>/<path_to_game>/<game.exe>"

For dxvk scripts will contain

WINEDLLOVERRIDES="d3dcompiler_43,d3dcompiler_47=n" \
WINEARCH=win32 WINEPREFIX=~/.wine_<something> wine "${HOME}/.wine_<something>/<path_to_game>/<game.exe>"

You may need to override d3d10, d3d11 with dxvk. It shouldn't be necessary if dxvk was installed in your WINEPREFIX with setup_dxvk.sh as this should overide the necessary dlls. For the same reason the d3d9.dll override may not be necessary. Anything installed with winetricks should also provide the necessary overrides for you. If in doubt use a fresh prefix.

The WINEDLLOVERRIDES may contain other things to get sound and or video to work properly.
WINEARCH may be set to win64 for 64bit games I have one I think.
I used winetricks to install various d3dcompiler dll's in the appropriate WINEPREFIX.

See https://wiki.winehq.org/Wine_User's_...DDLL_Overrides

Last edited by mickski56; 09-28-2019 at 07:43 PM. Reason: correction
 
Old 09-28-2019, 03:29 PM   #28
Firerat
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and dll overrides can live in the .reg files which live in the root of the wineprefix

d9vk is unlikely to improve things with wow3.3.5a anytime soon

the renice -20 won't do anything for you
( I have no idea what you think it is doing , but I giggled when I saw it)
man renice
if anything you will want to renice the wineserver

honestly your best bet is OpenGL
WINEDEBUG=-all # might get you a few more fps

using openGL will completely skip past the d3d compilers and translation APIs, that is why you get better performance , kind of obvious it you had actually thought about it.
you still suffer with WoW 3.3.5a being CPU bound, nothing the graphics side of things is going to do much to help.
 
Old 09-30-2019, 12:53 PM   #29
enorbet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dugan View Post
My experiences with D9VK have been very positive.

But my advice to enorbet would be to start a new prefix, install DXVK into it, install WOW into it, set WOW to use DirectX 11, and let DXVK translate the DirectX 11 calls into Vulkan. That typically gives excellent results.
Dugan and everybody CHECK THIS OUT!

This is what I have been hoping to achieve and while I am continuing trying to achieve such performance directly in Wine, just look at what Steam can do with d9vk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_aQR0KxilGw

That is fantastic! and I am working on it now at the very least as a learning experience to try to incorporate into wine.
 
Old 09-30-2019, 05:18 PM   #30
dugan
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Uh, cool. I'd be curious as to what your benchmarks with OpenGL, Direct3D 9 with just WINE (which just translates DirectX 9 to OpenGL), and D9VK (which translates DirectX 9 to Vulkan) look like.

Last edited by dugan; 09-30-2019 at 05:42 PM.
 
  


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