I will consider a display server, if ports to at least two other operating systems have been demonstrated. I won't use a windowing system, which only works exclusively on Linux. What these "desktop environment" guys are doing on their playgrounds doesn't interest me, it's irrelevant for the IT industry anyway.
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The main issue will be for the users that use one of the zillion available WMs (or, in a certain extent, the Gnome 2.x/KDE 3.x heirs). They won't work with Wayland, which requires to write a composer to talk to it (it goes without saying that it's far more complex than writing a WM). Plus, whereas X, Wayland does not draw, which also means you will have to bind to a toolkit to create taskbars, window decorations, menus and so.
To simplify things, it is question to implements them as plugins for the existing composers (Weston/Kwin). But all is still to do. Quote:
So, I don't claim here Wayland will fail nor that the raised problems won't find some elegant solutions, but it's IMHO too soon to discuss the opportunity of a switch. |
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As for my second statement, I will do more research. |
I assume applications built on XLib will not work in Wayland. That will be an obstacle for adoption. And people are very addicted to their window managers.
Still, Høgsberg sounds like a Norwegian or Dane, and it's well known that all things Scandinavian are good (except for surströmming and C++), so it's at least very likely that Wayland is vastly superior to X. Vølund is also Norse for Wayland, and although I don't know how Wayland MA got its name, it's definitely etymologically related. From Völundskvädet: Quote:
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Not me. When I think of Wayland I remember getting lost buzzing around between Bedford and Framington searching in vain for a route that wasn't completely traffic clogged (Thoreau must be turning over in his grave) trying to visit an ex-gf. Bad associations all around.
Aside from that, by the time it's viable I'm hoping I've finally figured out how to get OpenBSD working on this laptop. Nothing against Slackware -- it's nice too -- but that's my home O/S, and I'll eventually return to it. I don't see OpenBSD ever supporting Wayland, particularly since one of their developers is a senior X person, on the board if I recall. |
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"Wayland will also be a mess for BSD and Solaris operating systems due to its dependence on kernel mode-setting, kernel input drivers, and Weston being designed with solely Linux in mind. " http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?pag...tem&px=MTI5Njk |
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Wayland needs to prove itself before it should be used.
I'd suggest offering it as a /testing package ONLY. After the code has been stabilized for at least a 6-12 months time frame following the initial release date for adequate testing. This way the developers have worked out the bugs, security issues, etc. I don't see Wayland taking over for X.Org for some time until all the UNICES out there can get a full port of Wayland created and stabilized. With Weston being possibly Linux only, chances are X.Org could be still co-developed alongside Wayland until Weston gets a successful port, clone, or ability to be commented out in favor of a BSD friendly compositor that is Wayland friendly, which remains to be seen. |
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A WM is an application which filters the events between the X server and the root window's children (which means all the windows the different applications create in the same X session). So, the only thing you can expect with XWayland is an Xserver running a WM with nothing to manage. The window management in Wayland can't be anything but a component of a compositor. |
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Wayland in combination with systemd is very powerfull for the desktop experience, and would bring linux desktops closer to apple and microsoft desktops in the way of user experience. Both these components are still in their child shoes (wayland being more mature imo) Both these components are developed with different parts of the system. Kernel additions, glibc changes, dbus changes, probably alot more. When it comes to BSD, they are just saying it doesn't work on BSD. Instead they should be working with wayland to make this work. Also systemd is here an option, as they have their own kernel the can work with the devs of systemd to make this work. PS. I see systemd having only benefits in a desktop enviremont at the moment. wayland can be used also as a remote desktop server. (No more seperate VT's for each user) |
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I second this sentiment, and then some. Every time I've had to touch a windows machine at work, or my wife's Macbook at home, it really impresses upon me that X11-based UI is more sophisticated, and more powerful.
Compare and contrast copy-and-pasting text segments from an almost-screen-sized window to another window: Under Windows or MacOSX, the source window's text is not always selectable (also true under X11, but less frequently), the destination window is not always capable of taking the paste, the destination window has to be brought to the foreground for the paste to happen, and sent back to the background to make the source window entirely visible again, and highlighting text is insufficient to actually copy the text (a control-key sequence is necessary, or clicking on a menu). Under X11, the destination window remains behind the source window, and it's just left-button to copy + middle-button to paste. zip zip zip, all done. I know there are WM's which emulate the click-to-focus behavior of Windows and MacOSX, but these are broken. Do not use them. |
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