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Old 11-24-2003, 09:10 AM   #31
linen0ise
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Distribution: slack...nothing but slack
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well...
if you ask me...
nothing needs to change...absolutely nothing.
slack is perfect...^^
 
Old 11-24-2003, 10:29 AM   #32
Camasii
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Also about packages...

I got portage\emerge (a cool feature in gentoo, go check it out of you don't know what it is) working in slackware so pretty much any program I want I can get installed for me while I sit back and relax :P
 
Old 11-24-2003, 12:18 PM   #33
ratbert90
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There are just two things I would like to see changed in slack. And if it happened, then slack could become mainstream, and perhaps even become the most popular distro for newbs/vetrans alike!

a) Make an easier to use installer. I personally love the menu based installer, but it scares people away, especially new people =]

b) Make a graphical installer to .tgz's. This would be another thing that would make slackware so much better If you could just double click on a .tgz and have it install without giving you trouble, then slackware could become mainstream. And of course, you could install it via console still

just my 2 cents.
 
Old 11-24-2003, 01:37 PM   #34
DStar
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Quote:
a) Make an easier to use installer. I personally love the menu based installer, but it scares people away, especially new people =]
I don't think the menu-based installer scares people away. I think what actually scares people away are all those who SAY Slackware is hard to install. See DMRansom's post, for example.

That was exactly how I felt, when I decided to buy the CD set and install Slackware. After reading some forum posts, I got the impression that I would have to enter cryptic commands that I didn't know what they did, and edit unreadable (to humans) config files just to get up and running.

In reality, I only had to type TWO commands: cfdisk and setup. The rest was menu-driven and no harder to use than a point and click installer. Just use the arrow keys, enter and space, instead of the mouse.

There's even fewer commands to type for the slack install than for a typical Windows installation from Bootdisk. With Windows, you might find yourself cd'ing several times to get to the correct dir for each .exe, running not only fdisk, but also the format command, maybe even setting up a RAM disk...trying to load smartdrv to prevent the installation from taking a week etc.
Slackware is no more dificult to install than Windows, IMO.

The Mandrake installataion etc. are EASIER than Windows. I mean, it automates everything, and even resizes NTFS partitions for you to make room for Linux. You can essentially just click Next and use the defaults for the entire install and still get a perfectly working system.

Installation is an area where Linux has not only caught up with Windows (for the general population, the so called 'newbies'), but actually surpassed it.

What I would like to see in the Slackware installer is resizing of NTFS partitions. Not because it's newbie-friendly, but because it's very handy to have when installing Linux next to a Windows install.

Quote:
"b) Make a graphical installer to .tgz's. This would be another thing that would make slackware so much better If you could just double click on a .tgz and have it install without giving you trouble, then slackware could become mainstream. And of course, you could install it via console still
That would be nice. Someone (not me, I only do Visual Basic and some Java ) could easily make a front-end to the console version, don't you think? I'm beginning to LOVE .tgz's. Simple, brilliant, and it WORKS.

Quote:
It's not just a linux-thing :} ... but more common
here, since there's more than one DE/WM to
choose from ...
True, but that makes it even more important to keep things organized. Some automated database search maybe, so that it not just lists a cryptic name of a library that you need, but actually tells you WHERE to find it, maybe automatically downloads it even. Sometimes, I find myself trying to install something...a game...a simple utility for something...only to end up spending quite some time on Google, then downloading a 3 years old RPM that doesn't work and by the time I've actually managed to install all the required packages and files, I forgot what it was I originally wanted to install
 
Old 11-24-2003, 03:34 PM   #35
stevenhasty
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Quote:
Originally posted by synaptical
and Gnucash for slack would be nice, too -- i forgot to mention that.
I second that. I got gnucash to run on slack 9 by using instructions from rjmarq.org, but no luck with 9.1
 
Old 11-25-2003, 11:57 AM   #36
ratbert90
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I wasn't saying that people run away from things that they think are hard, but look how easy it is to set up mac osX or even windows.

People need pretty pictures to install something, not because thier scared of menu driven things, but it will make the mass majority feel comftorable installing slack =]
 
Old 11-25-2003, 01:14 PM   #37
jeramy
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I was surprised at how easy it was to install slack.

I was afraid that it wouldn't configure things for me correctly. Only thing that doesn't work is ACPI. It hangs when I run the ACPI kernel, and won't shut down when I run the bare kernel.

There are two things a newbie needs to be afraid of:
1: If they don't know about partitioning -- there should be more instructions, or a sample or something
2: After installing and coming up to a prompt. It would probably be better if the installer had a selection for adding a user, and a selection for booting directly into X.
 
Old 11-25-2003, 02:34 PM   #38
slakmagik
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Slack's installer gets you to the point of booting and getting a prompt as root. Everything else is gravy. It says 'You are now the administrator of a powerful command-line based system.' Adding a user and booting them into X says 'You are now a user of a GUI'.

And there's plenty of help in the install about partitioning if you ask for it and, arguably, it's not really the installer's job to help with installing, paradoxically. You've presumably done some research before you chose a distro to install and knowing that Linux expects partitions is kind of hard to avoid actually.

It's kind of the same argument as Windows vs. Linux. 'Linux should be more like Windows' doesn't make a whole lot of sense (though in certain respects it does) and 'Slack should install more like Distro XYZ' doesn't make a whole lot of sense, either. Basically every distro does install in more or less the same way except Debian (which is so pathetic even they know it *should* change) and Slack - which is fine; just different. So you could say, 'If you want an auto install that dumps you into X as user, install any other Linux distro' - make Slack more like everybody else and Slack becomes as redundant as everybody else.

I know that's not what you're saying, jeramy, and my post isn't just about what you said - seems like a lot of people are asking for the same kinds of stuff, though.
 
Old 11-25-2003, 04:38 PM   #39
Scruff
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There is soooooo many instructions on partitioning (or anything else you could ever care to know) all over the net. I typed 'linux disk partitioning" in Google just now, and got 82,000 results. The first page was almost all tutorial/howto's on the subject. It's like digiot said, people are expected to have done a little reseach before jumping into something. It's bascially the same with Windows if you had never used it before.

Also not directed at any one person. I have read a ton of posts related to this subject (several in this thread alone).

Last edited by Scruff; 11-25-2003 at 07:24 PM.
 
Old 11-25-2003, 06:21 PM   #40
DStar
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Quote:
I wasn't saying that people run away from things that they think are hard, but look how easy it is to set up mac osX or even windows.
I dunno. I actually found Slackware 9.1 EASIER to isntall than Windows. Not that I found either hard to install. Been installing various versions of Windows and DOS since Windows 3.0/DOS 5
Typically, there are fewer commands to type for Slackware (just cfdisk and setup) than for the Windows installation (especially from a DOS boot disk). The first part of the WinXP/2K installation is also menu-driven, and you have to be careful not to have it wipe out all your partitions when you're selecting which partition to install on . If you can get past the menu-based part of the Win2k/XP install, you can install Slackware as well.

Sure, it boots to a command line by default, but starting up KDE or your favorite window manager is so easy, that this really is a moot point...it doesn't take a rocket scientist to type "startx" and hit enter.
 
Old 11-26-2003, 09:31 AM   #41
hypermegachi
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i love slack. it's the only distro i've been able to set up, and _fix_ things. everything else i've tried, i would find a fix and it won't work again after a reboot. i used RH9, i overall liked it, but for some odd reason i couldn't get my sound card to work in 4 channels, i would have to unload and reload the sound module for 4 channels every reboot.

yes BSD style startup kicks major ass.

the install for slack was easy. the only hard thing *maybe* is the partitioning. but i've never trusted linux for partitioning so i always partition everything before a linux install, so all the linux installer has to do is pick the empty space. after that, it was what? like enter enter enter enter...yay finished install.

debian on the other hand is a bitch to install. i've never gotten the real debian to install on my system (3.0 is old as ever and barely detected anything on my system and i really really don't wanna install to ext2, and then copy everything over to another HD, then copy back to a ReiserFS). (i did get libranet to install...but doing an apt-get dist-upgrade always screwed up my system after the 3rd reinstall)....

con is the size of the swaret repositories...but i guess this would be a con to every distro compared to debian. dunno...it's nice to be able to use that single command to install any software instead of compiling from source (which i don't mind at all actually)

i agree with previous posters about hiding shit. slack doesn't hide much, and gives nice scripts to configure things, which i like.

and slack is very good as a newbie distro too...cuz really a newbie linux user wouldn't be screwing around much with system files would they?
 
Old 11-27-2003, 11:29 AM   #42
sirra462
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I have read several negative comments on Redhat and Suse and Mandrake, and granted a lot of those are well warranted, but who doesn't want ease of use? I like slackware too, but the biggest pain that I have with it is package installation, dependencies etc. That will drive me crazy when something pops up that I need that I never knew about. It justs feel like I am hacking around and making my computer dirty. I think slack would be number one if they took up an installer program like YaST. That is imo the best out there, so user friendly and optimizable. Slack is perfect in size, and is very fast. I don't know, I just would like to see a lot of hardware support across the board. I have Nforce2 chipset, and radeon 9800 Pro, and it really is a pain to configure both. I love linux, but I am not quite knowledgable to write my own driver files for these complicated devices. I guess the blame can be put squarely on the manufacturers and not the linux community. 2-3% use linux as a desktop environment so where is the initiative to write nice driver files? Also when they are written well (Nvidia, etc) you have to deal with installing them in a difficult manner in many cases. Well, I am rambling.
 
Old 12-03-2003, 10:01 AM   #43
thegeekster
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Hi all, just another n00b to Linux here ......I've just installed Slack 9.1 and googled for a firewall in Slack howto which brought me to this forum. and searching for firewall and Slack in this forum listed this thread, which makes for some interesting reading ....

This is a bit off-topic as far as what I like or dislike about Slack, but fits in with some of what's already been discussed here. There will be some bashing, but not trashing. Please bear with me. Switching from the Redmond-based OS, which I'm very familiar with, inside and out, I want to learn about the *n!x way of doing things.

Command lines and non-gui stuff doesn't scare me in the least, but user-friendly is definitely a plus for being able to get more things done. Having to write out commands can be a time-waster and subject to error for some things. I'm also tired of having to work around someone else's idea of how things should be done, or having the OS dial home behind my back to report what's inside my box.

I've tried other Linux distros and don't like what I'm seeing, another bloated OS. I hate bloat! I love the KISS principle. The current incarnation of Red Hat actually froze up on me a couple of times within hours after the install. Debian and it's derivatives (read KNOPPIX) actually messed up my startup BIOS in memory to where I couldn't do a "soft" boot. Rebooting after the installation created a system halt on the reboot. I had to shut the machine down completely so the BIOS could remap everything in memory. To be fair, part of this prob is no doubt due this HP Pavilion box I'm using, which uses a modded (from the factory) Asus K7M mobo with one of the RAM banks removed and uses a specially written Phoenix BIOS from HP instead of the standard Award BIOS for the board. (This board also doesn't always find my CD-RW during a reboot, too. )

Then there's Gentoo. I love the idea of compiling everything from source for a custom made system. And I learned about compiling the kernel, using both genkernel and the make commands (make menuconfig, make dep, make modules, etc) from installing Gentoo. But it takes several days for an install, and then there's the unusually large space portage uses up for its tree and sources. For me, I don't want to waste a couple of GB's of disk space. I'm multibooting Windows 98SE and Windows 2000 Pro (both in the same partition, no less), and can use all the space I can get.

I'm looking for the "pure" Linux experience of being able to do things as I feel they should be done, plus learning how to program in the *n!x environment. (I have dabbled in programming for the Windows environment.)

Then I finally tried Slackware. I didn't have any problems with installation. And I love the menu-driven, ncurses-type install setup. I don't think a gui-based installation is really a necessity, it would just be prettier to look at if you're into that sort of thing. But that's just a personal preference. I'm happy with it the way it is.

I also love booting into the console directly if I want to get behind the scenes for anything. And like DStar pointed out, typing "startx" to bring up the gui is a no-brainer. And logging out of the gui brings you back to the virtual console. What could be simpler? Again, having complete control of my box is what I'm looking for, and Slack is looking pretty good compared to the other distros I've tried.

The one down side so far is about the firewall. I would like to see it enabled during installation. I'm on a cable modem, so I'm hooked up to the net as soon as I'm booted up. Firestarter is looking pretty good, but I use KDE and not Gnome for the gui environment, so I don't know if there'll be any probs with it. Another one that caught my eye is Mason, the script-based wrapper. If anyone have any suggetions for a good firewall wrapper, gui or otherwise, I'm all ears.

I've only installed Slack several hours ago, but am in Windows as I write this until I get the firewall issue straightened out. I went to Steve's Gibson's site to test the box under Slack, and found out that I don't have much in the way of protection at this time. But that will change shortly.

Anyway, after reading some of the things about Slack in this thread, it sounds like what I'm looking for - lean and mean. I can't wait to put Slack through it's paces
 
Old 12-03-2003, 08:21 PM   #44
Tinkster
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Welcome to LQ and the Slackers forum ;)

Quote:
Originally posted by thegeekster
The one down side so far is about the firewall. I would like to see it enabled during installation. I'm on a cable modem, so I'm hooked up to the net as soon as I'm booted up. Firestarter is looking pretty good, but I use KDE and not Gnome for the gui environment, so I don't know if there'll be any probs with it. Another one that caught my eye is Mason, the script-based wrapper. If anyone have any suggetions for a good firewall wrapper, gui or otherwise, I'm all ears. :)
There's a misconception here :} ... Slack DOES come with a
firewall, it's just not set-up in any way, and doesn't come
with nifty tools :) ... iptables is there, and -really- that's all
ones needs if reading isn't too scary ;)

A site I like a lot is Easy Firewall Generator
It will set-up a firewall script for you, to your
specifications, and it comments it well so you
can actually understand what it's doing.

Quote:
I've only installed Slack several hours ago, but am in Windows as I write this until I get the firewall issue
straightened out. I went to Steve's Gibson's site to test the box under Slack, and found out that I don't have much in the way of protection at this time. But that will change shortly. ;)

Anyway, after reading some of the things about Slack in this thread, it sounds like what I'm looking for - lean and mean. I can't wait to put Slack through it's paces :Pengy:
By default slack should pretty tight. And as a fast
solution there's always the IPWRAPPER ... just shut
down what you don't need in /etc/inetd.conf and
put unwanted people (i.e., everyone) into
/etc/hosts.deny :)


Cheers,
Tink (Slack owns :})

Last edited by Tinkster; 12-03-2003 at 08:24 PM.
 
Old 12-03-2003, 08:25 PM   #45
Scruff
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Quote:
By default slack should pretty tight. And as a fast
solution there's always the IPWRAPPER ... just shut
down what you don't need in /etc/inetd.conf and
put unwanted people (i.e., everyone) into
/etc/hosts.deny
Add the line:
all:all
to your /etc/hosts.deny file

Welcome to LQ and Slackware!!!
 
  


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