Why aren't all the Distro forums like this one?

I would also like to take this opportunity to thank all, whoever have helped me solve my problems.

I think this is the true spirit (also strength) of linux.


hardik

"If you want to learn <distro>, then install <distro>. If you want to learn Linux, install Slackware."

I don't agree with this statement. There is no specific standard for Linux distros so someone who knows Slack does not necessarily know "Linux" because other distros are different. I agree with Hari, that this statement is kind of elitist and I have seen it being thrown around by Slackers on other sites because they feel superior to other Linux users because they are running Slack. I have noticed something similar with a certain group of Gentoo users.

LQ has a large community of Slackers, so there are more chances of questions being answered. Many Slackers on this site take their distro seriously and are quite helpful to other Slackers (which I found out myself when I used Slack). On other forums, I have noticed many who are arrogant and unhelpful. Something else I have noticed in the Slack forum is that there aren't many duplicate threads, which can keep people interested in helping out.

Originally Posted by reddazz I don't agree with this statement. There is no specific standard for Linux distros so someone who knows Slack does not necessarily know "Linux" because other distros are different.

If the statement is taken as an absolute then it is of course false. However, from what I have seen, it is used by most to be a general observation (with some obvious exceptions), and I would have to say that it has also been my experience that you can often take more away from Slack and apply it to other Linux environments than with a lot of other distros. This does not make Slack "better", nor does it mean that everyone will share the same experience.

Originally Posted by reddazz On other forums, I have noticed many who are arrogant and unhelpful.

I think we can all agree there are always bad eggs around, no matter the association.

... you can often take more away from Slack and apply it to other Linux environments than with a lot of other distros.

Personally I think the knowledge gained on any Linux distro can help you in other Linux or Unix environments because the basics of how the OSes work is the same. If you are willing to look under the hood, you will learn a lot and that knowledge is easily transferable between distros and other Unix OSes. The only reason why many people are of the opinion that you learn a lot with Slack is that its very hands on, just like Gentoo, Arch, LFS etc.

Much more elegantly and succinctly put than the post I've just written, Xian, thank you!

I'll leave the last paragraph =)

"Ok, I've said my piece and will resume helping anyone who turns up, regardless of distro, who can bring me an interesting problem."

- Piete.

I agree with everybody here. Slack definetly is a great Distro to start learning linux. I also really loved Gentoo as well. I had a blast learning how to install that one. But Slack is a perfect place to start. I rarely have ever had to ask a question here. I can always search and find my answer. But no matter what distro I use. I always seem to find myself going back to Slack. As J.W. said. Slack just has a place in my heart.

Originally Posted by BobNutfield Hi everybody, Just a comment. I run three distros at home (Ubuntu, FC4 & 5, Mepis, and Slack).

Isnt that 4?
I have to agree, there always seems to be help in the slack forum, Dont know why, thats just the way it is.

Regarding the "if you want to learn..." quote, it's been around for years and it does have some basis in fact. Specifically, when running certain tasks (eg installing new packages) many distros will shield the user from the actual commands being run by concealing them behind a nice looking GUI. In contrast, Slack puts a heavier emphasis on the CLI, which has a tendency to educate the user much more thoroughly. Consider installing new packages: if you're using SuSE, what you learn is that you just need to launch YaST to add new packages. If you're using Slack however, you will learn the 5 step CLI method of installing packages (eg, "tar -zxvf <package>" and so forth), and knowing how to manually install software via the CLI is a tranferable skill. Someone who has that knowledge can work with any distro, but if someone only knows how to use a particular GUI (eg YaST), that knowledge will only be useful while using that one particular distro. Hence, "...if you want to learn Linux, install Slack"

To use an analogy, consider how phone numbers can be saved in a cell phone's memory, and let's suppose that "A" makes a habit of calling his friends by pressing one single button, while "B" always calls his friends by dialing the full number. Now suppose that the phone's battery runs out or it gets left behind in a taxi. Who's going to be better off - the person who actually knows his friend's numbers, or the person who relies completely on his cell to remember them for him?

Regarding the "if you want to learn..." quote, it's been around for years and it does have some basis in fact. Specifically, when running certain tasks (eg installing new packages) many distros will shield the user from the actual commands being run by concealing them behind a nice looking GUI. In contrast, Slack puts a heavier emphasis on the CLI, which has a tendency to educate the user much more thoroughly.

I don't think there's anything universal about the Slackware package management system. I should think DEBs and RPMs are more popular. And in any case that quote *does* smack of elitism whenever somebody puts it, whatever they might mean.

There is no inherent virtue in antiquity. Because it's been around for years doesn't make it true...

Remember, I am pro-Linux and anti-nothing. To me, Slackware is just a distro - a great distro that's been around for the longest, but that doesn't give it any special status within the community. That also doesn't mean that the Slackware community is superior to the communities of any other distros. You can learn Linux on any Linux system, not just Slackware. Just because Slackware forces somebody to learn, that's not necessarily a virtue for everybody.

As I said before, I don't claim any special status within this community just because I use multiple distros. But it always irritates me whenever a Slackware user tries to denigrate other distros by claiming to be superior and using that quote, which I must admit annoys me a lot...

Sorry for ranting on, but I feel quite strongly about that quotation: when you use Slackware, you learn Linux etc. etc. I know from experience that this learning process just doesn't follow... Every user has his/her own needs and levels of learning and you can learn a lot using any other Linux distro.

To use an analogy, consider how phone numbers can be saved in a cell phone's memory, and let's suppose that "A" makes a habit of calling his friends by pressing one single button, while "B" always calls his friends by dialing the full number. Now suppose that the phone's battery runs out or it gets left behind in a taxi. Who's going to be better off - the person who actually knows his friend's numbers, or the person who relies completely on his cell to remember them for him?

I cannot quite understand how that analogy relates to this. Human beings have always sought easier and easier ways of doing complicated things. The evolution from machine language to assembly to high-level languages is similar to your analogy and it doesn't quite relate to comparing on a horizontal level like different Linux distros.

As you said, cell phones store numbers in memory, but that doesn't quite prevent you from typing the number every time you want. Those who don't want that memory feature can well not use it rather than asking the manufacturer to remove that phone memory altogether. What I want to say is that the option to store the phone memory is a great one for many people. Imagine a cell phone tomorrow which comes with no memory to store phone numbers and telling the customers that to use it you need to use your brains...

Originally Posted by Harishankar Human beings have always sought easier and easier ways of doing complicated things. The evolution from machine language to assembly to high-level languages is similar to your analogy and it doesn't quite relate to comparing on a horizontal level like different Linux distros.

High level languages are not able to do full low-level interaction with hardware, that's why learning low-level programming language (assembly) is good.

and knowing how to manually install software via the CLI is a tranferable skill. Someone who has that knowledge can work with any distro, but if someone only knows how to use a particular GUI (eg YaST), that knowledge will only be useful while using that one particular distro. Hence, "...if you want to learn Linux, install Slack"

maybe slackers are just better at hacking things together? we got lots of practice.

High level languages are not able to do full low-level interaction with hardware, that's why learning low-level programming language (assembly) is good.

The question is, should every programmer be forced to do assembly/machine level coding?

Originally Posted by reddazz Personally I think the knowledge gained on any Linux distro can help you in other Linux or Unix environments because the basics of how the OSes work is the same. If you are willing to look under the hood, you will learn a lot and that knowledge is easily transferable between distros and other Unix OSes. The only reason why many people are of the opinion that you learn a lot with Slack is that its very hands on, just like Gentoo, Arch, LFS etc.

That is why I like Slack. I can easily 'get under the hood'. On some other distro's, you get the feeling that is forbidden....

As for why this forum is helpful, and friendly:

It's the community. End of story.

Originally Posted by Harishankar And in any case that quote *does* smack of elitism whenever somebody puts it, whatever they might mean.

To me, this statement just means that Slackware as a distro teaches you how things work. And that's true.

A similar statement can be found on Distrowatch:

Perhaps the best characteristic of this distribution I have heard is this: if you need help with your Linux box, find a Slackware user. A Slackware user is more likely to fix the problem than a user familiar with any other distribution.

Just a quick comment on the thread. The eagerness of slackware people to help out others on this forum is obvious, and that's a good thing. In my own observations, Debian and Slack have by far the best support community here. One of the reasons I switched from Redhat/Fedora was exactly that.

I would caution you all, tho, to be cautious about encouraging newbies to use Slack because, that way they'll really learn Linux. The conversion from Windows to Linux is pretty overwhelming anyway, and by the looks of some questions I see, quite a number of people bite off more than they can chew trying to dive directly onto that deep water.

My own 'truism' would be that if you want to learn Linux, get Slack ... If you want to learn to use Linux productively, get Debian.

There are, however, lots of reasons for people to choose other distros; some of them are even GOOD reasons. Anyway, a nod of approval to the the Slackers from me, but ... Debian Rules!