LinuxQuestions.org
Visit Jeremy's Blog.
Go Back   LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Linux Forums > Linux - Distributions > Slackware
User Name
Password
Slackware This Forum is for the discussion of Slackware Linux.

Notices


Reply
  Search this Thread
Old 07-10-2018, 12:55 PM   #31
kjhambrick
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jul 2005
Location: Round Rock, TX
Distribution: Slackware64 14.2 + Multilib
Posts: 1,366

Rep: Reputation: 747Reputation: 747Reputation: 747Reputation: 747Reputation: 747Reputation: 747Reputation: 747

Nick ( enorbit ) ...

How can you be in two places at once when you're not anywhere at all ?

Now the gum's on the other shoe ...

Thanks for the memories

-- kjh
 
Old 07-10-2018, 01:35 PM   #32
the3dfxdude
Member
 
Registered: May 2007
Posts: 561

Rep: Reputation: 236Reputation: 236Reputation: 236
Quote:
Originally Posted by santaslilslacker View Post
ATI - Auto Torture Interface... aka great hardware, superior picture and pathetic drivers either on linux or on windows. Gave them a chance few times but each attempt ended in self-loathing. Weird errors, weird screen behavior, weird suspend errors, screen artifacts, keyboard lockups, machine lockups, hair pulling, cursing those two dudes that patch that POS driver for linux, sad driver installations that sometimes work, sometimes don't...
Nowadays my friends with newer ATIs swear that they are as good nvidia's drivers. I don't care, never had any problems with single nvidia card since ti420, and that one was really long long time ago installed on my computer. Even on my laptop I have zero problems with bumblebee.
TLDR - try both if you can and see for your self. Or play safe and go nvidia - either nv driver or nvidia blob. From my previous experiences i'd rather stab myself than buy ATI VGA again. YMMV
GF Ti 4200? That was along time ago. That was about the time I was looking at switching to the equivalent Radeon, because Nvidia refused to support their OSS driver, even though they could have. You missed the boat, because that is when the Radeon OSS driver just became stable for ATI's current line-up after the disastrous first attempt to a proprietary driver on linux. You probably tried the proprietary driver.
 
Old 07-10-2018, 08:54 PM   #33
Regnad Kcin
Member
 
Registered: Jan 2014
Location: Beijing
Distribution: Slackware 64 -current .
Posts: 138

Rep: Reputation: 84
No anchovies?
You've got the wrong man.

Slackware?
Yeah, it's really neat.
 
Old 07-10-2018, 11:56 PM   #34
Richard Cranium
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2009
Location: Carrollton, Texas
Distribution: Slackware64 14.2
Posts: 3,000

Rep: Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjhambrick View Post
Nick ( enorbit ) ...

How can you be in two places at once when you're not anywhere at all ?

Now the gum's on the other shoe ...

Thanks for the memories

-- kjh
I'm ashamed that I didn't notice until a couple of months ago what Regnad Kcin meant.

sigh
 
Old 07-11-2018, 12:03 AM   #35
Richard Cranium
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2009
Location: Carrollton, Texas
Distribution: Slackware64 14.2
Posts: 3,000

Rep: Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisretusn View Post
Right now I am rendering a Blender project I downloaded to test. It has been chugging along now for about 4 hours. When it's done, I will revert back to the nouveau drive and do it again. Bench marks are subjective, much depending on hardware, not really gonna bother with that as it serves no purpose for me since I sort of stuck with the hardware that I have.
I have messed around with building Blender with cudatoolkit support built in.

It did make a difference, but I don't do that much Blender work and have since dropped back to the nouveau driver.
 
Old 07-11-2018, 11:15 AM   #36
enorbet
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Virginia
Distribution: Slackware = Main OpSys for decades while testing others to keep up
Posts: 1,892

Rep: Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Cranium View Post
I'm ashamed that I didn't notice until a couple of months ago what Regnad Kcin meant.

sigh
No shame...perhaps you just needed a powerful gasoline or a clean windshield.
 
Old 07-11-2018, 09:29 PM   #37
Regnad Kcin
Member
 
Registered: Jan 2014
Location: Beijing
Distribution: Slackware 64 -current .
Posts: 138

Rep: Reputation: 84
Quote:
Originally Posted by enorbet View Post
No shame...perhaps you just needed a powerful gasoline or a clean windshield.

...and a shoeshine.




Shoes for Industry, compadre'.
 
Old 07-12-2018, 03:14 AM   #38
chrisretusn
Member
 
Registered: Dec 2005
Location: Philippines
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 789

Rep: Reputation: 289Reputation: 289Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Cranium View Post
I have messed around with building Blender with cudatoolkit support built in.

It did make a difference, but I don't do that much Blender work and have since dropped back to the nouveau driver.
Thanks for that. May first attempt at rendering did not give me the results I was looking for. I rendered an animation, after reading a bit and learning a few things. I rendered an image from a sample I got from the blender web site (slash279). That took 7:14:29:03 (h:m:s:ss) to render (cycles). I am currently rendering the same image with CUDA enabled. It is currently at the 3:44 mark with 4:24 to go. Next will be with nouveau. Then I am done with blender, it really needs a dedicated machine, which I do not have.

Last edited by chrisretusn; 07-12-2018 at 11:50 AM. Reason: Corrections.
 
Old 07-12-2018, 10:57 AM   #39
chrisretusn
Member
 
Registered: Dec 2005
Location: Philippines
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 789

Rep: Reputation: 289Reputation: 289Reputation: 289
Well the Blender render is done. With CUDA enabled the run time was 7:26:21:07, longer than with it not enabled. Now I was doing some of things while this was running, but nothing very CPU or GPU intensive. I've decided to go back the nouveau driver, I may run this again over night. I pretty much decided that while it might be neat to learn, I really don't need Blender. I will stick with the nouveau driver now that Steam works with it.
 
Old 07-12-2018, 06:19 PM   #40
santaslilslacker
Member
 
Registered: Nov 2007
Distribution: Slackware64_current
Posts: 34

Rep: Reputation: 9
Quote:
Originally Posted by the3dfxdude View Post
GF Ti 4200? That was along time ago. That was about the time I was looking at switching to the equivalent Radeon, because Nvidia refused to support their OSS driver, even though they could have. You missed the boat, because that is when the Radeon OSS driver just became stable for ATI's current line-up after the disastrous first attempt to a proprietary driver on linux. You probably tried the proprietary driver.
Yep it was long, long time ago, after I replaced my dearest voodoo 3 with radeon 8500... Card was great, with better image quality and some performance boost over ti4200. Except of that mess of drivers where q3 or ut would cause kernel panic or funky screen artefacts Tried few times afterwards with random radeons but all I can remember is pain and self-loathing .
 
Old 07-12-2018, 09:22 PM   #41
chrisretusn
Member
 
Registered: Dec 2005
Location: Philippines
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 789

Rep: Reputation: 289Reputation: 289Reputation: 289
The Blender render with nouveau took 7:12:16:42.

Code:
Blender render result summary :
nouveau       7h 12m
NVIDIA        7h 14m
NVIDIA (CUDA) 7h 26m

Kdenlive render summary:
nouveau 13h 42m
NVIDIA  13h 04m
It's only one test each, non dedicated computer, which would effect those times, so the results are subjective. I was a bit surprised with the CUDA results. I thought it would be faster. As far as I am concerned the nouveau driver wins. Not necessarily because of the times. Mostly because I can go with what comes with Slackware and not mess with the NVIDIA driver. The ONLY reason I went with NVIDIA drivers "was" because of need. That need is gone now.

My final opinion of "To nvidia or not to nvidia..." is unless you need NVIDIA stick with what works.
 
Old 07-13-2018, 02:08 PM   #42
phalange
Member
 
Registered: May 2018
Distribution: Arch, Slackware, Fedora, Centos
Posts: 48

Original Poster
Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisretusn View Post
My final opinion of "To nvidia or not to nvidia..." is unless you need NVIDIA stick with what works.
I found that my screen was failing to resume from suspend although the rest of the laptop responded normally. I suspected the nouveau driver so I finally installed the nvidia driver this morning.

The suspend issue was fixed (presumably by the nvidia driver, but of course this is correlational).

My impressions are that the install process was slightly more involved than a typical slackbuild but easy work overall, and that the system is sharper and quicker with the new driver. Much as predicted by the forum.

I was rooting for nouveau, and pleased to see how far it's come. My previous experiences with it have been pretty unpleasant. But for now, it looks like I'll stick with the nvidia drivers in Slackware as I do in others.

The forum has had good perspectives for me and hopefully for others. @chrisretusn, great seeing actual data comparing speeds.
 
Old 07-14-2018, 09:21 AM   #43
chrisretusn
Member
 
Registered: Dec 2005
Location: Philippines
Distribution: Slackware
Posts: 789

Rep: Reputation: 289Reputation: 289Reputation: 289
I have two laptops, both use Slackware64-current, one has Intel the other AMD graphics. My desktops all have NVIDIA cards.

Agree that nouveau has come a long way. I used the nouveau driver for a very long time until I setup Steam. Then when with the NVIDIA driver. I notice a distinct difference on boot up with the boot up sequence between the NVIDIA and the nouveau driver. The nouveau driver is brighter and sharper that with the NVIDIA driver. I like the nouveau driver. Like I said earlier it's really based on needs and what works.

At long, long, time ago in a land far away... <grin> I tried the SlackBuilds for NVIDIA, it was not a good experience, so rather than mess with getting them to work, I went with the blob. I can't remember the circumstance on why I went to NVIDIA over nouveau though. At some point I did go back to the nouveau driver until I installed Steam. Now that the nouveau driver, xorg-server combination provides what Steam wants, I am back to nouveau.
 
2 members found this post helpful.
Old 07-14-2018, 03:18 PM   #44
enorbet
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Virginia
Distribution: Slackware = Main OpSys for decades while testing others to keep up
Posts: 1,892

Rep: Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789Reputation: 1789
OK I suppose it's time for a different shootout with actual number scores and with some attention to acceleration, especially 3D acceleration, but also simple desktop performance. So first, the test beds which is all on my boxen with an i5 Quad Core 3550, 8GB Ram, and an nVidia GTX 1070 Ti. I tried re-installing nouveau for a couple of hours to use the exact same OpSys but ran into difficulties with the kernel modules on my custom 4.15.0 kernel so I ran the nouveau test on the latest as of today SlackLive from a DVD and SlackLive on hdd install from three months ago that is still a completely default install other than Conky and the proprietary nvidia driver, so other than the drivers comparable systems on identical hardware.

NOTE: It may be important that I am comparing a stock 14.2+ system, one with nouveau built-in and one with nouveau blacklisted and nvidia installed in that there may well be steps some here more familiar take with nouveau that substantially improves it's performance on basic desktop or accelerated or 3D apps.

My SlackLive DVD is the full 3.1GB version so it boots to the KDM desktop chooser. It took 24 seconds to get from login to desktop. So the first difference is that the hdd install took 5 seconds to do the same job. I can't say how much of LiveSlack is loaded to ram vs/ read from disk but everything felt slower and "clunkier" with nouveau, but still basically usable. I don't know of a good basic desktop function benchmark so all I have is this anecdotal experience that I could live with nouveau had I not experienced nvidia with one probably huge caveat - ON THIS HARDWARE.

Now for the crusher. I tried to run the latest Unigine Heaven benchmark and frankly I was a bit surprised and impressed that nouveau actually loaded the welcome/setup screen. I also tried just for grins to use the extreme settings I've tested out many times with the nvidia driver where literally EVERYTHING is maxed out - tesselation, vSync, antialiasing, sound, Ultra base setting... the works.

At first I was again impressed that the menu appeared at the top with nouveau but the screen remained black throughout (with the exception of the blue radio buttons just mentioned) and then I noticed the little balloon in the upper right reporting "FPS = 1" and that there was no mouse cursor. Eventually the cursor did show up but whenever I clicked a menuitem there was a delay of over 10 seconds before it would register. It took a long while to close the application but it did finally close and I reset to "Basic" which is tesselation disabled, no antialiasing, no vSync no sound, and in a window half the size of system full screen. The only difference was the delay was around 2 seconds but the screen remained black and the little FPS bubble still never advanced beyond "1" but for a brief moment in which I saw "2".

Now for the nividia driver and hdd system. Everything was instantaneous on the desktop and as I said it only took 5 seconds to load initially as opposed to 24. I never set Heaven down to "Basic" but ran it wide open, everything maxed as far as it can possibly go

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unigine Heaven
FPS: 81.9
Score: 2062
Min FPS: 9.0
Max FPS: 156.4

System
Platform: Linux 4.15.0-smp i686
CPU model: Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3550 CPU @ 3.30GHz (3300MHz) x4
GPU model: GeForce GTX 1070 Ti PCI Express 390.48 (8192MB) x1
Settings
Render: OpenGL
Mode: 1920x1080 8xAA fullscreen
Preset: Custom
Quality: Ultra
Tessellation: Extreme
Note: The nvidia test results are better on my main system which is substantially tweaked for performance where the two test beds were essentially stock.

SO I conclude that while nouveau does a decent enough job at basic 2D desktop, BY COMPARIOSON it is woefully inadequate for serious 3D and accelerated functions with high performance hardware.

IMPORTANT! That said, I must add that I mean no disrespect to the nouveau team in fact quite the opposite. They are fighting an uphill battle on a constantly moving target which may explain why people here using aged and/or "lowball" technology are experiencing less of the dramatic differences I have encountered. Hopefully nvidia will take note of AMD/ATi's success in OpenSource to the point of inclusion of extremely good kernel drivers now built-in the linux kernel and finally give nouveau "a reacharound" to improve it's standing with FOSS.

Also it is possible that running from a DVD contributed to these results but other apps open and run as fast or faster than my hdd isntall due to running from ram. I just don't know how much of SlackLive runs from Ram vs/ Disk. However i would be soundly shocked if that even in worst case even allowed Basic Heaven to run at all let alone at Ultra.

Last edited by enorbet; 07-14-2018 at 03:22 PM.
 
2 members found this post helpful.
Old 07-14-2018, 08:18 PM   #45
Richard Cranium
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2009
Location: Carrollton, Texas
Distribution: Slackware64 14.2
Posts: 3,000

Rep: Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374Reputation: 1374
When I run Unigine Heaven Benchmark 4.0 with the nouveau driver, the benchmark results are:

Code:
FPS:	 1.9
Score:	 49
Min FPS: 1.4
Max FPS: 3.3

System:

Platform:	Linux 4.4.132 x86_64
CPU model:	AMD Phenom(tm) II X6 1100T Processor (3409MHz) x6
GPU model:	Unknown GPU (256MB) x1

The card is actually an ASUS GT-640 2GD3

Settings:
Render:	OpenGL
Mode:	1920x1080 2xAA fullscreen
Preset:	Custom
Quality:	High
Stereo:	Horizontal
Tessellation:	Normal
Now I'm curious. I'll install the nvidia drivers and see what the delta turns out to be.
 
  


Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Can't Install nVidia Drivers without Failed to Initialize the NVIDIA GPU at PCI Error FreakofPurple Linux - Laptop and Netbook 1 08-29-2014 12:30 AM
[SOLVED] Instructions on how to make nVidia GTX645 graphics card run using nVidia in RHEL 6.5 anthony000 Linux - Newbie 12 04-11-2014 11:42 AM
Can't build nvidia.ko on MEPIS3.3. Read /usr.../nvidia-kernelsource/README.debian digorykirke Linux - Software 0 03-16-2005 02:10 AM
Nvidia fx5500 mandrake 10.1 problem:Nvidia in /etc/modprobe.preload doesn't work eikeland Linux - Hardware 5 01-17-2005 02:09 PM
kernel 2.6.3--bk8 and NVIDIA-Linux-x86-1.0-5336 video driver from Nvidia zdenkod Linux - Hardware 2 03-09-2004 05:38 AM

LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Linux Forums > Linux - Distributions > Slackware

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:43 AM.

Main Menu
Advertisement
My LQ
Write for LQ
LinuxQuestions.org is looking for people interested in writing Editorials, Articles, Reviews, and more. If you'd like to contribute content, let us know.
Main Menu
Syndicate
RSS1  Latest Threads
RSS1  LQ News
Twitter: @linuxquestions
Facebook: linuxquestions Google+: linuxquestions
Open Source Consulting | Domain Registration