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Old 10-12-2017, 03:33 PM   #286
GazL
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PSA: Avoid 4.9.55 and go directly to .56.

https://lwn.net/Articles/736214/
Quote:
I'm announcing the release of the 4.9.56 kernel. It fixes a networking
bug in 4.9.55. Don't use 4.9.55, it's busted, sorry about that, I
should have held off and gotten more testing on it, my fault

FWIW, 4.13.6 seems to be working ok here.
 
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Old 10-12-2017, 03:42 PM   #287
cwizardone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GazL View Post
....FWIW, 4.13.6 seems to be working ok here.
Ditto!
All is well.
 
Old 10-12-2017, 09:02 PM   #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwizardone View Post
Just installed the "Dusk" 4.13.5 kernel and so far, so good.


"Dave's Unofficial Slackbuilt Kernels," aka, DUSK, can be found at,

https://dusk.idlemoor.tk/

What's the point of using this?

If someone is going to compile their own kernel, then they should know/learn what the kernel options are, and compile in what they need.
 
Old 10-12-2017, 09:25 PM   #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LQSlacker View Post
What's the point of using this?

If someone is going to compile their own kernel, then they should know/learn what the kernel options are, and compile in what they need.
It is an automated setup. Every new kernel release gets automatically built. The code for the script is available, so you can do it yourself with your own kernel config.

But 55020 (the developer) has made his kernel builds available for others to use. He uses the Slackware kernel config for the 4.4 kernel in 14.2 (so 14.2 users can just grab the latest kernel release once it's available rather than wait to see if Pat puts out a security update). He did have a 4.9 available, but Pat has been pretty active in keeping -current on the latest 4.9 kernel, so 55020 felt is was unnecessary to duplicate that work. So, for the 4.12 and 4.13 kernels, he makes configs that he thinks Pat would make and uses those.

You're free to use his script and use your own config to build your own kernels once they're released by kernel.org, or you can use his pre-built kernels if you're ok with that. He is a trusted member of the community (and is one of the SBo admins), so many trust his kernel builds and use them.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 12:49 AM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bassmadrigal View Post
It is an automated setup. Every new kernel release gets automatically built. The code for the script is available, so you can do it yourself with your own kernel config.

But 55020 (the developer) has made his kernel builds available for others to use. He uses the Slackware kernel config for the 4.4 kernel in 14.2 (so 14.2 users can just grab the latest kernel release once it's available rather than wait to see if Pat puts out a security update). He did have a 4.9 available, but Pat has been pretty active in keeping -current on the latest 4.9 kernel, so 55020 felt is was unnecessary to duplicate that work. So, for the 4.12 and 4.13 kernels, he makes configs that he thinks Pat would make and uses those.

You're free to use his script and use your own config to build your own kernels once they're released by kernel.org, or you can use his pre-built kernels if you're ok with that. He is a trusted member of the community (and is one of the SBo admins), so many trust his kernel builds and use them.

Well I guess the point is being lazy LOL...

Slackware users were not like this long ago, peeps like this that need everything automated are using the wrong distro...

I was smiling too btw above, just in case someone thought I was being bitchy...

It's great this person wants to contribute something like this, but really it's not helping Slackers be Slackers.

Remember Slackware is a hands on distro, you need a new kernel, you learn and compile your own.

If we're going to spoon feed everyone, well what's the point of running Slackware?

This is the last and all I'll say, there's no discussing this, I know what Slackware is, and Slackware is not about automated or being lazy...

NO need to reply to my post, I won't be reading anymore or replying back.

If you don't know what Slackware is, or what it stands for, then please learn.

Automated users, the door to Ubuntu and apt-get is to distrowatch.com LMAO

Last edited by LQSlacker; 10-13-2017 at 12:55 AM.
 
Old 10-13-2017, 01:14 AM   #291
bassmadrigal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LQSlacker View Post
Well I guess the point is being lazy LOL...

Slackware users were not like this long ago, peeps like this that need everything automated are using the wrong distro...
You do realize there's two aspects of this project, right? The first is the script that will build the new releases from kernel.org in your preferred kernel series once they're released by kernel.org. This is huge considering how many CVEs pop up for the kernels. You are able to take this script and set it up using your own config and building the newest versions of whatever kernel series you prefer. The second part is actually using his script to build his own kernels, which he graciously provides to others. You are certainly not required to use his kernels to use his script.

I don't see how you could say that people are using the wrong distro if they're using his kernels. If we were to hold to your ideal of a Slacker, everyone would be running Gentoo or LFS. What's the difference between this and installing the official packages provided by Pat, or multilib and/or ktown provided by Eric? If it is strictly related to trust, then I guess it is up to you to determine the trust level of the individual who is providing the packages. But 55020 is a strong member of the Slackware community and was trusted enough to become an admin for SBo. I don't think trust is an issue here. If it is related to your so-called "laziness", should every machine compile its own kernel? If you're not required to compile the whole distro, why should you be required to compile the kernel? Should every person dig through make menuconfig to ensure their kernel is set up properly? If you're fine using the stock Slackware kernel, then, assuming this kernel works fine for you, you should be fine using this one.

I have been running Slackware for over a decade. Long ago, I determined that it just wasn't worth my time to build a custom kernel, stripping out everything I didn't need. The gains provided by it just weren't worth the time. There's been a few times recently I've ventured into compiling my own kernels, but it is usually due to a newer feature in a kernel that I'm interested in, not stripping things out to make my kernel leaner (there really weren't any noticeable gains when I did that).

Do you really think that every Slackware user should be able to wade through all the kernel options? That's absurd and is an extremely high entry point to be able to use a binary-based distro. You can install Slackware without any knowledge of what the kernel does, and I don't think that slackers who don't/can't compile there own kernel need to find a new distro.

Just because you use something that is automated doesn't mean you don't know how to do it without automation. Should slackpkg be removed from the distro because you can manually download and upgradepkg the patches/ directory from your favorite mirror? Should users specify an exact /etc/X11/xorg.conf file even though xorg is able to autodetect many setups without any xorg.conf files?

If you're happy enough with 55020's pre-compiled kernels, isn't the Slackware way to be lazy and let someone else do your work for you? That is why we have slackbuilds.org and the slonly repo, you know... There's a reason many of us aren't using Gentoo or LFS and use a pre-compiled distro.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 01:37 AM   #292
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May as well strip if you're building kernels from source, there's no point tuning it for intel if you build for amd or vice-versa.
I think dusk is intended for distributors' generic builds.
 
Old 10-13-2017, 01:56 AM   #293
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I've always seen scripting repetitive tasks as kernel building like something that gets me toward the Slack but who knows, it may manifest differently for others... whatever rocks your boat, man..

in these cases I feel like the grandmother of a friend: she had washed a lot of clothes manually over the years, and when they finally bought a washing machine she used to stand in front of it while it was functioning saying something like: "now YOU do the washing!"

Last edited by ponce; 10-13-2017 at 03:34 AM.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 04:42 AM   #294
55020
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LQSlacker View Post
Well I guess the point is being lazy LOL...
Slackware users were not like this long ago, peeps like this that need everything automated are using the wrong distro...
I was smiling too btw above, just in case someone thought I was being bitchy...
It's great this person wants to contribute something like this, but really it's not helping Slackers be Slackers.
Remember Slackware is a hands on distro, you need a new kernel, you learn and compile your own.
If we're going to spoon feed everyone, well what's the point of running Slackware?
This is the last and all I'll say, there's no discussing this, I know what Slackware is, and Slackware is not about automated or being lazy...
NO need to reply to my post, I won't be reading anymore or replying back.
If you don't know what Slackware is, or what it stands for, then please learn.
Automated users, the door to Ubuntu and apt-get is to distrowatch.com LMAO
Well in case anybody else is interested in actual answers, here's why I did this.

(1) Some people have been conditioned to expect that only the 'latest' kernel is secure, and making it readily available might diminish the hassle that the Slackware team gets.

(2) Give people a quick and easy way of troubleshooting hardware/kernel problems, and maybe give the community some more info about which versions of the kernel are "good" and which are "bad", and therefore whether it's going to be worth the hassle of building a kernel yourself.

(3) Research into 'reproducible builds', because trust is very relevant when you're installing stuff someone else built.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 05:01 AM   #295
Didier Spaier
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@55020: David, thanks for elaborating on your rationale for providing these kernels, and for providing a well thought answer to a post that didn't deserve an answer at all.

I am grateful for your tremendous contributions to us, Slackware users.

Last edited by Didier Spaier; 10-13-2017 at 05:04 AM. Reason: Wording modified
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 05:53 AM   #296
GazL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 55020 View Post
(1) Some people have been conditioned to expect that only the 'latest' kernel is secure
I don't think that any version is "secure" (latest or otherwise) but given linus' infamous "bugs are just bugs" standpoint which means that security fixes get no special treatment I hold the view that following the latest stable patch version is the prudent approach. I'd much rather see a BSD style security errata approach where one can stay with a known good kernel version and just apply important security updates, but that's not how linux release-engineering works.

Now, with the stable Slackware releases, Pat has to weigh any potential security risk vs any disruption to his users from a kernel update. I don't need to worry about that and I'm free to take a more absolute position.


You may not agree with my views here, but I assure you it's a "considered" rather than "conditioned" position.


I think your kernels are a useful service for people, even if it seems like you're not so sure.

Last edited by GazL; 10-13-2017 at 06:04 AM.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 06:30 AM   #297
55020
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Thanks GazL for a perfectly reasoned reply: your advice about kernel security is a very useful input (well, for me, anyway) and not so sure is so accurate that it's now my new mission statement
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 08:47 AM   #298
bassmadrigal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LQSlacker View Post
I was smiling too btw above, just in case someone thought I was being bitchy...

It's great this person wants to contribute something like this, but really it's not helping Slackers be Slackers.

Remember Slackware is a hands on distro, you need a new kernel, you learn and compile your own.

If we're going to spoon feed everyone, well what's the point of running Slackware?

This is the last and all I'll say, there's no discussing this, I know what Slackware is, and Slackware is not about automated or being lazy...

NO need to reply to my post, I won't be reading anymore or replying back.

If you don't know what Slackware is, or what it stands for, then please learn.

Automated users, the door to Ubuntu and apt-get is to distrowatch.com LMAO
I didn't see your edit before I wrote my post. And what a copout to say you won't read anything else or reply to anything. Sounds like a child who shoves their fingers in their ears when you try to tell them something they don't want to hear.

But I hope you aren't using slackbuilds.org, pkgtools, slackpkg, adduser, mkinitrd_command_generator.sh, or even the binary packages Pat provides. All that automation makes you weak. *gasp* Are you using the Slackware installer and helper scripts? Can't you manually extract the packages to the filesystem and set up your networking using conf files instead of netconfig? I'll also assume you never write scripts to help with repetitive tasks. That's just more "automation" that is ruining Slackware /s

With *your* ideals of what a "slacker" should be, it sounds like that "slacker" should actually be using LFS (except they shouldn't be using the LFS website, because that helps people when they should learn how to do it themselves).

And who are you to say what a slacker should even be?! Have a look at http://www.slackware.com/~alien/tools/ and see how many automated scripts are provided by Alien Bob (Eric Hameleers), who is one of the core team members for Slackware.

Slackware is about being efficient. You can be efficient and knowledgeable even while using automated tools.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 08:49 AM   #299
PROBLEMCHYLD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LQSlacker View Post
Well I guess the point is being lazy LOL...

Slackware users were not like this long ago, peeps like this that need everything automated are using the wrong distro...

I was smiling too btw above, just in case someone thought I was being bitchy...

It's great this person wants to contribute something like this, but really it's not helping Slackers be Slackers.

Remember Slackware is a hands on distro, you need a new kernel, you learn and compile your own.

If we're going to spoon feed everyone, well what's the point of running Slackware?

This is the last and all I'll say, there's no discussing this, I know what Slackware is, and Slackware is not about automated or being lazy...

NO need to reply to my post, I won't be reading anymore or replying back.

If you don't know what Slackware is, or what it stands for, then please learn.

Automated users, the door to Ubuntu and apt-get is to distrowatch.com LMAO
I think people like you are always conflicting with people like me. You call a whole community lazy because we didn't compile our own Kernel. You have some issues. Next time my boss tells me to move a bundle of steel, I'll tell him, there is no need for the crane because it makes one lazy so I'll do it by hand. Then I probably won't have a job, doing things like an idiot. That's why I don't follow or listen to weirdos. Keep living in the stone-age and see how far you get in the real world. Maybe you shouldn't be using a computer and should send all messages by telegram or (driving a car) when you can walk everywhere or (hunt your own food) instead of grocery shopping..... The list could be eternal, but I'll stop here. And, thank you Dusk for your contributions whether these simpletons (generally speaking) get it or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bassmadrigal View Post
Slackware is about being efficient. You can be efficient and knowledgeable even while using automated tools.
You can't tell that to someone who doesn't have a logical thinking process.

@ LQSlacker
Its always some super Slacker that fukks up a good thread. STFU and let people use what they want.

Do most Slackware users have this same mentality? If so, I feel really bad for them. All you ever hear is how lazy someone is because they automated the tasks?

Last edited by PROBLEMCHYLD; 10-13-2017 at 09:16 AM.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 09:32 AM   #300
GazL
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Guys, sometimes someone will post a comment/opinion so obviously absurd that it really doesn't require any rebuttal. Don't waste your time.


Obligatory xkcd


Quote:
Originally Posted by PROBLEMCHYLD View Post
Do most Slackware users have this same mentality?
Er, no.

Last edited by GazL; 10-13-2017 at 09:37 AM.
 
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