LinuxQuestions.org - So you want to be a Slacker! What do I do next?

- Slackware (https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/)

- - So you want to be a Slacker! What do I do next? (https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/slackware-14/so-you-want-to-be-a-slacker-what-do-i-do-next-644746/)

Hi,

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5343620)

Onebuck, this thread is now 27 pages long, which as a newbie I avoided due to newbies usually want simple index and answers to new unknown technology issues they are facing with Linux and Slackware specifically. While the subject entices one to look at it to identify what to do after Slackware is loaded, hopefully some pointers more than the Slackware Docs and release hints provide, the thread is not about next steps but answers to unique equipment questions. To me the thread doesn't really help in the way it entices. I was hoping to find this Slackware thread which would say, OK you have the just finished the installation, now what? Do 1, 2, 3, etc.... Then follow this step if you have NVIDIA, ATI, or wireless. Now let's put some security in place. Now let's choose a window manager or desktop environment for initial work. Now let's put your favorite application(s) in place as the default application for (xxx). Now let's put your favorite email in place. Now let's start your server for other *nix users, now for Microsoft and MAC users. Etc.. Those would be great indexed and header topics, that could be included on the first post, with page index for where to look within the thread. Instead the thread seems very un-organzied, because of many replies to next steps, or praises for nice write-up (some of them are nice) or requests for help. A new Slackware user has to read many pages to find the issue or topic they are interested in reading about. Perhaps the first post should even say which release it is trying to address? These are just my feedback. I appreciate a sticky blog, like the outstanding security one, although it too would be great to have some HOWTO for iptables, firewalls, virus scanners, rootkit killers, making backups, and including how to set up a chron to actually execute them daily, weekly or monthly. But hey I'm just a newbie who has decided to become a Slacker at age 59 and I'm only a one year old when it comes to understanding Slackware and Linux. So who am I to give feedback...... Thanks for keep us abreast of what's going on.

We do have documentation that will require someone to search & read for solutions. Look at my signature below. I see no need for duplicate entries for already available documents.
Other ducments that would be helpful to a newbie to research(while not Slackware specific but useful information);

Quote:

Just a few links to aid you to gaining some understanding;

  1 Linux Documentation Project 
2 Rute Tutorial & Exposition 
3 Linux Command Guide  
4 Bash Beginners Guide 
5 Bash Reference Manual 
6 Advanced Bash-Scripting Guide 
7 Linux Newbie Admin Guide 
8 LinuxSelfHelp 
9 Utimate Linux Newbie Guide

The above links and others can be found at 'Slackware-Links'. More than just Slackware® links!

Both Slackware Books are useful so that would be another place to look at (see sig again). Links that help you when asking for assistance;

Quote:

FYI: Netiquette is a set of social conventions that facilitate interaction over networks, ranging from Usenet and mailing lists to blogs and forums.

FYI: I suggest that you look at 'How to Ask Questions the Smart Way' so in the future your queries provide information that will aid us in diagnosis of the problem or query.

Hope this helps!
Have fun & enjoy!
:hattip:

Onebuck, thank you for your dedicated time, since 2008 on this thread and the forum. I'd suggest replacement of this seven year old sticky and the start of a new sticky that truly matches the "Next Steps" suggestion of the thread title. Some of the early '08-'09 entries actually caused problem for me when I tried them under 14.0, which I tried to loaded in August 2014. A 27 page sticky thread that starts out with information about Slackware 12, and with buried information about current distributions, and not covering next steps post installation seems like a misnomer of a title. To my experience it was not a welcoming experience to Slackware or this forum. Instead it confused me and had me spend four months looking at other distributions (including Puppy, OpenSUSE and CENTOS) for a more newbie user friendly forum with subject indexes, contributed to by users. I even tried the "Fonts sticky" and it caused me so much trouble I had to reinstall and believe that all of the slackware information was outdated on the support site!! Just as the thread on NVIDIA/ATI 3D is so old, does it even apply to current kernels or equipment anymore.

I'm well aware of the other resources, because I did read all the "readmes" on the installation media. I'm also someone who uses startpage/duckduckgo/when necessary google, other Linux distro sites like Arch and Gentoo, the included MAN and HOWTO's and the search function of this forum to find solutions to errors and troubles under Slackware. I even contact the BDFL, the inner circle guys, and sbo maintainers for help. My request originally was for an index of this thread or change the title to reflect that it is simply musings, not "So what do you do next". The title doesn't fit the thread anymore than a sock on the hand of a car mechanic. Now my request is to remove the sticky and start a new one with current release information and post installation links or suggestions.

Yes your signature lists other reading material, but honestly most forum readers don't look at a signatures for more links to other material, they look at a signature as "this poster is also involved at this organization/project/site".

Anyway thanks for posting the links again, but I think you missed my point and request. Please reconsider.

Hi,

I have read your posts and my response still stands. Slackware is not a Gnu/Linux that you just jump into without some background or research.

Slackware does have loads of information available to users. Not a hold your hand distribution! As to a cookbook or recipe on necessary actions. We have available information for everyone to do some leg work to get answers for questions or performance. When stuck we still have the LQ Slackware forum to hopefully assist a member with issues. But still that user needs to do some work or effort of their own.

I will not index or duplicate pointers/links that may exist in Slackware®-Links or via a LQ Search with good keywords. I am sorry that you experienced issues but you are the one responsible for your installation of Slackware. We will help when possible but I for one will not hold your hand. I can provide assistance when a issue may arise much in the same way as other LQ members that will reach out when someone who shows do effort requests help.

Slackware Doc Project is a good resource for all Slackware users. Along with other useful documentation that can be applied from other resources for other Gnu/Linux and not just Slackware's information.

The intent of Slackware® Essentials was for users that need help with their Slackware. The new Slackbook(still a work in progress) can be read at: http://slackbook.org/beta/ but does provide good insight to setting up Slackware.

I do appreciate your feedback but I do have other things that require my attention. Maybe you should crib your notes so that a reference from a Slackware newbie's views can be provided. I am sure the guys at Slackware Doc Project would welcome such a project.

Do not forget to look at Linux Documentation Project
Hope this helps!
Have fun & enjoy!
:hattip:

Onebuck, I don't know which side of the bed you got up on, but cool off man, which with our cooler than normal midwest temps shouldn't be hard. I'm simply trying to make Slackware fun and accessible for other newbies following behind me. But hey thanks for responding, although it is not what I was hoping the outcome would be.

First I've never suggested duplicate entries, I suggested an index to a 27 page long thread that started in 2008 and is for outdated releases. Then I reconsidered and suggested starting a new thread which might have some suggestions of how one can customize the installation post restart. I have all the links you suggested. I guess what you are saying is:
1) you don't have a way or won't index 27 pages for their content to make it easier to read,
2) that once a sticky exists it will always exist,
3) that Slackware is only for "experienced" Linux users (although that is not what Pat V. or Eric H. and the README's say", and
4) that a new thread that would actually give some helping hand to a new Slacker using 13.37 to 14.0 is not going to be created.
Too bad really.

Now, I never asked you to hold my hand, although actually I see that in many helpful threads on LQ where people interested in helping others actually give them step by step how to solve a problem. I also see responses similar to yours, where the person doesn't want to share their knowledge and help another Slackware user, and instead use the infamous RTFM type of response like I've received now. I'm surprised at such a response from a MODERATOR to respond with "I'm not going to...", seems contrary to the whole concept of MODERATOR role (a person who is able to hold the middle ground and help disagreaable respondents see both sides of an issue while maintaining decorum in the post left on the forum). Maybe a refresher looking at http://www.linuxquestions.org/linux/...linux_question would be timely.

I pray that your day gets better. Peace be with you and your family. I apologize if I hit a sour note toward your sticky.

bamunds,

I don't know. I don't think that onebuck's response is out of the ordinary or contrary to what a moderator should post.

Maybe my link "about how to respond to questions" in post 409 should be required reading material. :-), Bu of course no one would see it, since the link isn't visible at the standard LQ level, which is why I'm not sure why onebuck included the reference in his reply to me.
I often ran in to this same attitude problem as an AT&T manager of Client Networking Services, where the engineers always wanted the customer to know how stupid the question was that the client was asking. The AT&T engineer was wrong to express it publicly to the client, and the result was often that good customers and good contracts went to our competitors, because no one wants to be told NO or belittled. It isn't respectful to the person, and it isn't helpful to the growth of product or service. Usually, it also wasn't great for the engineer, who wondered why they weren't being asked to work on big client projects any longer and more junior engineers were being promoted when the client liked that they were listened to and the question was answered with respect.

I was just looking for a little introspection on the thread title and value of the thread material. I wasn't expecting a Moderator to ASS-U-ME I'm not doing the research and reading necessary to learn Linux and Slackware in particular. If I wasn't reading why would I have read the thread and said, hey this doesn't seem to reflect and the material is old? It seems to me there is more than a little bit of "we're the seniors here and you newbies just be quite and read what we think you need to know and if you have problems go figure out the solution yourself." Really? Even for volunteers that is a terrible attitude to express to the new volunteers that are joining Slackware. Of course, maybe this will be like my experience with the Horseless Carriage Club of America, made up mostly of men and women over the age of 60, who don't share their rebuilding skills and knowledge of how to for repairing a simple issue for these very early cars with anyone younger than 55, and then complain as the members die that the hobby is dieing because the younger generations just won't take the time to learn (always the learning is from someone else) and want to drive muscle cars from the 50's and 60's, while not reflecting on the fact that they have ignored and turn away potential members because they were too new. Do you see the parallelism here?

Still, hey onebuck is the Moderator and his word is final, so I'll just shutup and continue to read on, make my annual donation to PJV and Eric H. On the other hand if he had read the "How to answer a question" article that he referenced written by a hacker specifically says:
"...Note however that this document is not intended to be a general guide to netiquette, and we will generally reject suggestions that are not specifically related to eliciting useful answers in a technical forum.)" The "Slackware@-links" link isn't available at the Slackware Forum level or the LQ main level. IS that link now an archive, it sure isn't available as a standard link on LQ anymore, and it is not a sub-forum or tutorial. The LQ link for asking question is here:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/linux/...Ask_a_Question

Maybe I'll go find a muscle car...

friendly reminder

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345191)

where the engineers always wanted the customer to know

http://docs.slackware.com/slackware/philosophy :)

Quote:

The Slackware community generally emphasizes user empowerment by learning and understanding the system rather than blindly copying instructions,

Hi,

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345191)

I did not provide that link until now;

Quote:

FYI: How to Answer a Linux Question is ‘Simon Bridge's excellent composition to aid us in good informational exchanges.'

You did in your reply! BTW, I have read that document several times.I provided the links for;

Quote:

FYI: Netiquette is a set of social conventions that facilitate interaction over networks, ranging from Usenet and mailing lists to blogs and forums.

FYI: I suggest that you look at 'How to Ask Questions the Smart Way' so in the future your queries provide information that will aid us in diagnosis of the problem or query.

As stated to provide a suggestion for composing future requests here at LQ.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345191)

I often ran in to this same attitude problem as an AT&T manager of Client Networking Services, where the engineers always wanted the customer to know how stupid the question was that the client was asking. The AT&T engineer was wrong to express it publicly to the client, and the result was often that good customers and good contracts went to our competitors, because no one wants to be told NO or belittled. It isn't respectful to the person, and it isn't helpful to the growth of product or service. Usually, it also wasn't great for the engineer, who wondered why they weren't being asked to work on big client projects any longer and more junior engineers were being promoted when the client liked that they were listened to and the question was answered with respect.

Attitude?? No way, I am driven to aid someone when possible. Your alignment with that example is off base. You do not know me personally nor have the information to assume in the manner you have. I have in no way belittled you nor is that one of my traits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345191)

I was just looking for a little introspection on the thread title and value of the thread material. I wasn't expecting a Moderator to ASS-U-ME I'm not doing the research and reading necessary to learn Linux and Slackware in particular. If I wasn't reading why would I have read the thread and said, hey this doesn't seem to reflect and the material is old? It seems to me there is more than a little bit of "we're the seniors here and you newbies just be quite and read what we think you need to know and if you have problems go figure out the solution yourself." Really? Even for volunteers that is a terrible attitude to express to the new volunteers that are joining Slackware. Of course, maybe this will be like my experience with the Horseless Carriage Club of America, made up mostly of men and women over the age of 60, who don't share their rebuilding skills and knowledge of how to for repairing a simple issue for these very early cars with anyone younger than 55, and then complain as the members die that the hobby is dieing because the younger generations just won't take the time to learn (always the learning is from someone else) and want to drive muscle cars from the 50's and 60's, while not reflecting on the fact that they have ignored and turn away potential members because they were too new. Do you see the parallelism here?

Personally, I feel your 'ASS-U-ME' statement is out line here and not warranted. As to the evolution of this thread over time. One does need to realize that things are always moving and in-flux with a Gnu/Linux like Slackware. Updates to this thread have been made with hope of helping users with noticed changes or issues. As to your evaluations relative to new users and how things are reflected to them is off base. We(myself included) do try to help direct these users to information to help that same user to solve a issue on their own. Spoon feeding helps no one to learn. Your analogy does not fit here at LQ Slackware. We always welcome user input by someone who is truly willing to help improve. If I discouraged you then I am sorry but my terseness may come across and be misinterpreted at times.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345191)

Still, hey onebuck is the Moderator and his word is final, so I'll just shutup and continue to read on, make my annual donation to PJV and Eric H. On the other hand if he had read the "How to answer a question" article that he referenced written by a hacker specifically says:
"...Note however that this document is not intended to be a general guide to netiquette, and we will generally reject suggestions that are not specifically related to eliciting useful answers in a technical forum.)"

Again, get your information correct since you find a problem with my information. That article (How to Answer a Linux Question ) does have some criticism & sarcasm. Just take it or leave it. It does provide some useful insight. But the How to Ask Questions the Smart Way was provided by me to you in hopes that your composition(s) for inquiries may help us all in the future.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345191)

The "Slackware@-links" link isn't available at the Slackware Forum level or the LQ main level. IS that link now an archive, it sure isn't available as a standard link on LQ anymore, and it is not a sub-forum or tutorial. The LQ link for asking question is here:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/linux/...Ask_a_Question

Maybe I'll go find a muscle car...

The Slackware®-Links is a LQ wiki link and visible in my sig and available at http://wiki.linuxquestions.org/wiki/Main_Page. This wiki does provide useful links for users here at LQ to find available information. More than just Slackware links!

If you wish to continue this communication then consider PM me via my LQ link by clicking my username and selecting 'send email to onebuck'. Please do not communicate further within this thread for your topic of concern.

I always end my posts with;
Hope this helps!
Have fun & enjoy!
:hattip:

Since "PM via LQ username" is a premium service only..... Get your facts right indeed... I'm not a premium user so this is my response.
Clearly, this thread does not provide "What do I do next?"
Post 397 has five votes to remove this sticky, I also vote that it be removed.
Suggestions were offered for how to improve it.
Slackware is a KISS Linux and I find it easy to use, and all the tools I need are included.
OP's responses were about where to find information, tips on etiquette and how to ask questions from a hacker perspective.
And I hear two ships sounding their fog horns to make sure they dont' hit an iceberg. One of those ships is the Titanic. The other ship is the Lithuania.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bamunds (Post 5345735)

One of those ships is the Titanic. The other ship is the Lithuania.

Actually, you mean Lusitania which was torpedoed by German u-boat in 1915 and had nothing to do with icebergs :) Lithuania is a country and it did not hit an iceberg either.

WOW!! Changelog updates galore for '-current'

Hi,

Today's http://slackware.mirrors.tds.net/pub.../ChangeLog.txt

Quote:

Tue Apr 21 23:44:00 UTC 2015
Greetings! It has indeed been far too long. I apologize for the absence
of updates lately, but we've been using the time to get some good work done.
This is not a beta (probably not even an alpha release yet), but it is also
not a drill. ;-) We've spared you all most of the pain while we
transitioned to a lot of new libraries that got major version number bumps,
and have tested everything to ensure that this will be a smooth upgrade.
Still, I'd be surprised if all this didn't introduce any regressions, so if
you find any problems let us know. Huge thanks are due to Robby Workman,
Heinz Wiesinger, Eric Hameleers, and Stuart Winter for all the help. Have fun!

Look at all the work being done over the last 6 weeks. Well worth the wait!
Thank you PV & Slackware team!
:hattip:

Hi,

For new user of Slackware, you have a great resource available at Alien Pastures

Eric's about;

Quote:

Hi!

I am Eric Hameleers, or AlienBOB as Slackware users know me. I maintain a Wiki, and a website where I publish Slackware scripts and other goodies, but I lacked a place where I could comment freely on all my activities.

This nice WordPress blog using sqlite database proved as portable as my Wiki, and I am glad I created it.

I hope you find what you search for. If you want to give feedback and don’t want to write a comment on the blog, then you can always email me: alien at slackware dot com.

Have fun & enjoy!
:hattip:

Hi,

I just upgraded Firefox to 38.0.5 using https://gist.github.com/ruario/9672798 script. Changelog Firefox was to;

Quote:

Sun May 17 04:35:46 UTC 2015 xap/mozilla-firefox-38.0.1-x86_64-1.txz: Upgraded.

I made the decision to upgrade for security reasons.

Member response Heads-UP

Hi,

FYI; Slackware web site may be unavailable for a short while: 12th/13th June

Please do not panic as this is for;

Quote:

We're doing some behind the scenes essential changes in the Akamai CDN, which may or may not result in the slackware.com site being unavailable either today (12th) or tomorrow.

Hope this helps.
Have fun & enjoy!
:hattip:

Mozilla 39.0 security upgrades

Hi,

Mozillla Firefox 39.0 is now released and has several security issues (Mancha's Slackware security thread) resolved.
While your are upgrading Mozilla Firefox using https://gist.github.com/ruario/9672798 be sure to consider getting Alien_Bob's http://www.slackware.com/~alien/slac...player-plugin/ so you do not create a issue with flash.
See: https://helpx.adobe.com/security/pro...apsb15-11.html
Hope this helps.
Have fun & enjoy!
:hattip: