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Old 10-09-2017, 11:22 AM   #1
mfoley
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Slackware workstation intermittently crashing


I have been having intermittant but frequent crashes on a Slackware64 14.2 KDE workstation. This is one of several workstations in the office and is the newest hardware. There are also 4 other Slacware servers (no KDE). This one computer is the only one crashing. It has simply halted 6 time since August 15, including twice today (it was built about August 12th). The major difference from the other workstations is that it has an AMD Ryzen processor.

I've post the relevant parts of syslog below. In both cases, the last thing to run before the restart was Successfully activated service 'org.kde.powerdevil.backlighthelper. Is there any known problem with this?

Also, this computer was upgraded to Ryzen on August 12th (1st crash 3 days later), but had been running with an Intel Pentium G630 for weeks prior to that w/o any crashes at all.

Ideas?

syslog has the following entries:
First event today
Code:
Oct  9 09:29:22 dennis -- MARK --
Oct  9 09:32:21 dennis rpcbind[2184]: connect from 127.0.0.1 to getport/addr(status)
Oct  9 09:32:22 dennis rpcbind[2189]: connect from 127.0.0.1 to getport/addr(status)
Oct  9 09:32:40 dennis dbus[1243]: [system] Activating service name='org.freedesktop.UPower' (using servicehelper)
Oct  9 09:32:40 dennis dbus[1243]: [system] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.UPower'
Oct  9 09:32:41 dennis dbus[1243]: [system] Activating service name='org.freedesktop.UDisks2' (using servicehelper)
Oct  9 09:32:41 dennis udisksd[2373]: udisks daemon version 2.1.5 starting
Oct  9 09:32:41 dennis dbus[1243]: [system] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.UDisks2'
Oct  9 09:32:41 dennis udisksd[2373]: Acquired the name org.freedesktop.UDisks2 on the system message bus
Oct  9 09:32:41 dennis rpcbind[2382]: connect from 127.0.0.1 to getport/addr(status)
Oct  9 09:32:42 dennis dbus[1243]: [system] Activating service name='org.kde.powerdevil.backlighthelper' (using servicehelper)
Oct  9 09:32:42 dennis dbus[1243]: [system] Successfully activated service 'org.kde.powerdevil.backlighthelper'
Oct  9 09:49:22 dennis -- MARK --
Oct  9 10:09:22 dennis -- MARK --
Oct  9 10:29:22 dennis -- MARK --
Oct  9 10:47:57 dennis syslogd 1.5.1: restart.
2nd event today
Code:
Oct  9 10:48:16 dennis apcupsd[1444]: NIS server startup succeeded
Oct  9 10:48:16 dennis kernel: [   35.894724] ip_tables: (C) 2000-2006 Netfilter Core Team
Oct  9 10:48:17 dennis kernel: [   36.372288] nf_conntrack version 0.5.0 (65536 buckets, 262144 max)
Oct  9 10:48:18 dennis rpcbind[1588]: connect from 127.0.0.1 to getport/addr(status)
Oct  9 10:48:18 dennis rpcbind[1605]: connect from 127.0.0.1 to getport/addr(status) 
Oct  9 10:48:18 dennis acpid: client connected from 1548[0:0]
Oct  9 10:48:18 dennis acpid: 1 client rule loaded
Oct  9 10:48:49 dennis dbus[1246]: [system] Activating service name='org.freedesktop.UPower' (using servicehelper) 
Oct  9 10:48:49 dennis dbus[1246]: [system] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.UPower'
Oct  9 10:48:50 dennis dbus[1246]: [system] Activating service name='org.freedesktop.UDisks2' (using servicehelper)
Oct  9 10:48:50 dennis udisksd[1969]: udisks daemon version 2.1.5 starting
Oct  9 10:48:50 dennis dbus[1246]: [system] Successfully activated service 'org.freedesktop.UDisks2'
Oct  9 10:48:50 dennis udisksd[1969]: Acquired the name org.freedesktop.UDisks2 on the system message bus
Oct  9 10:48:50 dennis rpcbind[1998]: connect from 127.0.0.1 to getport/addr(status)
Oct  9 10:48:50 dennis dbus[1246]: [system] Activating service name='org.kde.powerdevil.backlighthelper' (using servicehelper)
Oct  9 10:48:51 dennis dbus[1246]: [system] Successfully activated service 'org.kde.powerdevil.backlighthelper'
Oct  9 10:52:01 dennis sshd[2490]: Accepted password for hprsadmin from 192.168.0.3 port 53872 ssh2
Oct  9 10:59:20 dennis syslogd 1.5.1: restart.
Oct  9 10:59:20 dennis kernel: klogd 1.5.1, log source = /proc/kmsg started.

Last edited by mfoley; 10-09-2017 at 11:39 AM.
 
Old 10-09-2017, 12:29 PM   #2
RadicalDreamer
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I dunno but there have been media reports regarding Ryzen CPUs being RMA'd due to instability on Linux: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=ryzen+linu...&t=ffnt&ia=web

What Linux kernel are you using? You might want to try a newer one.
 
Old 10-09-2017, 02:57 PM   #3
mfoley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RadicalDreamer View Post
I dunno but there have been media reports regarding Ryzen CPUs being RMA'd due to instability on Linux: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=ryzen+linu...&t=ffnt&ia=web
Yes, I've found numerous links referring to Ryzen/Linux issues:
https://linux.slashdot.org/story/17/...oblem-on-ryzen

https://hothardware.com/news/amd-con...mt-bug-and-fix

https://liliputing.com/2017/08/amd-r...ads-linux.html

http://techreport.com/news/32362/amd...oblem-on-ryzen
Quote:
What Linux kernel are you using? You might want to try a newer one.
I'm using 4.4.38 which is the latest for Slackware 14.2. Supposedly, 4.10 addresses some of the Ryzen issues, but I am reluctant to go that route as this is one of several production machines that all get automatically updated from slackpkg and I hate to step outside the normal update path. The simple solution might be to get a different processor.

Has anyone else experienced similar problems with the Ryzen processor?

more info:

I've upgraded to kernel 4.4.88 which really *is* the current Slackware version. Probably still won't fix it since I've read in one of those links I posted that 4.10 addresses some Ryzen issues. Slackware probably won't get that version until 14.3, I'll post back with results.

Last edited by mfoley; 10-09-2017 at 09:26 PM.
 
Old 10-10-2017, 12:44 AM   #4
1337_powerslacker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfoley View Post
Yes, I've found numerous links referring to Ryzen/Linux issues:
https://linux.slashdot.org/story/17/...oblem-on-ryzen

https://hothardware.com/news/amd-con...mt-bug-and-fix

https://liliputing.com/2017/08/amd-r...ads-linux.html

http://techreport.com/news/32362/amd...oblem-on-ryzen

I'm using 4.4.38 which is the latest for Slackware 14.2. Supposedly, 4.10 addresses some of the Ryzen issues, but I am reluctant to go that route as this is one of several production machines that all get automatically updated from slackpkg and I hate to step outside the normal update path. The simple solution might be to get a different processor.

Has anyone else experienced similar problems with the Ryzen processor?

more info:

I've upgraded to kernel 4.4.88 which really *is* the current Slackware version. Probably still won't fix it since I've read in one of those links I posted that 4.10 addresses some Ryzen issues. Slackware probably won't get that version until 14.3, I'll post back with results.
Have you seen this report by Phoronix? Michael has confirmed the latest revisions of the Ryzen processor have addressed the crashing/segfaulting issue. Looking through your OP, though, it doesn't seem like that would be the source of your problem, although it is within the realm of possibility.

Last edited by 1337_powerslacker; 10-10-2017 at 12:46 AM. Reason: clarity
 
Old 10-10-2017, 02:04 AM   #5
jostber
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Can you check if disabling powerdevil in KDE helps?

https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=225&t=127676
 
Old 10-10-2017, 04:40 PM   #6
mfoley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jostber View Post
Can you check if disabling powerdevil in KDE helps?
Any idea how to do that? None of the screen images I've googled on this topic look anything like my KDE > System Settings > Power Management.
 
Old 10-10-2017, 10:45 PM   #7
jostber
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfoley View Post
Any idea how to do that? None of the screen images I've googled on this topic look anything like my KDE > System Settings > Power Management.
Go into systemsettings and turn off the KDE power management and check if that affects this.
 
Old 10-24-2017, 01:30 PM   #8
mfoley
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Still working on the Ryzen angle. AMD advised updating the BIOS. Did that, still crashes. I've asked about a replacment processor.

If a new processor doesn't fix the problem I'm not sure I want to mess with power settings in KDE. All other Linux workstations have this enabled and work fine. The only thing set is to turn off the screen after 30 minutes. I suppose I'll at least *try* turning off these settings, just to see, but it can be a week-ish before the crash occurs. Other than the curiosity factor of the power setting, if a replacement CPU is not forthcoming or does not fix the problem, I'll likely change MB and CPU and give this rig to a Windows user in need of an upgrade.

(btw - Power Management doesn't appear to have a "turn off" setting. I can un-check the options individually in the various tabs: On AC, On Battery, and Low Battery.)

Last edited by mfoley; 10-24-2017 at 01:32 PM.
 
Old 10-24-2017, 11:41 PM   #9
khronosschoty
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I returned an otherwise much nicer computer, than I have now, earlier, during this last summer, that was Ryzen .. it had the the crashing bug.
 
Old 10-29-2017, 09:18 PM   #10
orbea
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You should really try a newer kernel if you are going to use such a modern processor. You shouldn't use slackpkg to update your kernels anyways...
 
Old 10-30-2017, 06:18 PM   #11
mfoley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orbea View Post
You should really try a newer kernel if you are going to use such a modern processor. You shouldn't use slackpkg to update your kernels anyways...
I just did a slackpkg update of the Kernel and it is now 4.4.88, up from the 4.4.38 of my OP. Slackware does update kernels. As I understand it, slackpkg is the official mechanism for updating Slackware. It is true that Slackware does lag the latest releases of some OS program, but I understand that to mainly be from an abundance of caution and to make sure new stuff doesn't break things (In some cases Slackware is actually ahead of other distros. For example I've found Salckware's Samba to usually be more recent than Ubuntu's). This computer is a workstation used in an actual work environment by a non-techy user. All Slackware workstations are updated via slackpkg. Out of my own abundance of caution, I'll stick with kernels that have been vetted by the Slackware team.

Today, AMD sent me a return authorization to send back this Ryzen processor and they'll send a new one. I'll post results of that when installed.

Last edited by mfoley; 10-30-2017 at 06:19 PM.
 
Old 10-30-2017, 07:16 PM   #12
bassmadrigal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfoley View Post
I just did a slackpkg update of the Kernel and it is now 4.4.88, up from the 4.4.38 of my OP. Slackware does update kernels. As I understand it, slackpkg is the official mechanism for updating Slackware. It is true that Slackware does lag the latest releases of some OS program, but I understand that to mainly be from an abundance of caution and to make sure new stuff doesn't break things (In some cases Slackware is actually ahead of other distros. For example I've found Salckware's Samba to usually be more recent than Ubuntu's). This computer is a workstation used in an actual work environment by a non-techy user. All Slackware workstations are updated via slackpkg. Out of my own abundance of caution, I'll stick with kernels that have been vetted by the Slackware team.

Today, AMD sent me a return authorization to send back this Ryzen processor and they'll send a new one. I'll post results of that when installed.
The issue is you're trying to run a processor that came out in March 2017 with a kernel that came out back in January of 2016. The point releases for the 4.4 kernel don't add support for new hardware, they only fix bugs that are found. That kernel would be missing a large portion of support needed to properly run that processor... not to mention the components on the motherboard. Many Ryzen-based motherboards don't even have proper sound support unless you're running the 4.11 kernel or newer. Slackware-current doesn't even have that yet (Pat and team are likely waiting for a few point releases of the 4.14 kernel due to be released within the next few weeks as that will be likely be the next LTS).

There's nothing wrong with sticking with official Slackware releases, but in doing so, you typically can't run the latest hardware properly. If you don't want to run a newer kernel with proper support for the processor and related components, it might be best to just keep it on Windows. You can install the drivers separate from the kernel there.
 
2 members found this post helpful.
Old 10-30-2017, 07:40 PM   #13
Gerard Lally
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Originally Posted by bassmadrigal View Post
The issue is you're trying to run a processor that came out in March 2017 with a kernel that came out back in January of 2016.
In a nutshell.
 
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Old 10-31-2017, 12:55 AM   #14
mfoley
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bassmadrigal & Gerard Lally: In the end, you might be right and even kernel 4.4.88 might not be able to run with this processor. However, I'm counting on two things:

1) That even with new features in new processor designs, AMD has generally been backward compatible with Intel which is how AMD captured market share in the first place. While new kernels my take advantage of new processor features, old kernels should, theoretically, run compatibly. The Ryzen does not crash Windows computers which may have even older "kernels", leading me to believe AMD simply did not test Ryzen as extensively with Linux as they did with Windows.

2) AMD admitted a flaw in the early Ryzen chips per RadicalDreamer's post and my follow-up post to his. They have agreed to replace the processor, free of charge. The return went off today.

Given this, I am willing to try the updated chip. It may not work in which case a Windows user inherits the rig.

Do either of you have, or know someone who has the older Ryzen chip and an a newer kernel and has experienced no problems? The only poster to this thread with known Ryzen experience, khronosschoty, who bought a Ryzen at about the same time I did, experienced the same problem and ended up returning the machine. He(/she) didn't say what distro or kernel was involved.

Last edited by mfoley; 10-31-2017 at 12:58 AM.
 
Old 10-31-2017, 01:31 AM   #15
bassmadrigal
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I wasn't necessarily implying the kernel itself was the problem causing your crashing, but running an older kernel on a modern system can cause is likely causing problems. I imagine your lspci output isn't very friendly looking, because the kernel just doesn't understand what some of the devices are. You probably have a lot of "AMD Device XXXX" entries (or something similar).

Processors are processors and they should generally work with the system. This is why you are able to boot the system and run it. But, not running the latest kernel can mean that your system isn't working at its full potential. Windows is able to do this because they have updates and drivers for the motherboard are installed separately or downloaded from Microsoft's servers.

I'd also suggest you use the SlackBuild for kernel-firmware to grab the latest firmware from kernel.org as that will contain any microcode updates for the processor.

Last edited by bassmadrigal; 10-31-2017 at 01:54 AM. Reason: Clarify "problems"
 
  


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