The message is coming through loud and clear for me. Alan wants to write the book. I say let it go and let the man do his work.

Public Enema No.1 =]

Hi,

If he wants to produce then that's one thing. On the 06-29-2009 interview he said the book was 1/2 complete. Then latter he stated it was 90%. Now in this thread it's 80%.

There is no logical reason to deny help. We all have busy lives. It is doable with a PDF as Woodman's stated. That would allow updated material to keep things current and provide revenue to the Slackstore.

A LQ Wiki would allow everything to be kept up to date and offer scope of the project as another means of presentation.

This spinning is preventing the Slackware community from having a completed current Slackbook that will aid all slackers. If Alan wants to maintain control that's fine. Let's get this book completed and keep current so others can benefit.

I've got a lot on my table but would make time to get this project to completion. Time commitment and resource contributions by members would allow a book to be completed in a timely fashion.

Big task but doable!

With all due respect, onebuck. I don't want to get into an argument with a moderator. I don't think Alan wants someone else to write the book; he wants to write it and as I understand it he has control of this project. Alan is accepting e-mails for ideas. I don't have a problem with this. That is the point I wanted to make.
I completely understand and respect the points that you and Woodsman made; they are excellent points. Thanks for the reply.

Respectfully submitted,

hitest

Hi,

@hitest
That's OK from your standpoint. I'm participating as a LQ member on this subject not a mod and do appreciate the respect for everyone's opinion on this manner. It has been way to long for a project of this sort to not be completed. Especially when it can be easily resolved by allowing input to the project. Input from the Slackware community should have been done long ago.

There's an old saying: crap or get off the pot. Something like that.

As to the control of the project and production by Alan for the project, I see no reason to change unless change warrants so that the project can be completed. Slackbook 3.0 rewrite project has not shown anything for over 2 years, it seemed to be stagnant until now: http://lizella.net/book/book.html .

No one is wanting to take control from Alan but if he needs help or input then by all means let's produce it. Especially when people are willing to participate and help the project evolve thus providing a final product to the Slackware community. It is important to remember that when someone is spinning things then nothing will ever get done.

I have read the pages that Alan has post at http://lizella.net/book/book.html. Alan has done a load of work for a rewrite. Still needs additional work and editing. Too much for just one person to get something of this magnitude done. Being copy writer, editor and even publisher is way too much for one person.

Slackware is dynamic and a book on Slackware should be adaptable. Editions of a written book do have revisions. Printing a copy every few months or years should not be the norm any longer. 21st century and we do have the means to make a dynamic adaptable book via the web for Slackware. Be it book, PDF or wiki the project would develop with input from knowledgeable Slackware users.

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@ contributing and proofreading

A wiki definitely would make simple grammatical corrections a lot easier. Without the source, how would we send updates and make sure nothing is miss communicated. Obviously, the easiest way to correct such things is to correct it as you read it. But if somebody sent back the whole document corrected and it wasn't in the source format, imagine trying to merge all those corrections back in.

It seems that the only way of contributing is writing up missing sections or additions to others and hoping they get included. This is a very doable way of contributing through e-mail and doesn't need a wiki.

Good LQ title for me when I reach 5000 posts, more appropriate than Guru.

Hi,

For the LQ Wiki you can communicate on the wiki discussion tab. That way all communication is in one place. Background information & content has already been laid out in Version 2.0, possibly rethink of how things should be formatted. As a team the writing conventions should be set then breaking down the book would be fairly easy: Something like, Preface,TOC, Intro,Chapters>Sections>Subsections. Glossary of terms, tables, appendices and of course License information.

Plus for the wiki you will have history to work & track things. Along with any PM the wiki tools would unify the creation of the book wiki. I believe a wiki book is doable.

Wow, lots of people I have to reply to and not a lot of time left tonight to get it done before I crash. :^)

I've updated the slackbook.org website with a link to the current beta version. I'll try to keep this version current, but since there is currently no hook to re-compile the book when a git commit is made, I'll have to manually do so for the time being. I'll likely do it for major changes, but not for minor typo fixes and the like.

Also, git is publicly available now, so you can check-out the source code and send me diffs via e-mail. Those will be greatly appreciated and not go unnoticed.

Now, as for why this all hasn't just been put out in the public earlier than this? Why wasn't there an open discussion? All those similar things. Well, I went through this once before. :^) In doing the 2.0 re-write I learned two things: 1- no one will sign up for the mailing list or participate in discussions, 2- everyone will offer to help but no one will actually help. I'd love to be proved wrong on at least the second point, but experience shows that people start out with this grand idea of writing documentation and it'll be wonderful and everyone will live in bliss, and then they realize that writing documentation is boring. Mind blowingly boring. The kind of boring that makes you think staying up late and watching infomercials is exciting. Seriously, everyone who offered to help me on the Slack Book v2.0 bought a Gensu knife. This means that you get lots of promises for support and assistance but then nothing comes through, or worse what does come through is incomplete and/or in serious need of revision. There were some notable exceptions in 2.0, but not many.

As for not responding to e-mails, that's entirely my fault and there's really no excuse for it. I see that e-mail and I say to myself, "Self, remember to respond to him when you get off work." and then I never remember to.

As for the 2.0 (and 1.0) books being copyright Slackware, Inc., that is true. It is also true that they were GPLv2 works, so you could fork them. In fact, v2.0 was created for that very reason. Had the book not been GPL'd, I don't think there ever would have been a second edition.

I know there's some points I missed but I hope I hit all the highlights. If I start to slip don't send me a nicely worded simple e-mail asking me when I'll be done, send a real nasty-gram. I mean the kind of flames that make grown men weep as their ass hairs shrivel up inside their asbestos underwear. The kind of e-mails that remind me of ANC or Realto Margarino. Threaten me with bodily harm. Go on IRC and piss me off. Don't me nice. The time for being nice is over; it's time to get shit done.

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Thanks Alan for all the work.

Hi,

Alan, you are wrong in thinking that members here at LQ are not committed to Slack. I for one have been giving back for a long time.

I've been involved with several non-profits in the past and know all too well about the volunteer situation. You are right about how most will talk the game and won't walk the game. But You should not paint with a broad brush! A few good members will be assisting, that I am sure of.

Members that have participated within this thread alone have made contributions here at LQ Slackware in one way or another by providing good on-line support.

By placing the git;

We will see who and how many members will give you feedback. As to the need for pushing or even lambasting you, not really a good production tool. This is not alt.os.linux.slackware, most LQ members do abide by ethics and morality. One of my major reasons for not participating at alt.os.linux.slackware any longer. Ceased long ago for lack of professional interaction(s) at alt.os.linux.slackware.

If you are going to manage the project and be committed then you must be reliable to at least feedback to the participating individuals. Just reading the 'TODO' and I find it to be rather earthly thus not definitive. I'm being kind with the former statement. We/I need to know what is to be done in a defined sense or direction. Common language is fine but is not descriptive when you use local slang, vulgarity or whatever to be cute. Professionally define the problem and let's get this thing done.

I'll be away for medical reasons for a short while but when things settle, I will proof and annotate what has been posted. Hopefully later today or Friday. I read through the original rewrite you posted. Now I'll look at the git.

Thanks for opening this opportunity to get a Slackbook 3.0 completed. Look forward to working on the Slackbook.

Thanks for all of your excellent work, Alan!!!!

Get er done!

Alan,

I read my 2nd Edition from front to back. I enjoyed it and even learned a couple things. I can't speak for the masses, but I will definitely add my +1 to you in the appreciation department.

~Eric

I don't recall any public requests for help. Please point to a link showing a public request for help. (The alt-slack list is not a public forum.)

What is the link for this git portal?

Woodsman, the 2.0 re-write was initiated through Usenet group alt.os.linux.slackware several years ago. I do not remember ever having seen you contribute there.
Alan was the initiator, the project manager and ended up writing most of the new stuff. Check Google's Usenet archives for all the communication.

And the URL to the git repository is in plain sight on the front page of http://slackbook.org/

Eric

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