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Old 10-05-2019, 04:37 PM   #106
kikinovak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ttk View Post
If you don't need PAM for AD integration there is no reason not to use Slackware for business.
There's also those of us who want to connect their desktops to 389 Directory Server.
 
Old 10-05-2019, 08:19 PM   #107
Richard Cranium
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rkelsen View Post
Slackware isn't a community project. Was he asked to do it?
No. Is that particularly relevant?
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 01:11 AM   #108
Jeebizz
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My


Perhaps if the two main things holding a release for Slackware is QT5(?) or mainly Plasma I say why not just put those by the wayside, and let the community release those - like there is for say MATE GNOME. On the plus side dropping KDE would make Slackware lighter.
 
Old 10-08-2019, 01:54 AM   #109
thim
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Qt5 cannot be left out. We are in 2019, more and more programs are depending on Qt5. Just take a look at slackbuilds.
Regarding Plasma, are there any discussions to be released (if needed) as a community project?
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 02:02 AM   #110
Jeebizz
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I don't know, but considering that Plasma hasn't been included yet and supposedly it is a mature project now, I say just drop KDE4 and let Plasma be handled by someone else who really is interested in getting Plasma in.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 02:16 AM   #111
bassmadrigal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thim View Post
Regarding Plasma, are there any discussions to be released (if needed) as a community project?
From various comments on the forum, it seems that even if Pat chooses to not include Plasma5, Eric will continue making packages for it unless Pat chooses to also not include QT5.

If Eric chooses to eventually not provide Plasma5 packages, I imagine there will be several forks of his project and it will continue on in some form.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 07:48 AM   #112
hendrickxm
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Gnome3 is coming to slackware 15.0!
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 08:32 AM   #113
AlvaroG
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Not that it matters, but as a long time user of Slackware (since 8.1), here are my 2c

When I started using it Slackware, it was refreshing to get a system which could be easily understood, modified, and managed. It was in my view a bit like Windows used to be: install it, forget about it and do what you need to do on top of it.

Nowadays, it feels behind the times. If you need a desktop, the default install lacks too many applications to be truly useful, luckily sbopkg means almost any app is just a few minutes of compiling away. If you need a workstation, or a server, the lack of PAM means it can't be easily integrated in an existing environment, nor it can be used out-of-the-box as a directory server.

It looks a bit like the current Slackware is relegated to be an "appliance" of sorts, a base system to build an OS on top of, a bit like FreeBSD (which is used as the base for many systems but most people wouldn't use in vanilla form).

IMHO, Mr. Volkerding and the Slackware Team need to decide what is the future of the system, or it will eventually lose enough users to be viable. If the goal is to have a stable base on which to build the "rest" of the OS, then there are a few things which are more critical than even a new release, like:

* Making sure the focus is on providing a stable base (under this light maybe even KDE could be dropped)
* The documentation should change to reflect the goal, and in fact receive a huge overhaul. It doesn't really matter this days that the default install has 5 browsers...
* There should be an active communication and maybe even official blessing of some of the projects which expand on Slackware (SlackMATE, Dlackware, and others).
* There should be also official support for things like a "minimal install"

Now, I would be glad to commit time and effort to improve things. Slackware is the first Linux distro I used and one of the reasons why I now work in what I love and am able to support my family. But I'm not proud to say the last server I built runs Debian

Last edited by AlvaroG; 10-08-2019 at 09:25 AM.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 08:32 AM   #114
tramtrist
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I could do without Gnome, KDE, or XFCE...
They can all drop as far as I'm concerned. I realize I'm a tiny minority though

Last edited by tramtrist; 10-08-2019 at 08:33 AM. Reason: Broken Emoji(?)
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 09:01 AM   #115
hitest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tramtrist View Post
I could do without Gnome, KDE, or XFCE...
They can all drop as far as I'm concerned.
Gnome left us long ago. In my opinion Slackware cannot do without XFCE or KDE, as they're must have desktop environments. KDE4 is very long in the tooth and should be dropped. I would like to see Qt5 and KDE-plasma added to the -current tree. Just my .
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 09:14 AM   #116
0XBF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bassmadrigal View Post
From various comments on the forum, it seems that even if Pat chooses to not include Plasma5, Eric will continue making packages for it unless Pat chooses to also not include QT5.

If Eric chooses to eventually not provide Plasma5 packages, I imagine there will be several forks of his project and it will continue on in some form.
Eric was talking about this on his blog comments from his last release, if I may quote him here:
Quote:
Letís hope Pat makes that decision soon. Either to include Plasma5, or just to include the dependencies I have to ship in order to have a functional Plasma5.
Itís getting a bit long in the tooth to be honest. Itís already near impossible to do monthly updates for Plasma5 because all the updates in slackware-current keep breaking stuff that I have to fix. Itís simply taking too much of my time without any meaningful change in Slackwareís direction. It feels I am wasting my time. My two cents.
Personally I have enjoyed using plasma as my primary DE for the last couple years but I can't fault Eric for not wanting to maintain the project and all it's dependencies, especially in the constantly moving slackware-current environment. I would not want to take on that workload and it seems that Pat has reservations about that too.

Perhaps it could be maintained on slackbuilds once a new stable release is put out. It would still be quite the endeavor to build everything but at least it would be more manageable than following current. Hopefully at least some of the deps like Qt5 can be put into the mainstream releases.

It would be nice to have at least one of the newer desktop environments in the new release IMO.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:31 AM   #117
Jeebizz
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Well i don't think XFCE should be dropped it doesn't seem that heavy and not hard to maintain - just drop KDE4.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:59 AM   #118
philanc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bassmadrigal View Post
From various comments on the forum, it seems that even if Pat chooses to not include Plasma5, Eric will continue making packages for it unless Pat chooses to also not include QT5.
Slackware KDE5 seems to be Eric's baby. It's not 100% certain that he would continue to be as motivated if Slackware was dropping KDE...
Quote:
If Eric chooses to eventually not provide Plasma5 packages, I imagine there will be several forks of his project and it will continue on in some form.
Several forks, probably. But how many would survive beyond a few iterations?

I am impressed by the technical knowledge required to build all the huge packages. But I am mostly impressed not by the skills, but by the dedication and the persistence of AlienBob, year after year.

Qt5 is a different story. As noted before, it is required by more and more packages. Even if KDE is dropped, QT5 should stay in Slackware. Long time ago, Pat dropped Gnome, but GTK2, GTK3 are still in Slackware.

I don't know how difficult it is to completely get rid of Qt4 and replace it by Qt5 today (for all Slackware packages), or how difficult it is to have Qt4 and Qt5 living together. Maybe it is a reason to delay a release.

Maybe the reason is the decision to drop KDE or not, with all the personal consequences for the Slackware team. I am sure that years ago, the Gnome decision was not an easy one.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:07 AM   #119
Lysander666
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Just drop KDE in its entirety on the official branch and allow Eric to maintain a live Plasma 5 version. Retain Xfce as the official DE.
 
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:14 AM   #120
GazL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philanc View Post
I am impressed by the technical knowledge required to build all the huge packages.
Personally, I'm depressed by the technical knowledge required to build all the huge packages. Ideally they would be neither huge, nor require the technical might of someone like Eric in order to be built. But I guess these are the days we live in!

This is why I turned my back on the big DEs long ago. They're just not worth the effort. IMHO.
 
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