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Old 11-26-2016, 02:26 PM   #1
belka.ew
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dlackware gnome 3.22, slackware 14.2


Hello to all.

There is a new Gnome project for slackware linux: dlackware. This time more radical than dropline . The main goal is to provide good user experience with gnome on slackware. So our gnome is based on pam, systemd and wayland (but these 3 can be used without gnome as well).

This is a source based project, we don't provide prebuilt packages currently. The packages are based on SlackBuilds and there is a tool to automate the building the whole desktop. Unfortunately I could test it only on x86-64 so far.

There was 3.18 as well, but it was very unstable. I made an update to 3.22 and I'm using it for some weeks now on my work desktop and I'm pretty happy with it.

All related information can be found on github: https://github.com/Dlackware. I don't post build instructions here, you can find them in the wiki: https://github.com/Dlackware/gnome/wiki/Install

It is still very young project, but I hope someone finds it useful and we get some new users.
Thanks.
 
Old 11-28-2016, 10:41 AM   #2
montagdude
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Nice work! I would try it, but I dislike Gnome and systemd.
 
Old 11-28-2016, 01:53 PM   #3
H1p8r10n
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Hi,

Just curious : why systemd ? is it a mandatory dep to build some gnome packages ?

Regards
JP
 
Old 11-28-2016, 02:15 PM   #4
belka.ew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H1p8r10n View Post
Hi,

Just curious : why systemd ? is it a mandatory dep to build some gnome packages ?

Regards
JP
Hi,

yes, Gnome depends more and more on systemd. GDM doesn't work very well without systemd (if at all); a lot of settings in control center like time settings, keyboard layout, language settings are done over systemd services. Maybe we would go without systemd if we could get a full featured desktop, but it is difficult. Maybe it is possible to avoid some dependencies with patches and similar, but we're only two developers for now and I really don't have any time to hack the gnome core, but I'm using gnome for years and don't want to miss it. And to be honest I can live with systemd now.
 
Old 11-28-2016, 03:24 PM   #5
H1p8r10n
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Thanks
 
Old 11-28-2016, 03:26 PM   #6
Emerson
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Gnome without systemd.

Edit: This is as current as it gets: https://github.com/dantrell/gentoo-p...ithout-systemd

Last edited by Emerson; 11-28-2016 at 06:27 PM.
 
Old 11-29-2016, 12:56 AM   #7
belka.ew
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Originally Posted by Emerson View Post
yes, see "important" notes on the page from the first link; and the notes on github: "systemd is a hard run time dependency for basic functionality". It is just like I said: possible, but difficult. It works on top of OpenRC and I personally don't prefer OpenRC to systemd in any way.
Part of the patches seems just to disable basic features that rely on systemd (for example time/date settings in the control center) and it is not something I understand under "full featured".
Some years ago I wrote a program that replaces a service for systemd to enable time/date support in the gnome control center: https://github.com/Dlackware/slack-timedate (there was a discussion on this forum, that also kde depends on this service at runtime now, iirc): https://github.com/Dlackware/slack-timedate. systemd isn't a pure init system. so, yes, if you can rewrite a few parts of systemd and permanently update half-maintained patches from other distributions to "disable" systemd dependency, you can get a working desktop. But it isn't the intention of the project.

Last edited by belka.ew; 11-29-2016 at 01:01 AM.
 
Old 11-29-2016, 01:07 AM   #8
H1p8r10n
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-> time/date settings in the control center

is it really worth it ?
 
Old 11-29-2016, 01:24 AM   #9
belka.ew
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Originally Posted by H1p8r10n View Post
-> time/date settings in the control center

is it really worth it ?
it was 2-3 years ago. I suppose more settings are done now the same way (keyboard and language are the ones I can think of). I can remember that gdm had problems without systemd-logind. And if something doesn't work you can't just go to the gnome's bugzilla and say: "hey, there is a bug", because it may be not a bug but a missing dependency. One can install dropline and compare. And the use of systemd was intented, we wanted to see how it would work on slackware compared to eudev, ConsoleKit2 and so on.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 07:59 PM   #10
bam80
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Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by belka.ew View Post
So our gnome is based on pam, systemd and wayland (but these 3 can be used without gnome as well)
Hi, what packages will be replaced? How slackware's init-scripts will be used, if any? Can I use/install only these two: systemd and wayland?
Are you maintaining it still?
 
Old 10-13-2017, 10:28 PM   #11
montagdude
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montagdude View Post
Nice work! I would try it, but I dislike Gnome and systemd.
I forgot that I made this post. As an update, I am using dlackware now (have been for a few months) and would say I now like Gnome as a DE and can live with systemd. Opinions change, I guess.
 
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Old 10-13-2017, 10:44 PM   #12
montagdude
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bam80 View Post
Hi, what packages will be replaced? How slackware's init-scripts will be used, if any? Can I use/install only these two: systemd and wayland?
Are you maintaining it still?
Here are the packages that are replaced:

Code:
NetworkManager
atk
atkmm
dbus
dconf
dconf
gdk
glib
glib2
glibmm
gnome
gobject
gsettings
gst
gst
gstreamer
gtk+3
gucharmap
gvfs
libcap
libsigc++
mesa
openssh
polkit
procps
shadow
shared
udisks2
upower
util
xorg
That's on my system, anyway. I did make some changes to the build (disabling wayland, for instance) and may have skipped a few packages.

As for the init scripts, I'll let the belka.ew answer that. However, I will mention that there is a systemd service included called "rc-local.service" which ensures that anything in your /etc/rc.d/rc.local script is started.

Last edited by montagdude; 10-13-2017 at 10:47 PM.
 
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Old 10-14-2017, 08:29 AM   #13
belka.ew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by montagdude View Post
I forgot that I made this post. As an update, I am using dlackware now (have been for a few months) and would say I now like Gnome as a DE and can live with systemd. Opinions change, I guess.
That's good to hear!
 
Old 10-14-2017, 08:39 AM   #14
belka.ew
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bam80 View Post
Hi, what packages will be replaced? How slackware's init-scripts will be used, if any? Can I use/install only these two: systemd and wayland?
Are you maintaining it still?
We don't use slackware's init-scripts. systemd has some nice features like monitoring services, restarting if the service crashes or sending notifications. It isn't possible with init scripts. Big packages like mysql provide today systemd-scripts anyway. Some systemd scripts for core slackware packages are still missing though, there is an open todo under dlackware issues.

systemd is in a separate repository and can be installed without gnome. wayland is in the gnome repository, but can be installed without other packages as well. But I doubt that slackware's kde or xfce will work with them. Unfortunately we just don't have the man power to support something else than gnome.
 
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Old 10-14-2017, 10:44 AM   #15
bam80
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Thanks @montagdude, @belka.ew
Quote:
Originally Posted by belka.ew View Post
Some systemd scripts for core slackware packages are still missing though, there is an open todo under dlackware issues.
Couldn't find it. Could you name them please? How it's critical for system functionality?

Quote:
systemd is in a separate repository and can be installed without gnome. wayland is in the gnome repository, but can be installed without other packages as well. But I doubt that slackware's kde or xfce will work with them. Unfortunately we just don't have the man power to support something else than gnome.
I'm not sure what repos are you talking about, if Dlackware doesn't provide binary packages(yet?). Also, it's not clear for me how updates are supposed to be performed in this case. Can I use sbopkg for this?
I wonder if AlienBob's KDE5 build can run with your Wayland compositor. What needs to be done for this? Can I easily test it and revert back if something goes wrong?
Thanks
 
  


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