Another slacker! :)
 

Got back a while ago from helping a client. Same one that gave me this 350 mhz machine.
For a while, I had her using PCLinuxOS, which she got used to. After being given a computer from her son, she tried using Xp. She needed some help from me getting things set up. Finally she asked if I could put linux back on for her since Windows was so "weird".
Since I don't have a current pclos cd on hand, I described Slackware to her and she said put it on.
Monday, I will bring her computer home and install Slackware 12 on it :)

I explained how she could have both systems installed because she needed the windows program that helps make her greeting cards and stuff besides some other programs.

Just wanted to share it :)

Good. Check if it's possible to run that greeting stuff with wine.

Hi,


You know, this is an interesting post because your client said 'windows was weird', it makes me remember the lots of times I've seen some linux-new-comer saying that Linux is weird, and the reason for that? he previously knew windows...

Is interesting because that makes people realize that there's no such thing as a weird system or a bad system or the like, there are just differences, and usually, we think that the 'non-weird' system is that one we know :)



Regards

Well, you have to admit, there are many things about Window$ that don't make sense ... unless of course you take the point of view of Bill Gates (or Gate$).

Good point indeed ;)



Regards

Suggest to her to try scribus for her greeting cards.

Brian

I will do that even though I don't know much of anything about it either ;)

Hey, thanks for the tip:-) My daughter's 5th birthday is coming up and I needed greeting card software to make invitations for her party (I don't run windows). Just grabbed scribus from slackbuilds.org, it looks good.

Between the gimp and scribus, you can do amazing graphics and layouts.

Brian

baby's comparison of wi/li
 

That is not amazing. A good friend of mine points to a survey where it was discovered that command-line interface is much more intuitive than graphical. But when a user gets used to graphical, you all know what happens.
What have I noticed about slackers: no fear of command line.

Yesterday I installed a Slackware on my former classmate's machine. And what do you expect? He immediately found golf-game in KDE and spent half the evening playing it, involving his little 10-years-old sister. She said "wow... Linux is a great deal. Is that a default game for the system?.. Wow... Windows can suggest nothing of this type."

Hi,

Not debating! I would like to know how the cli would be intuitive? If you don't know the commands or simple syntax of a command then you will get no where. Do you have a link to that survey?

Most gaming does take over the person! Sure the simple of it seems to be the entertainment value. I'm not a gamer. My wife likes them but she won't have a game system because of the addiction. She says too much wasted time for her.

I guess my system(s) maintenance doesn't count?

true :)

my only hesitation with the CL is having to type in long commands, because im lazy! and after that one can get around future inconvieniences with bash history, scripts, etc.

Ehhhrr....ok :)

No offense, but I don't see how is that related with what I've said =/

Nor I can't see how the CLI is more intuitive than graphical environments, I mean, if you get in gnome from the first time and you see at the topbar 'Applications' you think 'ohh..that's where the applications should be, let me check', if you are in the command line for the first time and see '[user@host]:$_' how is that more intuitive?




Regards

OK, I'll ask him where he got it, now I'm interested in it too.
Here it comes. Just a question. How did you get familiar with computers? Did you use graphical or CL interface? The intuitiveness of cl is in it's simpleness. Just command -- answer, command -- answer, and so on. You don't need to learn much, don't need to learn how this happens. You just need to know which commands are there. Where -- doesn't matter for an end user, they are at the $PATH.
Which is easier? To get along with CL or with graphical? Which is faster. The key simpleness lies at the base of CL.

Press TAB key twice? :-)

LOL - now that's a good one.

I've no intentions to go over a long debate 'CLI or GUI', but, from what I understand from the word 'intuitive' (and I might be wrong with this and maybe that's the problem), when you call something 'intuitive' is when you 'see something' that tells you what to do or where to go next...

Unless you see something displayed like:
Then I can't see the CLI as 'intuitive'...



Regards

Yes, yes, yes! :D

Well, Slackware didn't get installed. In fact, nothing did. I tried 5 different distributions, and they all crashed. At first, I couldn't figure out what was going on, then came to the conclusion that the machine had bad ram.
Some distros wouldn't even boot the installation cd and others crashed on first boot into system.
After shrinking the xp partition, downloading, burning, and trying to install any linux distro, I gave up for now. I have to verify the bad ram and then let the client know what is wrong and if she still wants linux enough to buy some ram and just get used to xp.
So, so much for another slacker for now :(

Hi,

Did you run memtest86 on the machine? Memtest86 is also available on Knoppix.

Are You saying that the machine shows no problems with XP?

I ran memtest86+ for a while, but had to return the computer to her.
xp ran fine every time I booted it which was quite often.
I will give her a cd (minime or riplinux) with memtest on it to run over night and see what happens.

FWIW, the distros I tried:
Slackware 12
Vector 5.8 SOHO
OpenSUSE 10.3
Mandriva 2008
PCLinuxOS MiniMe

If memory serves me correctly, about all were kernel panics, even trying to boot in safe-mode.

You don't really need to run memtest overnight, just until it completes one round of tests. It takes not more than 1 hr usually.

Her chipset is too new (probably). You need to run with newer kernel. Or maybe some bios features are incompatible.

Thanks again for the info.
I will double-check bios features and see if there is something I can turn off, when I can next get to the computer.
I did call her to double-check the model number. It's HP Pavilion a400n.

One thing I do remember when trying to install all the different distros, is that Slackware 12 with the huge.s kernel did install, but had kernel panics when doing first boot. That was the furtherest any distro got. At least Slackware got that far! ;)

Hi,

The HP Pavilion a400n is not that new, circa 2004.

Did you read the Slackware 12.0 CHANGES_AND_HINTS.TXT, UPGRADE.TXT and RELEASE_NOTES?


You needed to make initrd for the machine since your filesystem was not available in the kernel you selected. You should read the '/boot/README.initrd' to get the information on how to make a initrd.

For the memtest86, did you get any error(s)? Booting WinXp doesn't mean there are not any hardware problems. When you ran the test(s) did you have the case open or closed? If open then close it to put the machine in the same state as to when you got the errors.

If you do have the machine case open then check to make sure that the fans are operating for the power supply, CPU cooler and the case fan. Check the CPU heat sink fins to make sure that they are clean. If the inside is dirty then use some clean dry air to blow out. Be sure to do this maintenance with the power off.

Since you stated that Slackware 12 did install but failed on boot initially then I would suggest that you create the initrd as I suggested. Then see what happens.

Check the BIOS version on boot then goto the HP site to check for any ECO or BIOS changes for the level of BIOS in the machine. It could be something as simple as a BIOS update. If you do a BIOS update, be sure to backup the BIOS in case there is a problem with the update.

Slax is another Livecd with memtest86.

These links and others can be found at 'Slackware-Links' .

Thanks :)
I guess I understood or read the kernel installation section wrong. I thought that was for daily use not initial installation.
My thinking was after the system was installed, then change kernels. Guess I was wrong.
Yes, the case was closed and in normal operating environment, and yes, the fan was working. I had to check it because it was pretty dusty.
Also, yes, I knew the computer had some age, since it was her sons computer that he gave her after buying a new one, and having visited HP website myself.
The ram was just something I thought of at the time that could cause problems with other systems and not always systems from Richmond.
When I get the computer next, I will check some bios settings and then retry with the huge smp kernel and see how it goes.
Sorry for my misunderstanding of the kernel installation. Could have saved a lot of frustration :)

[SOLVED] Another slacker! :)
 

The problem turned out to be a video card that had been installed:
PNY GeForce FX 5200 DDR-128MB and it looks like in small print "64-bit".

I removed it, used the onboard video chip and linux boots.
FWIW- I have a back-up slave hd with OpenBSD 4.2 and I hooked it up to the computer and it booted just fine. I didn't try X, but at least the system booted with that video card.

Also, Slackware 12 booted just fine with the huge.s kernel that I installed from originally, and the onboard chip. I may re-install everything now that I know what was wrong, but slack is running beautifully at the moment :)

Thanks everybody.

Awesome. I'm glad you figured it out.:cool:

:) My mother thinks IE in Windows is difficult
 

She has been using Firefox in Slackware Linux for years. Once she went to my uncle's and tried to check her mail. When she came home she told me Windows is weird, slow and difficult to use.

By the way, I'm writing this from a friend's PC using Firefox in Windows XP. :)

Ok. I am back, was locked up with my examinations. Haven't forgotten about this thread. I got an answer from my friend, so. He says that it must have been this article: http://osnews.com/story/6282
came there from here: http://phd.pp.ru/Russian/Texts/cmdline.txt (unfortunately in Russian)
some fortune: http://phd.pp.ru/Russian/Texts/cmdline.txt
then he gives several other links in Russian, but it is useless to post them here

Aliases and functions are you best friends.

Well, of course the CLI is logical and easy to use! :D

The first time you get there you panic and write: help. After that you get a list of commands and type "help command" or "command --help" and get a list of the basic functions. Easy as that guys! ;)

Hey, I never knew there was a 'help' command ... that's funny :D and convenient, if only I had though to type it.

Hi,
Try 'help help'.

I've never seen it mentioned anywhere ever that there is a 'help' command. I guess it's not intuitive enough for new users so most documentation ignores it or something...very strange.

onebuck, I prefer `man man`.

Been a very long time since I checked but "man woman" used to be quite interesting (at least under FreeBSD).

Help was first command when teaching DOS, so it is intuitive for some type of people.

Hi,

I think the 'help help' is helpful.:scratch:

Where 'man -h' is a good reference.