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Old 03-20-2011, 08:45 AM   #1
kuiper
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Off-topic: "retarded"? (was: Slack13.1 Weird System Tray)


thanks mate,

I think im gonna have to move on to Vista im that retarded....
My windows still disappear but i will figure it out now ...
Thanks for your help

goodnight
(if ur in aus anyway)
 
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Old 03-20-2011, 09:01 AM   #2
onebuck
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Hi,
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuiper View Post
hey guys,

hmmmm to be honest im a little embarrassed with this question. I think i might have to quit slack and move to ubuntu..... jeez maybe even windows :P
(it is student night so drinks are free, maybe im just to retarded(tonight) to figure it out, so dont be to harsh :P !!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kuiper View Post
thanks mate,

I think im gonna have to move on to Vista im that retarded....
I take the above remarks for both posts as offensive! Remove the 'retarded'! It is insensitive, degrading and offensive. Post(s) have been reported.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kuiper View Post
My windows still disappear but i will figure it out now ...
Thanks for your help

goodnight
(if ur in aus anyway)
I do suggest that you keep from maintenance of your system when you must inebriate. After you sober up then do a Search here on LQ.
 
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Old 03-20-2011, 02:50 PM   #3
T3slider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onebuck View Post
Hi,

I take the above remarks for both posts as offensive! Remove the 'retarded'! It is insensitive, degrading and offensive. Post(s) have been reported.
If you're going to be overly sensitive at a colloquial expression not intended to insult the mentally handicapped (which I can only assume is the case, as the OP related 'retarded' to 'stupid' in a colloquial sense) then perhaps you should steer clear of *all* potentially harmful words and/or phrases yourself. I take offense to your objection to language that was not intended to be offensive. You yourself have used the word 'dumb' (see here for example) which is just as offensive as retarded, if not more so -- you are effectively calling someone who is unable to speak but is otherwise of sound mind stupid. I hope you've never used the word 'lame' or other such horribly offensive terms when examined etymologically!

Is such a derailing assassination of character really necessary when no malicious intent was implied? Should we all walk around trying not to step on eggshells with every breath? I object far more to your objection than to the OP's language (which admittedly I would try to avoid in a forum such as this).
 
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Old 03-20-2011, 05:20 PM   #4
onebuck
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Off topic reply

Hi,

Quote:
Originally Posted by T3slider View Post
If you're going to be overly sensitive at a colloquial expression not intended to insult the mentally handicapped (which I can only assume is the case, as the OP related 'retarded' to 'stupid' in a colloquial sense) then perhaps you should steer clear of *all* potentially harmful words and/or phrases yourself. I take offense to your objection to language that was not intended to be offensive. You yourself have used the word 'dumb' (see here for example) which is just as offensive as retarded, if not more so -- you are effectively calling someone who is unable to speak but is otherwise of sound mind stupid. I hope you've never used the word 'lame' or other such horribly offensive terms when examined etymologically!

Is such a derailing assassination of character really necessary when no malicious intent was implied? Should we all walk around trying not to step on eggshells with every breath? I object far more to your objection than to the OP's language (which admittedly I would try to avoid in a forum such as this).
/off topic
I'm not being overly sensitive here. If the poster had used 'stupid' then things would not have evolved to this situation. He/she did not! You feel it was assassination of character on my part towards the poster. That's a judgment call on your part. No where did I make such actions. Nor was it derailing. Your content is more of derail and really is not necessary. No egg shells here, just that people should be more aware of their words and how they do offend. As to your link for my use of the word 'dumb' within the context of that thread is appropriate;
Quote:
excerpt from #74;
We as responders must be careful when expressing ourselves since we can be easily be misunderstood by the choice and mix of our response. Yet, we cannot always dumb down to someone as they will take it in a condescending manner. Our compositions must come across honest, concise and yet informational without the reader taking objection to the content. I have found this to be a learning and ever evolving task for me to be able to communicate in a universal manner. I like to link words that the non-native reader may find helpful to understand my meaning.
Our discussion should be in 'General' or PM as it doesn't benefit anyone within this thread since it comes across as argumentative plus off topic. I will report & asked the forum moderator to extract these post(s) too 'General' or even LQ Suggestions & Feedback.

/back on topic
 
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Old 03-21-2011, 11:49 AM   #5
unSpawn
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These posts got copied / pruned from this thread in order to facilitate discussion in the Suggestions forum.
 
Old 03-21-2011, 12:42 PM   #6
anomie
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Sorry to say, it's threads like this that illustrate the failure of "Did you find this post helpful" systems. It's entirely political, and there is absolutely no technical merit here. Yet lots of folks have weighed in by voting.

[ Dear reader: I ask that you please - in this one instance - do not vote my post up or down. I didn't help (and hopefully didn't confuse) anyone with a Linux question. Just wanted to shed light on what I consider to be an obvious problem. ]
 
Old 03-21-2011, 12:53 PM   #7
unSpawn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anomie View Post
Sorry to say, it's threads like this that illustrate the failure of "Did you find this post helpful" systems. It's entirely political, and there is absolutely no technical merit here. Yet lots of folks have weighed in by voting.
I agree with you observation however "the rise and demise of the Helpful Or Not system" AFAIK is not what this thread is (supposed to be) about.
 
Old 03-22-2011, 11:48 AM   #8
MTK358
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onebuck View Post
I take the above remarks for both posts as offensive! Remove the 'retarded'! It is insensitive, degrading and offensive. Post(s) have been reported.
How?

Unless you are so strongly disturbed by the fact that the OP is describing himself as stupid, what can be offensive about it?
 
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Old 03-22-2011, 12:02 PM   #9
szboardstretcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTK358 View Post
How?

Unless you are so strongly disturbed by the fact that the OP is describing himself as stupid, what can be offensive about it?
I think they were saying that the word "Retarded" is offensive. Not the use of it.

Im sure if the OP would have said "I'm a half-wit" this thread wouldn't get the attention that it is getting. Even though "half-wit" has been used disparagingly for many, many more years than "retard," and literally has no positive meaning, where as at least "retarded" can alternately mean "slowed, hindered."
 
Old 03-22-2011, 01:32 PM   #10
onebuck
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Hi,

Quote:
Originally Posted by MTK358 View Post
How?

Unless you are so strongly disturbed by the fact that the OP is describing himself as stupid, what can be offensive about it?
The use of the word 'retarded' in a jesting sense is still harmful thus offensive. Casual speak or text should not harm in any fashion. "Colloquial sense" as a argument is just a block or to show that this should be overlooked thus accepted.

If people used other offensive labels to describe a situation then that too should cease. 'Colloquial expression' defense for the use of 'retarded' is a weak and insensitive position for formal or informal use as slang.

Just like the use of the words(slang) like: kike, nigger(1/2), retarded(4) or other poor and insensitive labels should not be used in any context that offends. Non of the for-mentioned words were intended to offend. Just some extreme examples of societies words that do harm. Too many to list individually!

Colloquialism action formal or informal are in itself so broad for the use of terms that are either accepted or denied. 'Stupid (pick one that fits)' in place of the word 'retarded' would have been better for the OP's position as a identified state. Instead of a relative term like retarded. Which does harm others both directly and indirect by the acceptance of this poor term in society's use and allowance as slang.
 
Old 03-22-2011, 02:02 PM   #11
szboardstretcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onebuck View Post
(pick one that fits)' in place of the word 'retarded' would have been better for the OP's position as a identified state. Instead of a relative term like retarded. Which does harm others both directly and indirect by the acceptance of this poor term in society's use and allowance as slang.
If you choose to go through life being hurt/bothered/offended by "words"...

Well then, America is the perfect place to be.

Because Congress will ban anything that someone complains about. Yeah every person sitting in this office, and your office will say "We are the Land of Free speech." Yep, unless it otherwise offends or bothers or irritates or incites or degrades or is about religion or sex or violence or bananas or race or anything that we just don't like-- then everyone thinks that there should be a law protecting us from dealing with it. I know I do.

I say we need more laws to keep society from using foul and disturbing language.

I don't want dictionaries to have words like "Retarded," "Poop," "wee wee," or anything equally offensive in them. I think all offensive slang and colloquialisms should only be allowed in the printed or spoken word if billed, voted on, and ratified by a committee that has our best interests in mind. I think freedom is a bad thing, because *your* personal freedom will eventually lead up to offending me or irritating me in some way shape or form. So, no one should have any.

We should first concentrate on the schools. A state sponsored censor should be at every level of K-12, in every class, to curtail the spreading of malignant and purposefully hateful and distasteful language. Some of the things I've heard at my kids school, said by other children, could hurt his growth as a person. Words such as "Doo doo head," "dummy face," "dum dum," should be removed from our society completely.

And obviously the Internet needs a censor. Some agency to read each email, communication and post in the world and on LinuxQuestions to make sure that it meets the standards of civilized society as a whole, so that none of us are tainted by extreme ideas or bad words. Especially those pointed at oneself. But who knows, I'm just an idiot.

In fact, If it were up to me, every person, including myself would have our brains wired up to the police station where they could keep an eye on what we are thinking. Then I think there should be tickets and points given to those who have racy, inappropriate thoughts or use derogatory language in their heads, and once you get so many points, they jail you for life.

Instead of moderators, we should have NewSpeak officials. Someone to make sure that every person is equally unable to talk or convey ideas that offend, or may possibly offend, to protect us from being hurt by other's words...
 
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Old 03-22-2011, 02:31 PM   #12
onebuck
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Hi,

As for my stance, I believe you will get out what you put into anything. Poor actions deserve poor results! Plus 'Free Speech' should not harm others or even imply hurtful feelings whenever possible.

Good manners is the art of making those people easy with whom we converse. Whoever makes the fewest persons uneasy, is the best bred in the company.”- Swift

 
Old 03-22-2011, 02:38 PM   #13
szboardstretcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onebuck View Post
Hi,

As for my stance, I believe you will get out what you put into anything. Poor actions deserve poor results! Plus 'Free Speech' should not harm others or even imply hurtful feelings whenever possible.

Good manners is the art of making those people easy with whom we converse. Whoever makes the fewest persons uneasy, is the best bred in the company.”- Swift

"I have a respect for manners - they are a way of dealing with people you don't agree with or like." - Margret Mead
 
Old 03-22-2011, 02:59 PM   #14
T3slider
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retard (v.)
late 15c., from Fr. retarder (13c.), from L. retardare (see retardation). The noun is recorded from 1788 in the sense "retardation, delay;" from 1970 in offensive meaning "retarded person," originally Amer.Eng., with accent on first syllable.

retardation
early 15c., "fact or action of making slower in movement or time," from L. retardationem, from retardare "to make slow, delay, keep back, hinder," from re-, intensive prefix, + tardare "to slow" (see tardy).

The use of this word legitimately far predates its use as a derogatory term and is still used by some as a legitimate term to imply a delay/slowing. For example, describing motion through a viscous liquid.

re·tard
 [ri-tahrd, for 1–3, 5; ree-tahrd for 4]
–verb (used with object)
1.
to make slow; delay the development or progress of (an action, process, etc.); hinder or impede.
–verb (used without object)
2.
to be delayed.
–noun
3.
a slowing down, diminution, or hindrance, as in a machine.
4.
Slang: Disparaging .
a.
a mentally retarded person.
b.
a person who is stupid, obtuse, or ineffective in some way: a hopeless social retard.

It is being used in the disparaging sense in 4b, and though it may be etymologically rooted in 4a, its use as a general word can be traced back to 1 and its use as a disparaging term has become disparate enough from 4a to warrant its own entry as a synonym for stupid.

The etymology of the word lame, and its definition, carry a similar history, as does the etymology and definition of the word dumb. I'm sure there are many other examples of words that have become commonplace for disparaging remarks not necessarily intended to reflect upon their original meanings. As the language evolves I'm sure the number of cases will only increase. The word was used in a self-deprecating sense, and I get the distinct feeling that you would raise no objections if instead the OP used the term 'dumb' or 'dummy' (and I can be so confident because your post history carries a number of legitimate responses to those calling themselves dumb without raising hell).

Providing arbitrary boundaries on what can be said when there was no intent to insult anyone else is foolish, and comparing anything in this thread to the use of words like 'kike' and 'nigger' (which frankly I'm uncomfortable just typing) is completely off-base. Those words have no colloquial meaning and I don't believe they ever will; those words are 100% disparaging to a subset of any population and carry nothing but negative connotations in modern use regardless of their etymology. In other words, they have nothing to do with the word 'retard' which has become more synonymous with 'stupid' than 'mentally handicapped' in recent years.
 
Old 03-22-2011, 03:09 PM   #15
szboardstretcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T3slider View Post
...Providing arbitrary boundaries on what can be said when there was no intent to insult anyone else is foolish...

...those words are 100% disparaging to a subset of any population and carry nothing but negative connotations in modern use regardless of their etymology.
I agree on the first part.

I believe drug-dealers would disagree with you. Also, rappers in general would disagree with you. Ice Cube will disagree with you. Snoop Dog, Chris Rock will disagree with you.

Why? Because they will greet each other with that word. They will say nice things and compliment one another, while referring to each other as that word. That word has so many positive synonyms for that "subset." So, I disagree with you. It has more than just "negative connotations," if you listen carefully enough to how people use it in every day speech, movies, songs, and books.

Of course, saying it while not from the correct ethnicity, will get you into a situation like Randy Marsh.
 
  


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