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Old 04-27-2020, 10:44 PM   #1
Lown93
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Teaching Kids Linux


Hello Everyone,

I recently came across a YouTube video by NetworkChuck advising that we should be teaching our kids Linux. My kids (aged 6 & 7) are already learning basic coding at school and I thought Linux would be a good way for me to get involved and not only learn it myself as someone with no knowledge of coding but also as a way for me to do something productive and fun with my kids.

So I found an old RaspberryPi given to my kids a while back and followed NetwrokChuck's instructions on how to set it up for learning linux and hacking. By the end of the setup I found myself asking what now? How do I actually learn Linux? The sugar program doesn't actually teach you how to use it or the commands that may be necessary. Maybe I'm missing something?

The learning resources I came across weren't suitable for beginners like me. I have found a couple of YouTube video that say they're offering a full course on the subject but require me to setup a virtual machine, so I looked into Azure & quickly realised I would need to learn Azure on top of the Linux and I worry this may be too much all at once.

I would appreciate any advice on the best way to learn Linux preferably using the RaspberryPi but I don't mind using Azure if I can find a suitable tutorial on how to use it.

Thanks in advance for any help you may be able to provide.
 
Old 04-28-2020, 07:47 AM   #2
redd9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lown93 View Post
I have found a couple of YouTube video that say they're offering a full course on the subject but require me to setup a virtual machine, so I looked into Azure & quickly realised I would need to learn Azure on top of the Linux and I worry this may be too much all at once.
Those tutorials are probably assuming you don't have a Linux computer such as the RasPi at the ready. If you want you could link some tutorials and I could check them out to see if they could be done in a RasPi (probably yes).

Imo the best way to learn Linux is to do projects on a Linux machine. See if you can turn your RasPi into a web server (many tutorials are available for this). If your kids are coding, see if you can set one of their programs to run at designated intervals. When you get stuck and need to look up which command to use, that's where the learning happens!
 
Old 04-28-2020, 07:53 AM   #3
redd9
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Also, check out the 'Basic' commands here. Not very exciting but should get you started enough to move on to bigger and better things.
 
1 members found this post helpful.
Old 04-28-2020, 08:09 AM   #4
lleb
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to add to redd9's good advice, I have had nothing but OSx and Linux in my household and small business since around 2003 or so. My kids grew up on Linux on their laptops and the house computers.

When my daughter entered high school she needed a laptop, her first mind you, for school projects, work, etc... I picked up a refurbished Asus with win7 at the time pre-installed. After less than 24hr she asked me to put Linux on her new laptop. She did not like MS Windows. Why? Simple it was not as friendly as the Linux she had grown up with.

People know and are comfortable with what they use.

That being said, if you want to "teach" them Linux, a RPi is a good start as they are cheap and run Linux with minimal issues. Setting up a web server, or a Samba file server is a great easy place to start. Going from DHCP to Static IP is a nice little simple task. Perform as much as possible using the command line (CLI). Learn VI/VIM, yes that statement will draw loads of flack, but tough VI is on all *nix systems out there. VIM may not be installed, but can be quickly in most cases, but if you know VI, you really dont need VIM or any other text editor.

Some basic BASH scripting to perform little tasks like backup a directory, a tree, or a full computer using rsync with ssh, and RSA tokens is another great learning project. Check out my sig for some starting info on that process.

Good luck and enjoy the learning curve along with the freedom of choice. Yes there will be times you will want to pull your hair out, but in the long run it is so worth not fighting with a corporation that seems to think it knows better than the user/administrator, and that is pushing leasing OS's on the world vs selling/giving the OS to the people who use/buy it.

Not to mention by not running win10, you are no longer giving away your usages statistics to MS and who knows what 3rd party advertiser to use without you being able to stop.

https://blogs.systweak.com/how-to-di...in-windows-10/

you can reduce the amount sent to MS, but you cannot eliminate it fully.
 
1 members found this post helpful.
Old 04-28-2020, 08:16 AM   #5
Turbocapitalist
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Welcome.

"Linux" is rather a broad goal. Can you give more specifics about what kinds of tasks you would like to accomplish?

Avoid Azure like the plague it is. It looks like a dying service, apparently propped up with accounting tricks. Further, there are simply no use-cases calling for Azure especially in regards to learning. It's not relevant, so watch out and avoid tutorials trying to trick you into Azure. That caveat aside, if "cloud" ever becomes relevant in later projects there are better, cheaper options. Vultr or Scaleway or dozens of others exist with Azure being the bottom of the barrel.

The current pedagogical trend centers around Python 3, but all other languages are available for the Raspberry Pi, too, ranging from COBOL and FORTRAN to Rust and Golang or C. Even Erlang is there in the Raspbian repository.

As a beginner, you can do everything you want via the Raspberry Pi as far as learning computing. Despite their size they are more powerful than the machines that built the Internet or drove the dot-com boom. The Raspberry Pi Foundation plows lots of money back into training materials for all levels of skill and experience. That is the reason the Raspberry Pi exists. Using GNU/Linux on the Raspberry Pi, you can follow a gradual progression from absolute novice to expert in quite a bit of hardware or nearly any area of software. Though you may quickly need additional units for activities involving networking. That is even more true if you use the Raspberry Pi as a crossover to physical computing.

Places to start looking for introductory material suitable for the absolute novice:

https://magpi.raspberrypi.org/

https://magpi.raspberrypi.org/books

Note that the materials above have free-of-charge electronic editions, so you can experiment a lot without an up front financial investment.
 
1 members found this post helpful.
Old 04-28-2020, 08:58 AM   #6
pan64
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kids may have a different learning curve, probably you can let him/her find his/her own way. Actually need to find a goal to see how successful was the course.
You only need to help to realize/reach that goal.
 
Old 04-28-2020, 12:15 PM   #7
sevendogsbsd
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How about just teach them to use Linux as a desktop. Bet they'll catch on quickly. No need to teach little ones coding or cloud tech right off the bat...where Microsoft failed the world by flooding it with their garbageware back in the early 90's, maybe this generation of kids can be taught there are alternatives.
 
2 members found this post helpful.
Old 04-28-2020, 03:32 PM   #8
captain_sensible
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i think the Raspberry PI marketing team were very "savy" they have associated that if your a school teacher, child at school or other student Raspberry Pi is the way to go.

Apart from its gpio thats not true.

I've had some experience in Ghana ,West Africa a few years back and immediately there were issues. Number one was all the available screens were VGA and PI had HMDI so it was like a rich mans toy to me out in Africa.yes of course you could get an expensive adapter form Maplin before it went under but ..

Also its using ARM architecture.

I found that with any Pentium IV computer and a good OS; the basics could be taught. Who decides thought what should be taught, what are the priorities etc though?

My experience was that with no system nor interest in clamping down on stolen software (cloned Windows) in Ghana basically hardly anybody was interested in Linux.

So what should a child be introduced to ? well you don't need PI to teach python; you can use geany to code and run python or straight from terminal. Same for php sqlite3 , MySQL - there are several ways you can work with that.

Then i had the experience of "bright sparks" coming out to Ghana setting up things with no thought or consideration for the reality and then disappearing back to Uk or USA leaving systems that nobody could fix when things go wrong.


Basically my current thinking is take any desktop PC pentium IV and later and stick Slackware on it and you have the basis of a system from which anything except gpio can be learnt.
 
Old 04-28-2020, 05:05 PM   #9
Lown93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redd9 View Post
Those tutorials are probably assuming you don't have a Linux computer such as the RasPi at the ready. If you want you could link some tutorials and I could check them out to see if they could be done in a RasPi (probably yes).

Imo the best way to learn Linux is to do projects on a Linux machine. See if you can turn your RasPi into a web server (many tutorials are available for this). If your kids are coding, see if you can set one of their programs to run at designated intervals. When you get stuck and need to look up which command to use, that's where the learning happens!
Thanks redd9,

I have found the following YouTube video courses:

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wBp0Rb-ZJak

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bju_...PmiRarU7hrpnwK

3. https://www.youtube.com/user/theurbanpenguin

I've also found the following courses that maybe a little too advanced for me at my current level but there is a course or two that maybe suitable for a beginner:

1. https://training.linuxfoundation.org...pe=free-course

2. https://www.edx.org/learn/linux

When I Wrote my query I didn't know how exactly it was I was supposed to learn linux and after a few hours of researching I think I figured out the best way to learn is to find and copy projects suited to my level. I've found the following sites that have projects that I can do with my kids and teach them as I go along:

1. https://www.hackster.io/projects/tags/linux

2. https://linuxhint.com/best_linux_projects_newbies/

I appreciate your help and please know I'm not asking/expecting you to go through all of the material I've listed. It's just that I've spent a couple of days compiling a list of resources and I'm excited to share what I've found (in case you're interested, not a problem if you're not).

This morning the family (inc the wife) was up learning to touch type and everyone really enjoyed themselves (inc the wife). I also had the kids start the beginners course on code academy and they really loved it. They started experimenting with the variables and outside of what was asked of them in the course and they had an amazing time discovering what they could create.

My father in law dropped off a RaspberryPi book of 10 projects that I wanted to go through as my daughter wanted to play the Minecraft app in Raspbian but for some reason the app wouldn't open, the buffering sand timer thing popped up but then disappeared with nothing happening. I guess that's a problem for tomorrow.

Thanks again and I will be checking out the link you provided a little later tonight.
 
Old 04-28-2020, 05:29 PM   #10
Lown93
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Registered: Apr 2020
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Original Poster
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Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbocapitalist View Post
Welcome.

"Linux" is rather a broad goal. Can you give more specifics about what kinds of tasks you would like to accomplish?

Avoid Azure like the plague it is. It looks like a dying service, apparently propped up with accounting tricks. Further, there are simply no use-cases calling for Azure especially in regards to learning. It's not relevant, so watch out and avoid tutorials trying to trick you into Azure. That caveat aside, if "cloud" ever becomes relevant in later projects there are better, cheaper options. Vultr or Scaleway or dozens of others exist with Azure being the bottom of the barrel.

The current pedagogical trend centers around Python 3, but all other languages are available for the Raspberry Pi, too, ranging from COBOL and FORTRAN to Rust and Golang or C. Even Erlang is there in the Raspbian repository.

As a beginner, you can do everything you want via the Raspberry Pi as far as learning computing. Despite their size they are more powerful than the machines that built the Internet or drove the dot-com boom. The Raspberry Pi Foundation plows lots of money back into training materials for all levels of skill and experience. That is the reason the Raspberry Pi exists. Using GNU/Linux on the Raspberry Pi, you can follow a gradual progression from absolute novice to expert in quite a bit of hardware or nearly any area of software. Though you may quickly need additional units for activities involving networking. That is even more true if you use the Raspberry Pi as a crossover to physical computing.

Places to start looking for introductory material suitable for the absolute novice:

https://magpi.raspberrypi.org/

https://magpi.raspberrypi.org/books

Note that the materials above have free-of-charge electronic editions, so you can experiment a lot without an up front financial investment.

Thanks Turbocapitalist,

The projects look really cool and I'll definitely be downloading and trying some of them out.
 
Old 04-28-2020, 06:36 PM   #11
fido_dogstoyevsky
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Excellent advice for learning "Linux" from sevendogsbsd.

They'll learn best if they play with the system trying to get "normal" stuff done and playing with the software - eg installing and trying out drawing software, web browsers, even office suites - and breaking things which you then help them fix. This will also get them used to the idea that software really doesn't need to be locked up in a restrictive EULA. A desktop/laptop is probably best for this.

Don't worry about the programming aspect unless they're interested in it, or you'll make it too much like hard work. Best way to push this is probably to get them interested in some projects that just happen to need programming - the RPi is rally good for this, there's a good number of projects available.
 
1 members found this post helpful.
Old 04-28-2020, 08:43 PM   #12
Lown93
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Registered: Apr 2020
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Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by lleb View Post
to add to redd9's good advice, I have had nothing but OSx and Linux in my household and small business since around 2003 or so. My kids grew up on Linux on their laptops and the house computers.

When my daughter entered high school she needed a laptop, her first mind you, for school projects, work, etc... I picked up a refurbished Asus with win7 at the time pre-installed. After less than 24hr she asked me to put Linux on her new laptop. She did not like MS Windows. Why? Simple it was not as friendly as the Linux she had grown up with.

People know and are comfortable with what they use.

That being said, if you want to "teach" them Linux, a RPi is a good start as they are cheap and run Linux with minimal issues. Setting up a web server, or a Samba file server is a great easy place to start. Going from DHCP to Static IP is a nice little simple task. Perform as much as possible using the command line (CLI). Learn VI/VIM, yes that statement will draw loads of flack, but tough VI is on all *nix systems out there. VIM may not be installed, but can be quickly in most cases, but if you know VI, you really dont need VIM or any other text editor.

Some basic BASH scripting to perform little tasks like backup a directory, a tree, or a full computer using rsync with ssh, and RSA tokens is another great learning project. Check out my sig for some starting info on that process.

Good luck and enjoy the learning curve along with the freedom of choice. Yes there will be times you will want to pull your hair out, but in the long run it is so worth not fighting with a corporation that seems to think it knows better than the user/administrator, and that is pushing leasing OS's on the world vs selling/giving the OS to the people who use/buy it.

Not to mention by not running win10, you are no longer giving away your usages statistics to MS and who knows what 3rd party advertiser to use without you being able to stop.

https://blogs.systweak.com/how-to-di...in-windows-10/

you can reduce the amount sent to MS, but you cannot eliminate it fully.

Thanks lleb,

I really appreciate the links. I was planning on making the Static IP change but the video I watched didn't clarify when assigning a new static IP, whether it's something I can make up or does it have to be based on my current IP address, can you help? Also you mentioned to check out your sig, What is that and where would I find it? Sorry don't know the terminology yet.

thanks again

Last edited by Lown93; 04-28-2020 at 08:52 PM.
 
Old 04-28-2020, 08:46 PM   #13
redd9
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Yeah, looking at those courses, none of them require Azure or Virtualbox. Just ignore the parts talking about the Ubuntu desktop is all.

Those sites look cool!
 
Old 04-28-2020, 08:48 PM   #14
Lown93
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Registered: Apr 2020
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Thanks again

Quote:
Originally Posted by redd9 View Post
Yeah, looking at those courses, none of them require Azure or Virtualbox. Just ignore the parts talking about the Ubuntu desktop is all.

Those sites look cool!
Thanks Redd9
 
Old 04-28-2020, 09:02 PM   #15
Lown93
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We started today

Quote:
Originally Posted by pan64 View Post
kids may have a different learning curve, probably you can let him/her find his/her own way. Actually need to find a goal to see how successful was the course.
You only need to help to realize/reach that goal.

We all started the Code Academy learn to code course today and everyone really enjoyed it. The kids started experimenting with the code to make some variables that weren't even part of the available options. They definately preferred the practical coding part as they also setup their accounts in the command line using raspian and they didn't want to stop.

I think I'll let the kids follow the code academy course as it really seems to be geared towards people who have no prior experience.
 
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