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Old 03-18-2003, 05:16 PM   #16
Sparky
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There is a time and a place for EVERYTHING! Telling me "Jesus loves me" or ANY other such comments --> HERE <-- is TOTALLY INAPPROPRIATE, JUDGEMENTAL AND ANTAGONISTIC! We told him we find it OFFENSIVE and yet, he CONTINUES to make his comments. THAT is the action of an DAMN FOOL (and is how WARS get started). Since THIS is related to LINUX and NOT Jesus it is NOT us that have "closed minds." We would prefer to stay on the TOPIC of Linux and which disto to suggest (Red Hat or Mandrake), but OFFENSIVE comments of a religious nature continue to be made and NOT by the poor person that started this link -- HE (or she) JUST wanted to know what distro to use! I can't see how that has ANYTHING to do with Jesus, Mohamad, Buddah or Adolf Hitler (ask me and I don't see a difference between any of them but that's NOT the point HERE!). Can we keep religious comments OUT of this? Free speech is free speech, but NOT EVERYWHERE!!! If I closed my messages with "F**K YOU" (fill in the spaces -- it's not hard) would be NO different than saying "Jesus loves you" -- SOME people find this OFFENSIVE SO STOP IT!!!!!!! THIS IS NOT THE PLACE TO MAKE THOSE COMMENTS!!!!!

"For Christ's Sake" try to understand this is a Linux board/web site and not some sort of evangelistic platform to spew religious opinions. ;-)
 
Old 03-18-2003, 06:31 PM   #17
busbarn
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I think I missed how this was being used as an evangelistic platform. It isn't even worth arguing about because your sense of reason is shot. This isn't a place for what comments? His comments were totally about linux distros. THat should be the end of the story. It's a SIGNATURE. I'm also afraid you have a tainted view of free speech. You have just excerised yours while condeming someone else for their signature.

Case in point, there are discussions of all kinds on this site. Here's one I find offensive:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...threadid=49042
Some of these guys are joking around about porn which is degrading to women and not necessary for a computer forum. But they have that right to talk about what they want. I'm not endorsing the whole "what's for you is for you" mindset, but chill out man. Until it's in the member guidelines that you may not discuss anything non-linux related, then your case is useless. C'mon linux is about choice and freedom anyways right? Rats, is linux religious?
 
Old 03-19-2003, 02:45 AM   #18
Sparky
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Quote from busbarn:
I think I missed how this was being used as an evangelistic platform (e-van-gel-ist: 1. Any of the Authors of the New Testament Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John. 2. A Protestant who pratices evangelism ---> LIKE HERE!!! <---). It isn't even worth arguing about because your sense of reason is shot. (HOW is my sense of reason shot? Did you read any of this? You offer NO examples to support your arguement. My first comments were offered as an opposing view point as well as to be offensive to someone of his religious persuasion so the point of simply being offensive is better understood.) This isn't a place for what comments? (RELIGIOUS COMMENTS DON'T BELONG ON A LINUX BOARD -- IT'S OFF TOPIC!) His comments were totally about linux distros (AGAIN! did you READ it? Apparently not!). THat should be the end of the story. It's a SIGNATURE. (Signatures can be ERASED and/or changed but his unwillingness to do so is antagonistic. He even out right said "nope, don't think so" when asked to keep his offensive opinions to himself and THAT was NOT a signature!) I'm also afraid you have a tainted view of free speech (Not at all. But as I said; There is a time and place for everything and THIS area is NOT it!). You have just excerised yours while condeming someone else for their signature. (Again, you apparently did NOT read the entire thread and miss the point. His religious comments were offensive even though YOU might not see it, and DON'T belong here. I NEVER said he CAN'T make them. THE POINT IS: OFFENSIVE RELIGIOUS COMMENTS DON'T BELONG HERE! Can I make that ANY clearer? This is a Linux discussion board and offensive behavior that is off topic is just plain stupid. So if I'm guilty of anything it calling an idiot and "idiot").

Case in point, there are discussions of all kinds on this site. Here's one I find offensive (Then TELL THEM! At least I have the stones to say something HERE):
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...threadid=49042
Some of these guys are joking around about porn which is degrading to women and not necessary for a computer forum (I agree. Porn in ANY form has no point, but I won't argue against it UNLESS it's OFF TOPIC and I'm trying to read the ON topic discussion! If anyone is guilty of some sort of indescretion, it's the moderator for not taking some kind of action when topics go astray!). But they have that right to talk about what they want (yes they do, but do you think they can have that discussion in the fourier of any US state capital? -- there is a time and PLACE for everything!). I'm not endorsing the whole "what's for you is for you" mindset, but chill out man. Until it's in the member guidelines that you may not discuss anything non-linux related, then your case is useless (The case is NOW anyone reading this thread has to wade through a lot of CRAP that is OFF TOPIC and THAT pretty much sums it up). C'mon linux is about choice and freedom anyways right? (Yes it is. But do you think Microsoft Windows chat boards want to talk about Linux any more than us Linux enthusiats want to talk about Jesus? I SAY NO!) Rats, is linux religious?

There is a time and a place for everything. Your right to speak your mind is NOT greater than MY right to be left in peace! If I go to church and the priest starts talking about how great Satin (the devil) is, then who do you think is more at fault?! Me for wanting to hear about god and EXPECTING to? Or the Priest fo straying from the topic and OFFENDING me (and possibly everyone else)? No one said the Priest didn't have the "right" to speak his mind but it is hardly appropriate. You can take this argument even one step further if you look at the topic of smoking: It's LEGAL to smoke (tobacco), but OFFENSIVE! You have the right to smoke, but I don't think you have the right to offend me by blowing it in my face or even indirectly such that I would have no choice but to breathe it in. I may be more at fault if I enter an area designated for smoking, but if I don't go to a designated smoking area then I should reasonably expect that I would NOT have to breathe in anyone's smoke. Same thing here. You can talk about Jesus all you want, but I hardly think anyone reading this thread was EXPECTING it!!! The topic is offensive and wrong even if you don't see the offense it's there simply because there are objections. I originally started reading this thread thinking that I could offer my opinion about Mandrake Linux and NOT have to endure comments about Jesus -- I find it offensive and I'm NOT the only one either! Do you UNDERSTAND that now? I predict this isn't the end of it, but I sure hope so...
 
Old 03-19-2003, 12:45 PM   #19
busbarn
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Isn't this blizzard we're having great? (If you aren't in colorado, there's about 4 feet of much needed snow on the ground)

I agree with you that this isn't a board to express religious ideas...okay spiritual ideas. Too many linux folks are extremely religious when it comes to what distro and desktop.

***Just to make one of my posts relevant, I like mandrake better than red hat...red hat's slow and for the life of me I couldn't get my sound card working. Gentoo is better than both.***

But just in case I missed something, I reread the thread. The guy gives an answer and someone responds to his thread being offensive. He's asked to remove it and says no. People get offended because he's passionate about sticking to what he believes. I think this community is extremely professional. What if sal is a pastor or works in a church or something? His profession is God. Granted, I'm playing a huge what if game but I guess the possibility is there.

Regardless, you are right, this should be the end of...I just don't think someone should be flamed for somehting that doesn't break the guidelines of the community. If that was the case, a moderator would have stepped in and closed the thread or ripped us all a new one. And I think that whoever brought up the idea that the sig was offensive was the one that pulled this thread off topic...and then you and I ran with it and look where its at.

You are right there is a time and place for everything (a quote straight from the Bible even ) and if somebody were to begin every thread with "Come to Jesus or your going to hell, and I choose mandrake linux" than I would agree with you hands down. BUt if someone's signature is a representation of who they are, then let it be...at least it makes for good discussion right?

This just in:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...threadid=50583
What does this have to do with linux? NOTHING!! That's why there's the general forum. And if you noticed, there have been a ton of views of this thread for what ever thats worth.

Last edited by busbarn; 03-19-2003 at 12:58 PM.
 
Old 03-19-2003, 06:10 PM   #20
yngwin
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You suggest I pulled this thread off topic. I didn't. I put in my contribution on topic and in an aside I kindly asked S. to change his sig as it is offensive and inappropriate here. Then one thing led to another. Actually I am surprised that it led to flaming and that no moderator has closed this topic. (Have they been sleeping or are policies just that loose here?)

Of course there is a time and place to discuss anything. But when we're discussing Linux distros I do not like to be confronted with evangelistic signatures. I would think this rather fits in the biblical commandment not to use the Lord's name in vain!

And don't understand me wrong, I have nothing against religion, nor am I offended if someone sticks to what he believes. If he'd only said "I'm a christian, read more at my website" that would be OK. But instead he shoves "Jesus loves you" into my face at every post. And that IS offensive for someone who's been mistreated, betrayed and abused by the Church, having been psychologically crippled for years and on the verge of breakdown thanks to having been brainwashed with a fundamentalist christian worldview.
 
Old 03-19-2003, 06:26 PM   #21
busbarn
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Well said. I cannot argue with what you have said, or how you have said it. I'm sorry you have experienced what you have experienced to make this a sensitive topic. It's too bad that there are people out there that distort history (I'm using extreme general language here) for their own personal motives. It breaks my heart. I'm sure I'll get flamed for that comment to, but oh well. While it is impossible for me to completely understand--how can I when I have not exereinced what you have experienced--i can at least be empathic (for all of those out there, empathetic is not a word ).

Good one on using the Lord's name in vain...very funny!

So...uh...gentoo anybody?
 
Old 03-20-2003, 06:07 PM   #22
yngwin
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Quote:
Originally posted by busbarn
Well said. I cannot argue with what you have said, or how you have said it. I'm sorry you have experienced what you have experienced to make this a sensitive topic.
Thanks for your sympathy. Yeah, I've had my share of difficulties in life, but they're learning experiences too. I try to concentrate on the good side, but you can't always ignore the pain.

Quote:
Good one on using the Lord's name in vain...very funny!
Hey, what do you expect arguing with a theologian?

Quote:
So...uh...gentoo anybody?
Yeah, me! I'm a real Gentoo addict! No distro that beats that one, for me at least.
 
Old 03-20-2003, 06:56 PM   #23
busbarn
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Gentoo is the first distro that I can understand how it works and what does what. I got mandy, slack, and redhat all to work but I felt useless keeping it upgraded and organized. I partitioned my hard drive to install other distros but I jsut don't want to.
 
Old 03-21-2003, 04:33 PM   #24
yngwin
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Yeah, I know what you mean. I've used Mandrake and Debian before. They're fine distros but I've never felt so comfortable with my system as now with Gentoo.
 
  


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