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Old 08-07-2018, 11:31 AM   #16
TB0ne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcluper View Post
I have decided to install OpenSuse 42.3 and make it a dual boot system.

1. Mainly because I may need Windows 10 somewhere down the road for something other than my other Windows Boxes.
2. The Linux Computer will primarily be used for Linux only.
3. We will have other Windows Computers that will connect to the Linux box (& my database programs) through a Linux emulation program called IceTenPro. We have been using IceTen for the Unix connection to Windows machines for over 25 years and it works well.
4. I have made a Windows Restore DVD and also created a System Image Backup in case I screw something up.
5. My only issue now is when I install OpenSuse 42.3 is how to leave the Windows 10 Partitions unchanged except for creating plenty of partition space for all the Linux. I have a 1TB HDD, so I was thinking of allocating 600 GB for all the Linux areas.

Can someone help me determine how to create the correct partitions for the Lunix when I am installing ?

After that Step I think I am good to get all else taken care of. I installed Suse 10.1 about 12 years ago but remember so little about it, I'm scared of making a dumb mistake that screws the whole project up.
You seem to be ignoring questions that have been asked, and the advice you've been given. Again:
  • OpenSuSE 42.3 is OLD..that is not the latest version, so why are you installing it???
  • What are these custom programs? What are they written in, and where do they run? Because, again, you cannot just COPY them from SCO to Linux.
  • Why are you sticking with a proprietary Filepro DB, rather than migrating to something newer and more scalable?
  • IceTen? That is ancient, written for serial terminals, and there's zero need for it. MobaXterm is FAR better, supporting FTP, Telnet, SSH, X, as well as VNC and RDP. And it's free.
If you're going to update from that SCO system, you need to update, rather than using very old stuff for no reason, other than "that's what we've always used". You are in a PERFECT setup to do a parallel migration, and get the bugs ironed out before going into production. Also, there is another option for you to consider: doing a full openSUSE installation, and running Windows 10 in a virtual environment. Virtualbox is trivial to install, and since you have a Windows 10 recovery disk, you could spin up a new virtualbox machine and do a Windows 10 installation there, using the same product key you already have. Windows under Linux, for when you need it...no dual booting involved.

As far as dual-booting, there are many, MANY already written how-to guides, found by putting "how to dual boot opensuse and windows 10" into Google:
http://opensuse-guide.org/installation.php
 
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Old 08-07-2018, 12:26 PM   #17
mrmazda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcluper View Post
Can someone help me determine how to create the correct partitions for the Lunix when I am installing?
Windows includes a native filesystem partition shrinkage utility. Good as YaST's partitioner is, it's well arguable that it is best to give Windows first crack at the shrinkage process. At the very least it should be faster, since there is no native NTFS driver in Linux, working through FUSE instead. Start by turning off paging/swap and hibernation and reboot so as to free the huge space they occupy. YaST might be able to create additional space, if needed

Before starting openSUSE installation, make sure you understand the significance of its BTRFS root filesystem snapshotting default. You need not accept it, in which case you would select the former default EXT4 instead. You can expect YaST to make a reasonable proposal of space allocation/partitioning, but it gives you the power to choose as you wish, either altering the proposal, or spelling it out all on your own.
 
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Old 08-07-2018, 12:48 PM   #18
tcluper
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Smile Why do I use FilePro ?

I appreciate the help and thoughts more than you know
I may not know much about Linux, but I do know my business.
Because in the late 80's I spent close to 40k developing a system specific to our industry and to this day we haven't found anything close to our system.
Plus our 43 year history of sales and research materials are in our system. We use that information daily.
And with about 10 years left in my working life, I don't really desire to spend that kind of money again or more.

If you don't recommend OpenSuse 42.3, which Linux do you recommend?
Thanks again
 
Old 08-07-2018, 12:49 PM   #19
zeebra
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Windows runs quite well and much safer in a virtual machine.

My general preference is to just use GNU/Linux, and if needed, install Windows as a virtual machine. That way you can run both GNU/Linux and Windows at the same time.
 
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Old 08-07-2018, 01:19 PM   #20
TB0ne
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Quote:
If you don't recommend OpenSuse 42.3, which Linux do you recommend?
**THE LATEST VERSION** as said previously. If you go to the opensuse website, it has two options: Leap and Tumbleweed. Pick Leap, and it tells you the latest version is 15. Bear in mind that you are installing a fast development distro, which will go end-of-life quickly. Tumbleweed is a rolling release, but that introduces other problems. Load a server-class distro like CentOS (or Red Hat Enterprise, if you want to pay for support), which has MANY years of updates/patches before going end of life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tcluper View Post
I appreciate the help and thoughts more than you know I may not know much about Linux, but I do know my business. Because in the late 80's I spent close to 40k developing a system specific to our industry and to this day we haven't found anything close to our system. Plus our 43 year history of sales and research materials are in our system. We use that information daily. And with about 10 years left in my working life, I don't really desire to spend that kind of money again or more.
Never said you didn't know your business, but you are STILL not providing anything in the way of details. Moving from SCO to Linux is not just "copy my files and it'll work"...and the late 80's were a long time ago (I was there). AGAIN:
  • If this is code that you wrote, you are going to **HAVE TO** recompile it on Linux to get it working.
  • The libraries on SCO may (or may NOT) be available on Linux and/or have functions that aren't available, called the same way, or function the same way. Things have moved on.
  • Migrating your database is TRIVIAL...do an export from Filepro to a CSV file...create a table in MySQL...use MySQL to import the data to the table. Done.
  • IceTen is ancient; both Linux and Windows have MANY better terminal emulators available.
  • Dual booting is pointless for what you're after; spinning up Windows 10 in Virtualbox is far easier for your needs.
You should not have to spend anything on doing a migration; this is all something you can easily do, or hire someone experienced in Linux to do it for you in a very short time. Nothing you've described is hard to do, and you have the tools available to you, for free, with Linux. The only thing that will cause you problems is your custom code, which (despite asking numerous times), you say nothing about. We can't offer advice on what we don't know about, but AGAIN...you can't just copy SCO executables to Linux and have them work.

While I recognize what you're asking, you're getting advice from someone whose company does this for clients frequently. But the only way we can help people is when they provide details. I would **STRONGLY** suggest you hire a local consulting firm to put together a plan for you.
 
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Old 08-07-2018, 03:01 PM   #21
rtmistler
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The things which strike me here are:
  1. You desire this system to be as solid and as secure as possible. (Noted from Post #1) Therefore I would think that something like CentOS would be better, or even a paid distribution like RHEL considering that you license filePro.
  2. There are statements that this is a very historical business and that thousands had been invested in R&D to attain a working database of worth to you. But this whole thread reads like:
    1. You purchased "a" computer
    2. It has Windows 10
    3. You are considering a rolling distribution of Linux to run as a dual boot
    4. You don't know much about how to do these exact configurations, but this is all highly important to your business at large
My assumption is that you're not just randomly taking this effort on, but instead following some form of procedure to stage this, such as:
  1. Determining which distributions of Linux have been tested with filePro. (Their release documentation really helps here, by the way ... yes that's me being critical/sarcastic about it - there's little information from their site about what distributions or versions they've tested their product on)
  2. Determining which hardware capabilities will be best to run this software efficiently and also store your database safely and securely. Once again, their documentation notes that it requires 64M of RAM and 50M of hard disk space.
  3. Installing the OS on the new hardware, and then installing filePro and verifying that it mirrors your existing SCO implementation, or does things better/more efficiently.
The purchase of a computer is not so amazing of a thing, sorry to say. If you need it, deem that it is important, then you purchase it.

I do not worry about retaining the original OS, because like you, I'm experienced and have worked with these things for 35+ years. So just wipe it and install what you intend to use.

Likely you have other computers for Windows based programs.

I do not feel that taking, a mission critical file server, and allowing it to dual boot is beneficial or desirable.

For me, a server like this would be headless and in a rack in a closet. With the other server appliances.

The database would also reside on a NAS. And therefore you could access it with alternative systems, such as the existing, but likely aging SCO box.

A presumption is that you're upgrading hardware to accommodate current day realities, as well as obsolescence. If so, this all makes sense, however one does not do this without staging it, and also using committed equipment for this purpose.
 
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Old 08-07-2018, 04:53 PM   #22
tcluper
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Smile Agreed

rtmistler,
I fully understand where you are coming from and appreciate your prospective. I\ll try to explain to the best of my memory and ability.
I am in the Auction, Appraisal and Real Estate Business. The area most used in Unix is both Auction and Appraisal. I first developed a single user Auction Package on a Kaypro 10 using CPM OS and Dbase II. I quickly moved to a Tandy 6000 with xenix and 5 users and re-designed my package in Profile. I also quickly outgrew the Tandy 6ooo and in 1989 I attended the UNIX Forum in Javits, NYC, where my brother in law at the time was the Chairman of the event and I had additional help from Neil Nelson from Chicago and other. Anyway, I ended up purchasing a Wyse 386 and SCO Unix and ran 16 users on this box till 1999. So for 10 years we made wholesale modifications to our FilePro Program and encompassing areas that had never been thought about in our industry.
During the Y2k ERA, I built a large dual 486 chip machine and upgraded to SCO V 5.0 and ran 24 users until 3 years ago.
This system does everything possible in the Auction business from Consignors, Inventory, Multiple Auctions separately or all at the same time, Absentee Bids, Reserves, Multi lane Car Auctions, Real Estate Auctions, Sale List and printing Catalogues in Word Perfect, Pre-Sale Estimates, Buyer registration, Run the Auctions, Phone Bids, Buyer Purchase Invoices, Credit/Debit Card charges and receipts, Settlements to Sellers, Archiving "SOLD" Items in to our History Files by Catagory and other syntexs, Prints Settlement Checks, for Accounting, deducts commissions, expenses, insurance and any other fees that exist, Retains Unsold items in Inventory until returned or sold at a later date.
This may not make a lot of sense to you, but to an auction company its a big money saving across the board.

I have talked extensively to FilePro concerning the migration from Unix to Linux and they have done many and everything flows through on both the development and runtime side. They will also offer help with my migration because they are semi knowledgeable about my programs.

Therefore, This machine is mainly for Lenix and Filepro My main reason for wanting to keep Windows on it is if a hardware issue arises Windows may help correct it.

I hope this helps with what e have done in the past and why I am wanting to change to Linux. It makes no sense to update hardware and not chane to a graphical base operating system like Linux.

Now, During most Fine and Decorative Art Auctions, we use the main Computer at Registration and Checkout along with one Windows Computer using FilePro through IceTen to Linux. 3 other Window Computers also connect to filepro through IceTen for different things for the Auction.
So, where I used to use 24 users, Now we only need 5 users.

I do want to do some additional enhancements to our Filepro System but they are mino things and not a complete rebuild.

Does this help explain my mindset and where I'm trying to go with this ?

I have done alot with programing in FilePro and administration in Unix since 1990, but I haven't retained it all and I'm not sure of myself enough to jump in full force.

I am interested in hearing your thoughts.
Tom
 
Old 08-07-2018, 10:46 PM   #23
X-LFS-2010
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I'd like to add a modern comment.

"Simply deployed" or even "cloud"

for example, can it deploy on iPad (convenient to users). pads are updated by Apple (done). software can be re-deployed easily using advanced tools if a new release causes need for a release.

or if it's strictly a server db, is it really a simply deployed Oracle class solution?

so is this a cloud server you have to build from screeetch and keep running? Or can you use a major existing cloud?

problem is the more advanced this become the less it makes sense to work alone. not that i don't appreciate when you are on someone else's cloud: they might be watching you

in the past one person could submit a reasonable "ide driver". today: if the industry doesn't donate it to linux: it isn't going to work. if linux burns a bridge - they won't get updates.

in the past one person could make sense of security settings for networking, file system, mixed user sharing, remote computers. perhaps a small team. today: not a chance. you'll never cover all the bases your kidding yourself, you can only put yourself in others hands unless your intending to do years of work

i would err on the side of modern solution and do only "expected security steps" if your handling (ie, money information)

i would err on the side of modern unless you have a really special situation, like supporting a linux group that needs linux protocol access and (ie, doesn't have oracle drivers)

Last edited by X-LFS-2010; 08-07-2018 at 10:57 PM.
 
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Old 08-08-2018, 12:28 AM   #24
mrmazda
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcluper View Post
If you don't recommend OpenSuse 42.3, which Linux do you recommend?
15.0 is the "current" and newest openSUSE stable release. It is fully operational here on more than a dozen PCs, along with Debian (longer support lifetime, nominally older kernel version), Fedora (IMO closest to bleeding edge among major distros, with nearly continuous kernel version upgrades) & several other FOSS OSes, all in multiboot, some with Windows or OS/2 as well.

42.3 support ends in less than 6 months, a good reason for recommending 15.0 instead. I'm typing here on 42.3 on my primary PC, but will be switching it to 15.0 in conjunction with a significant hardware upgrade before the end of 2018.

I've used various distros at various times going back about 20 years, but openSUSE is the only FOSS OS that has been my primary OS. OS/2 was primary until about 9 years ago. It still runs 24/7 here as secondary.
 
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Old 08-08-2018, 07:51 AM   #25
rtmistler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tcluper View Post
rtmistler,
I fully understand where you are coming from and appreciate your prospective.
... too lengthy, but I did read it

I have talked extensively to FilePro concerning the migration from Unix to Linux and they have done many and everything flows through on both the development and runtime side. They will also offer help with my migration because they are semi knowledgeable about my programs.

Does this help explain my mindset and where I'm trying to go with this ?

I have done alot with programing in FilePro and administration in Unix since 1990, but I haven't retained it all and I'm not sure of myself enough to jump in full force.

I am interested in hearing your thoughts.
You have seen my thoughts in my first post.

The system you're describing is a database server.

Typically there is a bit more specialized hardware one buys to make it their server, however the hardware you purchased is not the end of the world and it can do the work.

Meanwhile that hardware is available online at various large box retailers for about $500. In the grand scheme of your business that is an extremely small investment.

Next, you should reconsider what you invested in time for that older SCO Unix box. From what you've said, you expended a great deal of time into getting that in a state where it contends with all the database management you need it to do.

Great, and you'll need to do that again. TB0ne specifically noted some great short cuts that will get you going. Meanwhile other users have offered technical advice as well.

You cite a very important, and enduring business activity, and you've bought a cheap, retail PC to be a primary server to track and store critical information for your business.

The way you're starting is that you've asked for information from users, several have cited that the distribution version you're looking at is soon to be EOL.

Your responses are to be even more descriptive about your business and overview the extensive efforts you did back in the 90's.

Perhaps instead what you ought to be doing is trying out Linux, considering the advice of LQ members, and asking technical follow-up questions.

There is little that your fellow members can help you with otherwise. We can help with technical questions, I can't speak as to whether or not people are interested in the details of your business; however can note that if all this discussion is to be, is about that, then the discussion becomes non-technical and the thread should be moved elsewhere, to our non-nix/General forum.
 
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Old 08-08-2018, 08:21 AM   #26
tcluper
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Rtmistler,
Thank you for your last post. I.do appreciate it and take everyones comments here very seriously.
I have reviewing the post and i.do want technical help, as my knowledge of the present day Linux world and what is available is very limited.
When i first learned toward OpenSise Leap 42.3, it was due to a suggestion from here. Now I understand that OpenSise Leap 15 is the newest version and considered very stable. Filepro had suggested Suse for the remote administration tools that they have used in previous migrations.

Therefore, I will go with the OpenSise 15. And download it today

Again, than you for your patience and knowledge in helping this old fart understand the new Linux Landscape.

Regards,
Tom
 
Old 08-08-2018, 08:35 AM   #27
rtmistler
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Excellent. Let us know how it goes and if you have any questions.

Even better that your software vendor suggests it.
 
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Old 08-08-2018, 09:49 AM   #28
DavidMcCann
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This is something that will come in handy later on
http://cb.vu/unixtoolbox.xhtml
as will the things available here
https://doc.opensuse.org/

Never be without a manual! Being older than you, I remember when a new PC came with a shelf-load of loose-leaf binders…
 
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Old 08-08-2018, 10:02 AM   #29
JeremyBoden
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If you want to try a quick check that the basics will work, I would suggest you try creating a Linux VM in Windows 10 (if it supports it).

Then when you are ready for a dual boot you can remove the VM and do a re-install of Linux.

Do you have plans in place to allow you to move to a backup machine if something bad happens to your machine.
You have lots of single points of failure - for example if (when) that disk fails then what happens?
 
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