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nbpage 02-22-2010 07:13 AM

Back to XP :-(
 
I've been using Karmic for a few months and I really like it.

But I have a couple problems I just can't solve:
GPU temp - idles at 66 and goes to 75 with almost any apps running. The problem is getting worse.

Weirdnesses going on like... in the last week the upper right buttons (maximize, minimize, close) have disappeared from most but not all app windows; RAM usage has gone from about 400-500MB to almost 1 gig with the same bunch of apps running and same system settings.

And... my system hangs. Used to be never, then maybe once a week, and now almost every day. I have to do a hard restart.

I've re-installed Karmic from scratch twice but this same progression keeps happening.

So... I want to go back to XP as the base OS and run my karmic in VirtualBox.

Is there a way I can ghost my current installation - settings, files, programs and all and run it as a virtual appliance or do I need to install it fresh and rebuild everything?

Thanks

bret381 02-22-2010 07:34 AM

don't go back!!! it's not worth it! :)

Seriously though, you may try another distro, I had similar problems with karmic as far as RAM goes. Give something more stable a try, such as debian. Ubuntu is based off of debian, so you should feel pretty much at home.

rubentje1991 02-22-2010 07:50 AM

distro
 
hlo,

or even try a complete another distro

mandriva-based (PCLinuxOS, ...), or a self-compiling distro, ...


Don't give up (quickly), it's the time and effort worth!

Success

RuBeN

PS (maybe give a look at distrowatch)

hurufu 02-22-2010 08:00 AM

bret381 is right!
It seems you haven't try any other distro. What machine do you have?
About temperature. Hm.. May you give your computer a little rest? After >1h all will be norm.

nbpage 02-22-2010 08:57 AM

Hey,

Thanks guys :-)

Is there an easy way to do another distro or do I need to reformat and reinstall everything?

I am an utter Linux idiot - so I definitely need something as easy as Ubuntu. But I've also already spent a lot of time on this and I have other things I'd rather do than tinker with my OS :-) And it seems that's what I do about 1/2 the time.

As far as overheating, My system goes to 65-70 within 15 minutes of booting up - after being off overnight - without doing anything at all. Running a browser puts it to 0ver 70. And watching a youtube vid gets us to over 75. Any 3d game shuts down withing 10 minutes and the GPU is around 90.

Part of the problem, I think, is that the fans don't run at max - ever. I've tried looking for a fan manager like Dell's I8kfanGU - with no luck.

I can't even do any vid editing or anything like that.

I have a Dell M90 notebook. 4 gig RAM, Nvidia Quatro FX 3500 512MB

BTW - With XP I'd idle at about 45. gaming or editing would get me as high as 75. Never saw it higher than that.

Jeeper98 02-22-2010 09:23 AM

Try another Release
 
Well I am using Karmic on a spare laptop, I am noticing the same thing I tried Intrepid and it got a little better, if Ubuntu is acting up try a different distro but dont go to XP. On my 8 computers I like to have Dreamlinux 3.5 on them, but it may have trouble installing just to allert you there is a problem in the core of the installer.

See ya

catkin 02-22-2010 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbpage (Post 3872624)
I definitely need something as easy as Ubuntu.

While ubuntu may be easy in the sense that it provides GUI interfaces for many things, it is not easy in the sense that you can go right ahead and use everything provided. As you have found out, it has many problems and components that don't work. To some extent that is because of its design intentions -- to be cutting edge and to publish a new version every 6 months.

There are many distros available, each with distinct design aims and characteristics. You may have an easier time if you choose a distro noted for stability. It might not be as cutting edge as the latest ubuntu; it might not have as much whizz and eye candy ... but it may be a lot easier to live with.

nbpage 02-22-2010 10:05 AM

Is there an easy way to downgrade to Intrepid?

Or change distro?

cantab 02-22-2010 10:27 AM

Karmic's a bit poor in my experience. Try an older version of Ubuntu, or a different distro.

There is no easy way to downgrade, you'll have to reinstall.

custangro 02-22-2010 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbpage (Post 3872624)
Hey,

Thanks guys :-)

Is there an easy way to do another distro or do I need to reformat and reinstall everything?

I am an utter Linux idiot - so I definitely need something as easy as Ubuntu. But I've also already spent a lot of time on this and I have other things I'd rather do than tinker with my OS :-) And it seems that's what I do about 1/2 the time.

As far as overheating, My system goes to 65-70 within 15 minutes of booting up - after being off overnight - without doing anything at all. Running a browser puts it to 0ver 70. And watching a youtube vid gets us to over 75. Any 3d game shuts down withing 10 minutes and the GPU is around 90.

Part of the problem, I think, is that the fans don't run at max - ever. I've tried looking for a fan manager like Dell's I8kfanGU - with no luck.

I can't even do any vid editing or anything like that.

I have a Dell M90 notebook. 4 gig RAM, Nvidia Quatro FX 3500 512MB

BTW - With XP I'd idle at about 45. gaming or editing would get me as high as 75. Never saw it higher than that.

http://linuxmint.com/

TheStarLion 02-22-2010 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbpage (Post 3872701)
Is there an easy way to downgrade to Intrepid?

Or change distro?

Not downgrade, as such, except to clean-install from an Intrepid media.

Changing distro is as simple as downloading the image and booting from it, same as Ubuntu. If your partition layout has your home partition separate, when you install the new system, set it to be mounted as /home, and don't format it - it means you'll have all your documents and settings saved (if that doesn't make sense, don't worry)

MTK358 02-22-2010 12:59 PM

I would get another distro, I heard a lot of bad things about Ubuntu 9.10 (but I haven't tried it myself). Fedora is what I started with and I would recommend it.

And as for being "an utter Linux idiot", you can start by checking out the tutorial links in my sig.

TheStarLion 02-22-2010 01:35 PM

Suffice to say that Intrepid (Or Jaunty for me, but that's my personal opinion) was the last decent Ubuntu.
Fedora I have trouble with because of SELinux being overly irritating, most of that is just because I couldn't care less, and it cares too much.

GrapefruiTgirl 02-22-2010 02:04 PM

I too have seen firsthand the problems that have been appearing in the freshest Ubuntu releases. I don't use *buntu personally, but my roommate does, and she wants something that pretty much "just works" and is easy to use, you know, with GUI's and things like that. She has gone back to 9.04 because it worked pretty well, and she has opted not to upgrade it again, but instead, to look into other distros as it has been suggested that you (the OP here) also try doing.

I would venture a guess that overall, running a defective *buntu inside a VM on Windows, will in the long run provide you no better an experience than simply running the defective *buntu without a VM. The same problems have the same potential to rear up.

Anyhow, before much more rambling on my part, I also will suggest you look at Mint. I'm basing this suggestion solely on the numerous good feedback I have read from people who have tried it, so as always, your own mileage may vary.

Whatever you end up with, if you choose a known-stable Linux OS, with a release-cycle that is based on "things work well" rather than "it's that time again", and be patient to learn it's ins and outs and get comfortable with it, I am hopeful you will enjoy it more in the long run than you would a WinXP installation.


Best of success,
Sasha

rubentje1991 02-22-2010 02:56 PM

distro
 
there are hundreds of distro's available

Personally, years ago, after a lot of research (0.92 version was (very) unknown) I chose for PCLinuxOS
: slogan
Radically Simple: and that was and is true for me
I don't know how unknown it's today, but this distro has its own control center - apart of the KDE/gnome-one (equals to Mandriva's, despite it goes its own way now).

But if you want to try, there is coming a new release (2010) within a couple of weeks (and from then on it'll has again a rolling release cycle (without new installs for some years)

Now I stop nagging... there are many good distro's.....

RuBeN

thorkelljarl 02-22-2010 03:05 PM

Sasha may be right...

You can leave linux for XP, but soon XP is leaving you, being on the way to the state of no more support from Microsoft now that they have a replacement in Windows 7.

Is not your time and effort spent with linux to be considered a timely and prudent investment, an instance of prescience on your part?

GrapefruiTgirl 02-22-2010 03:10 PM

In addition to what thorkelljarl wrote, I had intended to also imply that: running "crashy OS ABC" inside a VM that's running on "crashy OS XYZ" is not likely to produce ideal situation ;)

thorkelljarl 02-22-2010 03:25 PM

Grammar...

She's right but she splits her infinitives.

bret381 02-22-2010 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nbpage (Post 3872624)
I am an utter Linux idiot - so I definitely need something as easy as Ubuntu. But I've also already spent a lot of time on this and I have other things I'd rather do than tinker with my OS :-) And it seems that's what I do about 1/2 the time.

Although Karmic has it's problems, Linux IS a tinkering OS. So you will have to tinker with any distro to get it to do exactly what you want. This is by design, as it allows you the most control over the OS. So if you are wanting a *nix system that has all the nifty little gui control centers and no tinkering involved, with a "windowsy" feel, you may just have to look into a MAC.

However I recommend you stick with Linux. It takes some getting used to, but you have to forget windows to appreciate it. Treat your Linux experience as though you have never used a computer. Forget windows exists with all it's "user friendly" tools and LEARN linux. Once you learn it, you can breeze right through modifications. So get you a good Linux book, get on the interweb and start learning. And always ask here for help :)

TheStarLion 02-22-2010 04:11 PM

And if you do follow bret's advice, Slackware is a perfect place to learn it.

Mompy 02-22-2010 04:19 PM

Using Linux is very satisfying, once you have sorted the problems, (and they can be "difficult") the sense of achievement! Using XP is like using someone else's clothing, not really yours, written by Microsoft to do what Microsoft want. And the help and backup you get with Linux - you won't get with Microsoft unless you have big pockets. Thousands of programs written by people who work for the love of it, you won't regret working with Linux.

bret381 02-22-2010 05:26 PM

yes, slackware is great :)

nbpage 02-22-2010 05:59 PM

Thanks all for your advise.

Now I need something specific.

My point is that I don't want to research distros, try them out and all that. I want to use my computer for storing and manipulating my photos, editing videos, and sometimes playing games and digging the web.

I really like a lot of karmic - but the blockers are getting to be too much.

So, if there is any easy way of downgrading to Intrepid or switching to debian or whatever - by easy I mean that I get to keep my files and installed programs - and that WILL solve my HW issues - I'd love to try.

But I need to stop spending 50% or more of my time screwing with the OS and actually get some work done. :-)

Does anyone have any concrete advise on this?

Thanks

damgar 02-22-2010 06:35 PM

You are probably going to find that be it linux, windows, or mac, downgrading is a more traumatic experience than upgrading because it's not a given. In other words there aren't generally tools that go backwards. Maybe a little arrogance involved on the linux side, and profit motive on the other side of the fence. Saving the files is easy enough, just back them up. I can't think of any OS that would be easier to re-install programs on than Ubuntu. You might have to add some additional repositories, but after that it's just search, mark, apply with Synaptic.

Just for future reference, I've found it's good to have an NTFS partiton to save data to, be it primary or backup, if you haven't jumped into linux with both feet or really even if you go back to windows for good. Windows will need a re-install sooner or later. That way you always have your data accessible regardless of OS.

EDIT: I just saw that you started out by asking for distro advice. I personally like Ubuntu 9.04 (I think that's Jaunty) on my two non-fiddle boxes. Of course Slackware is my favorite, but that's beside the point. 9.04 is rock solid on the two machines I run it on, which are far enough apart that I could recommend it. I hear very good things about Mint, but I never tried it. As someone else mentioned Mandriva is also SUPER-easy for someone coming from windows. You might try 2009.1 I'm sure it's still available. The ONE editions of Mandriva have proprietary things in them which make them super easy to install if you have things like nvidia graphics or whatever. The only downside would be that ONE isn't available in 64 bit.

sundialsvcs 02-22-2010 09:14 PM

Here's a thought ...

It seems to me that you have a computer which has inherent temperature deficiencies. You can't do anything about them without replacing the motherboard (which may or may not be your cup of tea). The designer of that board was, unfortunately, "pushing the marketing envelope" of published specifications, knowing that the temperature throttling software in Windows would be slowing the CPU down ... long after you'd bought the thing. :doh:

(Hey, it happens. A lot.)

So... perhaps for your distro there is a package that you can install, which will add CPU temperature monitoring and power regulation. I do not know your distor well enough to suggest what it might be, but I do suggest that you look for it.

You see, the designer of a distro realistically has no way to know whether your particular hardware needs such a "crutch," as your motherboard quite-obviously does. Therefore, the "stock" set of packages and options that's shipped with the distro might not (and quite reasonably "might not") include it. But it should be there, to be added.

Smartpatrol 02-22-2010 09:27 PM

...

catkin 02-23-2010 12:00 AM

Much as I like Slackware (a lot), I would not recommend it to someone who has little Linux experience and who writes "But I need to stop spending 50% or more of my time screwing with the OS and actually get some work done". One of the things I like so much about Slackware is that, once set up, it needs very little care and maintenance but setting it up does take a while and would take someone with less Linux knowledge a lot longer. While running ubuntu 8.04 for around a year, the issues list kept getting longer, stopping at ~60 items on migrating to Slackware. After running Slackware for 5+ months the equivalent issues list has 4 items.

nbpage 02-23-2010 03:47 AM

Thanks all.

So it looks like a fresh install of whatever I end up with.

Is there any way to backup my programs and setting and all?

cantab 02-23-2010 06:21 AM

Settings are kept in two places. System settings are in /etc , while settings for most programs you use are in files and folders that start with a . in your home folder. (In Linux, filenames that start with a . are hidden by default).

There is, however, no guarantee the programs on your new distro will read the configuration files on intrepid, due to differing versions or being configured to look in different places.

So, save all of /etc and everything starting with a . in your home folder. But don't just restore it all blindly. It's probably best to leave /etc well alone or you might break things and even make your Linux installation unbootable. And be careful restoring program settings - make sure you back up the NEW settings before you try to restore the old.

If you save your config files to a usb device or a windows partition, you may encounter ownership and permissions issues when you restore them (because the FAT and NTFS file systems used by removable drives and windows don't support Linux permissions). To get round this, make your files into a 'tarball' and save the tarball. Ubuntu Karmic should have a GUI archiving program that can do this.

mrrangerman 02-23-2010 07:12 AM

Well backing up data is a good thing to do no matter what OS you use, if you are more comfortable using win-xp then use it. If you don't have the time to learn something new then don't, stick with what you know. Later at some point if you do have time to spend then come back and give linux another try.

MTK358 02-23-2010 07:37 AM

I don't really see why you would care about restoring settings so much, as they are easy to set back once you install a program.

Anyway, to make a compressed tarball of your home folder, including your personal settings, run this command:

tar -cvzf mybackup.tar.gz ~

Now mypabkup.tar.gz is a gzip compressed tarball, which is both takes up less space than copying home to a flash drive, and it will preserve your permissions, even if saved on a FS that does not support permissions.


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