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Radeon 9200 and AGP Express

Hi.

I have troubles with my video card: looks like it works, but I'm not sure, because FPS is low and videos are playing slow.
My motherboard: ECS 845GV-M3 (with some strange "AGP Express")
My videocard:

Code:

01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 SE] (rev 01) (prog-if 00 [VGA controller])

        Subsystem: Giga-byte Technology Radeon 9200 SE

        Flags: bus master, 66MHz, medium devsel, latency 32, IRQ 5

        Memory at e0000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=64M]

        I/O ports at c000 [size=256]

        Memory at e9000000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=64K]

        [virtual] Expansion ROM at e8000000 [disabled] [size=128K]

        Capabilities: [58] AGP version 2.0

        Capabilities: [50] Power Management version 2

        Kernel driver in use: radeon

        Kernel modules: radeon



01:00.1 Display controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV280 [Radeon 9200 SE] (Secondary) (rev 01)

        Subsystem: Giga-byte Technology Radeon 9200 SE (Secondary)

        Flags: 66MHz, medium devsel

        Memory at e4000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [disabled] [size=64M]

        Memory at e9010000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [disabled] [size=64K]

        Capabilities: [50] Power Management version 2

Also I have integrated videocard:

Code:

00:02.0 Display controller: Intel Corporation 82845G/GL[Brookdale-G]/GE Chipset Integrated Graphics Device (rev 03)

        Subsystem: Elitegroup Computer Systems Device 8888

        Flags: bus master, fast devsel, latency 0, IRQ 5

        Memory at d8000000 (32-bit, prefetchable) [size=128M]

        Memory at ea000000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=512K]

        Capabilities: [d0] Power Management version 1

        Kernel driver in use: i915

        Kernel modules: i915

My distro: Salix OS 13.37.

For a long time I was using my integrated videocard. Yes, I had high CPU load, but all was OK (I'm not playing games in Linux, but I could watch films wighout problems).
Now I decided to stop using integrated videocard and installed my Radeon. I use open-sourced drivers (as you know, I can't use proprietary ATI's drivers for such old card).
What I have:
1) Looks like interface (window manager; I have XFCE) works faster. But it works not so fast as it can (I tested this videocard on some older PC with totally the same software installed and it worked faster).
2) If I try to play some video, it's playing slow and has artefacts. It starts playing close to normal only if I decrease player's windows size to something like 100*100 pixels (again, on older PC all was OK).

Talking about comparing with older PC, I should add, that I had totally no problems there. Here, with this motherboard, I needed to compile a new kernel, because distro's default kernel (2.6.37.6, as far as I remember) had troubles to boot (tried to change i2c.algobit=0 manually, but that didn't help). At least, new kernel (3.2.12) is loading and X works.

About playing video: I thought, may be something wrong with codecs/player. I reinstalled (compiled from source using SlackBuild) newer versions of ffmpeg and vlc, but nothing changed.

Command

Code:

vblank_mode=0 glxgears

gives me up to 700 FPS when I decrase windows's size to veeery small, and ~40 FPS in fullscreen.

In dmesg's output I worry about lines with "ring test error" and "Disabling GPU", but, as you see, after that there is something like "forcing AGP to PCI mode", and I think that's because of that strange "AGP Express" on my motherboard. Anyway, I'm not experienced and I can be wrong.

My xorg.conf:

Code:

Section "ServerLayout"

        Identifier    "X.org Configured"

        Screen      0  "Screen0" 0 0

        InputDevice    "Mouse0" "CorePointer"

        InputDevice    "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"

EndSection



Section "Files"

        ModulePath  "/usr/lib/xorg/modules"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/local"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/TTF"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/OTF"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/Type1"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/misc"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/CID"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi/:unscaled"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi/:unscaled"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/75dpi"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/100dpi"

        FontPath    "/usr/share/fonts/cyrillic"

EndSection



Section "Module"

        Load  "record"

        Load  "glx"

        Load  "extmod"

        Load  "dbe"

        Load  "dri2"

        Load  "dri"

        Load  "drm"

EndSection



Section "InputDevice"

        Identifier  "Keyboard0"

        Driver      "kbd"

EndSection



Section "InputDevice"

        Identifier  "Mouse0"

        Driver      "mouse"

        Option            "Protocol" "auto"

        Option            "Device" "/dev/input/mice"

        Option            "ZAxisMapping" "4 5 6 7"

EndSection



Section "Monitor"

        Identifier  "Monitor0"

        VendorName  "Monitor Vendor"

        ModelName    "Monitor Model"

EndSection



Section "Device"

        ### Available Driver options are:-

        ### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",

        ### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz",

        ### <percent>: "<f>%"

        ### [arg]: arg optional

        #Option    "NoAccel"                    # [<bool>]

        #Option    "SWcursor"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "Dac6Bit"                    # [<bool>]

        #Option    "Dac8Bit"                    # [<bool>]

        #Option    "BusType"                    # [<str>]

        #Option    "CPPIOMode"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "CPusecTimeout"              # <i>

        #Option    "AGPMode"                    # <i>

        #Option    "AGPFastWrite"              # [<bool>]

        #Option    "AGPSize"                    # <i>

        #Option    "GARTSize"                  # <i>

        #Option    "RingSize"                  # <i>

        #Option    "BufferSize"                # <i>

        #Option    "EnableDepthMoves"          # [<bool>]

        #Option    "EnablePageFlip"            # [<bool>]

        #Option    "NoBackBuffer"              # [<bool>]

        #Option    "DMAForXv"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "FBTexPercent"              # <i>

        #Option    "DepthBits"                  # <i>

        #Option    "PCIAPERSize"                # <i>

        #Option    "AccelDFS"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "IgnoreEDID"                # [<bool>]

        #Option    "CustomEDID"                # [<str>]

        #Option    "DisplayPriority"            # [<str>]

        #Option    "PanelSize"                  # [<str>]

        #Option    "ForceMinDotClock"          # <freq>

        #Option    "ColorTiling"                # [<bool>]

        #Option    "VideoKey"                  # <i>

        #Option    "RageTheatreCrystal"        # <i>

        #Option    "RageTheatreTunerPort"        # <i>

        #Option    "RageTheatreCompositePort"        # <i>

        #Option    "RageTheatreSVideoPort"        # <i>

        #Option    "TunerType"                  # <i>

        #Option    "RageTheatreMicrocPath"        # <str>

        #Option    "RageTheatreMicrocType"        # <str>

        #Option    "ScalerWidth"                # <i>

        #Option    "RenderAccel"                # [<bool>]

        #Option    "SubPixelOrder"              # [<str>]

        #Option    "ClockGating"                # [<bool>]

        #Option    "VGAAccess"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "ReverseDDC"                # [<bool>]

        #Option    "LVDSProbePLL"              # [<bool>]

        #Option    "AccelMethod"                # <str>

        #Option    "DRI"                        # [<bool>]

        #Option    "ConnectorTable"            # <str>

        #Option    "DefaultConnectorTable"        # [<bool>]

        #Option    "DefaultTMDSPLL"            # [<bool>]

        #Option    "TVDACLoadDetect"            # [<bool>]

        #Option    "ForceTVOut"                # [<bool>]

        #Option    "TVStandard"                # <str>

        #Option    "IgnoreLidStatus"            # [<bool>]

        #Option    "DefaultTVDACAdj"            # [<bool>]

        #Option    "Int10"                      # [<bool>]

        #Option    "EXAVSync"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "ATOMTVOut"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "R4xxATOM"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "ForceLowPowerMode"          # [<bool>]

        #Option    "DynamicPM"                  # [<bool>]

        #Option    "NewPLL"                    # [<bool>]

        #Option    "ZaphodHeads"                # <str>

        Identifier  "Card0"

        Driver      "radeon"

        #BusID      "PCI:1:0:0"

EndSection



Section "Screen"

        Identifier "Screen0"

        Device    "Card0"

        Monitor    "Monitor0"

        SubSection "Display"

                Viewport  0 0

                Depth    1

        EndSubSection

        SubSection "Display"

                Viewport  0 0

                Depth    4

        EndSubSection

        SubSection "Display"

                Viewport  0 0

                Depth    8

        EndSubSection

        SubSection "Display"

                Viewport  0 0

                Depth    15

        EndSubSection

        SubSection "Display"

                Viewport  0 0

                Depth    16

        EndSubSection

        SubSection "Display"

                Viewport  0 0

                Depth    24

        EndSubSection

EndSection



Section "DRI"

 Group        "video"

 Mode        0666

EndSection

Sorry for such a big message, I tried to descride all what I know and what I tried to make. I really don't know what to do in this situation. Thanks for help.

P.S. On Windows XP videocard works as it must work. I can watch films, play games etc.

Up again. Sorry for flood, but what should I do in this case :(

Just a shot in the dark, but may be, since both cards, integrated and the radeon, are active they interfere somehow. I would try it with blacklisting the i915 driver and have a look again after a reboot.
To blacklist the driver add a line containing blacklist i915 to the file /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf.

Thanks for reply.
I've added

Code:

blacklist i915

to /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf. But no, that did not helped. Still slow video and low fps in glxgears-fullscreen mode.

Quote:

may be, since both cards, integrated and the radeon, are active they interfere somehow

Yes, I had this idea too, but I couldn't realize how to disable integrated videocard because there is no needed option in BIOS (I can only change integrated videcard's memory size there). At least, now I know the new way to do something :)

Quote:

a shot in the dark

Should I add some additional info?

When I think about it, the AGP Express thing bothers me. IIRC, that is not really AGP, but a modified PCI slot, one of ECS's weird inventions they made to be cheaper than the rest. It may be possible that the AGP driver of the Linux kernel doesn't play well with that slot and therefore causes the slow downs. But I have no clue how to fix that, if it is the case.

Code:

AGP Express thing bothers me. IIRC, that is not really AGP, but a modified PCI slot, one of ECS's weird inventions they made to be cheaper than the rest.

Yes, I've read some information about it.

Quote:

It may be possible that the AGP driver of the Linux kernel doesn't play well with that slot and therefore causes the slow downs. But I have no clue how to fix that, if it is the case.

Looks like you are right.
But, following dmesg, kernel is able to force AGP-to-PCI mode (I don't know where else it can be useful, if not with AGP Express), and, according to this man, RADEON driver is able to work in AGP-to-PCI mode (look at "BusType" option). So, theoretically, developers kept in mind my variant, if were adding this options (I hope you understand what I want to say). But, anyway, I don't know what to do next :)

Talking about AGP Express bus, I thought, that, may be, it all happens because it's really slower than AGP (for exmaple, like something, described here). But, in this case, why am I able to play games (like Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory) and watch films under Windows XP without any troubles?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somewho (Post 4637927)

[CODE]Talking about AGP Express bus, I thought, that, may be, it all happens because it's really slower than AGP (for exmaple, like something, described here).

Possible, but even a simple Radeon 9200 for the PCI bus should be faster than the integrated graphics.

Quote:

But, in this case, why am I able to play games (like Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory) and watch films under Windows XP without any troubles?

Because you use the drivers from the manufacturer, I would guess.

Quote:

Possible, but even a simple Radeon 9200 for the PCI bus should be faster than the integrated graphics.

Totally agree.

Quote:

Because you use the drivers from the manufacturer, I would guess.

Yes, of course. But I don't think that Windows XP kernel can use AGP-to-PCI mode, while Linux kernel can't. And I don't think that ATI were worrying about some AGP Express bus, when they were creating Radeon 9200 and drivers for it. Of course, it's funny to compare things like this, but, all what I want to say, is that I believe that even open-source radeon drivers can run that mode.

By the way, comparing glxinfo from my PC and from old PC (there is Radeon 9600 XT at the moment, but anyway), I have a question:
My PC:

Code:

OpenGL vendor string: Tungsten Graphics, Inc.

OpenGL renderer string: Mesa DRI R200 (RV280 5964) 20090101 x86/MMX/SSE2 TCL DRI2

OpenGL version string: 1.3 Mesa 7.9.2

My old PC:

Code:

OpenGL vendor string: X.Org R300 Project

OpenGL renderer string: Gallium 0.4 on RV350

OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 7.9.2

OpenGL shading language version string: 1.20

Yes, videocards are different and R9200 doesn't support OpenGL 2.0 while R9600 does, but is

Code:

Tungsten Graphics, Inc.

in R9200 vendor string OK?

Yes, that is normal. The Mesa/Xorg people have special drivers for the R300 chips.

Another dead end.

Is there a way to check the bus speed? It's the next way I want to try. Because, as I've said, looks like it works, but not so fast as it can.

Sorry, don't know about that.

Anyway, thanks for help. I'll try to do something more by myself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somewho (Post 4635649)

My motherboard: ECS 845GV-M3 (with some strange "AGP Express")

i845GV isnt meant to have an AGP slot-

Quote:

Intel 845GV Chipset

The i845GV design is quite a bit different, and is targeted at the entry-level buyer. It incorporates integrated Intel Extreme Graphics, but does not allow for a dedicated AGP 4X slot and only supports up to DDR266 speeds.

http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardwar...rd-Reviews.htm

(BTW, I tried to find that info at the intel site, but it wasnt being easy...)

The hint is even on the ECS site-

Quote:

AGP express
AGP Express is a patented ECS design delivering the backward compatibility for VGA interface. Chipsets including were originally designed without AGP graphic card support, but with this ECS innovative technical breakthrough, limited AGP card is now available on these platform as the support list of each model.

http://www.ecs.com.tw/ECSWebSite/Pro...uID=18&LanID=0

To be honest, I didnt know that ECS used those 'AGP Express' slots on i845 boards. If it works the same as AGP Express does on the later boards, its just the power from 2 PCI slots, and only single PCI slot bandwidth.

So reporting "forcing AGP to PCI mode" would be correct. Its not actually a AGP slot, its a PCI slot that looks like an AGP slot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somewho (Post 4637927)

[CODE]Talking about AGP Express bus, I thought, that, may be, it all happens because it's really slower than AGP (for exmaple, like something, described here). But, in this case, why am I able to play games (like Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory) and watch films under Windows XP without any troubles?

Splinter cell might be running from the video RAM and only needs to put new stuff into video RAM when changing stages, etc..

As far as video goes, I'd try playing with the output from VLC, or try increasing the RAM used by the player.

Thanks for useful info. I've read about "AGP Express", but haven't read about 845GV.

Quote:

So reporting "forcing AGP to PCI mode" would be correct. Its not actually a AGP slot, its a PCI slot that looks like an AGP slot.

Yes, I know.

Quote:

Splinter cell might be running from the video RAM and only needs to put new stuff into video RAM when changing stages, etc..

And works faster that glxgears? :) I can't believe.

I've downloaded GPU-Z for Windows (attachment). Yes, assuming my current knowledge about 845GV and "AGP Express", looks like under Windows all works as it should. But not under linux :(

By the way, in my lspci's output for Radeon I've found

Quote:

latency 32

. Is it OK?

UPD
I've manually set it's latency to 0, but nothing changed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somewho (Post 4638769)

And works faster that glxgears? :) I can't believe.

I dont get what you are trying to say here.

GLXgears in not a benchmark anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somewho (Post 4638769)

I've downloaded GPU-Z for Windows (attachment). Yes, assuming my current knowledge about 845GV and "AGP Express", looks like under Windows all works as it should. But not under linux :(

By the way, in my lspci's output for Radeon I've found . Is it OK?

UPD
I've manually set it's latency to 0, but nothing changed.

Your GPU-Z sceenie shows that you are using PCI mode with windows as well (Bus Interface AGP 2x @ PCI).

Latency 32 is fine AFAIK.

Quote:

I dont get what you are trying to say here.

I mean, even if that game is using some optimization, I can't believe that that is the only reason why it works faster than simple 3d-test (or what glxgears is). I hope, now you understand me.

Quote:

Your GPU-Z sceenie shows that you are using PCI mode with windows as well (Bus Interface AGP 2x @ PCI).

Yes, I've understood GPU-Z output before posting :) That was just a proof of your post about lack of AGP 4x at 845GV chipset, and about "AGP Express" meaning.
I've tried to manually set

Code:

        Option "BusType" "PCI"

        Option "AGPMode" "2" # I thought, may be, Xorg is trying to work at 4x speed and fails

in xorg.conf, but, as always, no results.

Quote:

Latency 32 is fine AFAIK.

Yeah, now I've got it, thanks.