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-   -   Advice on buying new CPU and motherboard (https://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/linux-hardware-18/advice-on-buying-new-cpu-and-motherboard-4175538252/)

lucmove 03-30-2015 10:58 AM

Advice on buying new CPU and motherboard
 
I need to buy a new computer (I always build them myself), a desktop, but now I am in an unprecedented difficult situation.

There was a time when I knew everything about computers. I used to read magazines and many websites very frequently. But that was 7 years ago. Believe me, I never read anything again so my knowledge is frozen in time. I feel like Captain America.

My old desktop was an Athlon XP 1700. Whatever came after that? Decathlon? Titanium? Double Core Duo? Triple Core Trio? Quad Four Hardcore? I swear, I don't know. The only thing I've read in all these years is horror stories about Secure Boot. I've been googling a lot over the last few days, but I am still lost. These are my requirements:
  • I am mostly concerned with motherboard and processor because I can't tell one current processor from another and motherboards don't have PCI slots anymore, and that's confusing for me (I am not kidding).
  • I MUST be able to disable secure boot. I don't care if this or that distro can sign it, I want to know that I can install anything on it, including BSD or Weekend In The Basement Linux.
  • It has to be a 64-bit system because I've been prevented from using certain applications that just plain don't support 32 anymore.
  • I don't need a badass video card because I never play games. Badass video cards are too expensive anyway.
  • I do want a badass sound card though because I care a lot about audio, and
  • I will avoid mobos with USB 3.x because nothing supports it anyway, and I have an audio interface that is 1.1, and I've read that 1.1 and 3.x are like worst enemies and won't interact at all.
  • I prefer Intel, but maybe I can be talked out of it.

If you know of a good combination of motherboard and modern processor that fits my bill, please let me know. I am tired of reading specs. Thank you.

rknichols 03-30-2015 11:36 AM

If you don't need gaming-power video, stick with the Intel processors with built in HD video and motherboards that support it. In my experience, you get much better video performance than with an AMD processor and the stripped-down video chipset that is built into motherboards.

In the Intel processor families, what you gain in the i7 over the i5 is Hyperthreading. You're paying quite a bit more for something that might not make a huge difference in performance. Also, I've seen a lot of reports of overheating with the i7 processors and the stock cooling that comes with them. (No such problem with my i5.)

My most recent build is a Gigabyte GA-Z97X-UD3H motherboard with an Intel i5-4690K 3.5GHz CPU and 16GB of 1866MHz memory. It runs rings around my older AMD Phenom II X4 945 3.0GHz processor on an Asus M4A78T-E motherboard. memtest86+ reports a far faster bus speed, and I see performance that agrees with that.

dugan 03-30-2015 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucmove (Post 5339884)
  • I do want a badass sound card though because I care a lot about audio, and
  • I will avoid mobos with USB 3.x because nothing supports it anyway, and I have an audio interface that is 1.1, and I've read that 1.1 and 3.x are like worst enemies and won't interact at all.

My USB 3 ports have not had a problem with any device I've put into them. Don't know why anyone would expect otherwise. As for nothing supporting USB3, I beg to differ. I own a USB3 external hard drive enclosure, and it's great. Much less painful than a USB2 enclosure.

If you already have a USB sound card that you're happy with, then my recommendation is to keep using it. I think anyone who wants a quality sound card should buy a USB one anyway.

As for CPU power, it sounds like you'll be happy with an Intel I3. All have (quite-good) integrated video these days. This thread has good information about how much CPU horsepower various LQ members have found themselves happy with:

http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...ry-4175528923/

If you buy a motherboard separately (to do your own PC build), then you will have both the option to disable Secure Boot and the option to boot into BIOS mode instead of UEFI mode. Don't worry about that.

@rknichols my Haswell I7 is using the stock cooler, and it does not have an overheating problem. I been doing regular compilations of large projects like Wine, Dolphin, Firefox and the kernel on it, with no issues.

veerain 03-30-2015 11:43 AM

Processor: AMD A series or a FX Quad/Six/Octo processor

Motherboard: Asus FM2+ or AM3+ mobo

Video: AMD A series has built in, For AM3+ any HD6450 or Newer R5 series video card

Audio: Mobo has builtin 5.1 channel or even 7.1 channel audio.

USB: USB2 + USB3. Consider USB3 for external storage; faster transfer rates.

The above mobos have PCI2 Express ports as well one or two plain pci 3 ports.

273 03-30-2015 11:44 AM

I've had no trouble with my USB ports either even with a hub attached all seems to work fine.
Remember to buy a decent PSU also, by the way, I managed to damnage one just turning the power socket it was plugged into on and off. I shall not buy an el-cheapo PSU again. My current one isn't modular, which means I have to hide cables behind the motherboard in my capacious case, as I couldn't afford on but I hope it'll last as reviews have been fairly good for it.

johnsfine 03-30-2015 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rknichols (Post 5339901)
In the Intel processor families, what you gain in the i7 over the i5 is Hyperthreading.

I had never seen that claim before. I will continue delaying my next (built from parts) computer purchase anyway. But I better find out whether you are correct before I buy. Most of what the OP said applies to me except I need an unusually fast computer for things other than games and video, so I thought I needed a high end i7. But I know I don't need hyperthreading. I need faster cores, not more than the typical few cores. Hyperthreading is like having twice as many cores that (in some applications) are each a little over half as fast as the true cores. So that is more throughput when doing many things at once and more responsiveness because cpu time is "sliced" more finely without extra context switch overhead. But it is ultimately less speed for whatever gating thread you end up waiting for.

273 03-30-2015 12:18 PM

Just as an aside, while I'd love to recommend AMD, experience with my FX-8120 is bad and I think johnsfine is correct* that truly fast cores probably are the way forward for most people. I know that the 8120 is well know, now, for being rubbish also. However, it does work for me and temperature problems aside I have what I need.

*Sorry, I realise this is not what was said and know it's too simplified.

TobiSGD 03-30-2015 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnsfine (Post 5339921)
I had never seen that claim before. I will continue delaying my next (built from parts) computer purchase anyway. But I better find out whether you are correct before I buy. Most of what the OP said applies to me except I need an unusually fast computer for things other than games and video, so I thought I needed a high end i7. But I know I don't need hyperthreading. I need faster cores, not more than the typical few cores. Hyperthreading is like having twice as many cores that (in some applications) are each a little over half as fast as the true cores. So that is more throughput when doing many things at once and more responsiveness because cpu time is "sliced" more finely without extra context switch overhead. But it is ultimately less speed for whatever gating thread you end up waiting for.

You also get larger caches with the i7 series (which may or may not have an impact on your specific workload), some extra features like VT-d and if you go for the highend i7 using socket LGA2011 more physical cores (up to 8), even larger caches (up to 20MB L3) and more memory channels (up to 4). If this is relevant to you and worth the higher price has of course to be determined for your specific workload.

lucmove 03-30-2015 02:43 PM

I hadn't thought about Hyperthreading. I do use VMware very often. However, I already use it almost satisfactorily on a humble Atom 1.6 GHz netbook. Sometimes it gets slow, but you know, it's a slow machine anyway, I don't suppose it's because of the lack of Hyperthreading, so I should be fine, right?

Is there some way I can verify whether secure boot can be completely disabled on a specific motherboard? It's not something that retailers advertise. They just assume that every computer in the world will run Windows.

dugan 03-30-2015 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucmove (Post 5340051)
Is there some way I can verify whether secure boot can be completely disabled on a specific motherboard? It's not something that retailers advertise. They just assume that every computer in the world will run Windows.

Every x86 and x86_64 motherboard allows you to disable Secure Boot.

Every x86 and x86_64 motherboard also allows you to boot into BIOS mode, which does not use Secure Boot.

jlinkels 03-30-2015 06:42 PM

Intel i7 is faster than i5 is faster than i3.

There are a gazillion versions of each, with different process technologies, sockets, cores and hyperthreading.

If you are interested you can google for comparison lists. By the time you figured that out the next two generations are on the market and you can start all over.

Recommendation: ASUS mainboard and an i7 which fits your budget. Intel graphic cards are fast enough for your desktop, and so is the i7 processing power for the next 4 years.

Make sure and triple check if the mainboard supports the processor socket type. Some socket types look remarkably similar!

ASUS mainboards have secure boot which can be disabled. They support EFI. You need to run Debian Jessie to use EFI and to use the intel E3 graphic cards in KDE. Other desktops work in Wheezy.

jlinkels

TobiSGD 03-31-2015 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucmove (Post 5340051)
Is there some way I can verify whether secure boot can be completely disabled on a specific motherboard? It's not something that retailers advertise. They just assume that every computer in the world will run Windows.

Sounds counterintuitive at first, but look for Windows 8 logos on the box or in the advertizement. The Windows 8 Logo program requires an option to disable Secure Boot.

beachboy2 03-31-2015 11:08 AM

1 Attachment(s)
lucmove,

Motherboard and CPU Combo:

This Intel Dual Core G3258 (Socket 1150) has one of the highest power/cost ratios of any CPU currently available (4014 benchmark):

http://www.ebuyer.com/645548-intel-p...l-bx80646g3258

There is no need to spend more on an i3 or i5 CPU for your Linux machine, unless you wish to do so.

I have always found Gigabyte motherboards to be very reliable.

Here is one example, the Gigabyte GA-H81M-S2H Socket 1150 VGA DVI HDMI Micro ATX:
http://www.ebuyer.com/667108-gigabyt...rd-ga-h81m-s2h


I would recommend using 4GB (or 8 GB) of Corsair or Crucial ram:
http://www.ebuyer.com/235776-corsair...v4gx3m1a1333c9

I have no idea what hard drive to recommend since Seagate acquired Samsung's HDD business.

The attached pic shows the Secure Boot feature (Enabled/Disabled) on a Gigabyte
UEFI DualBIOS.

lucmove 04-01-2015 07:32 AM

I don't suppose there is any motherboard with integrated video that will support multiple screens. Is there?

beachboy2 04-01-2015 07:56 AM

lucmove,

With regard to the above motherboard which uses on-chip graphics, dual monitors should run using the D-sub (VGA) and either DVI-D or HDMI.

DVI-D and HDMI cannot both display simultaneously.

You could buy a separate graphics card with dual DVI-D ports similar to this one:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Zotac-GeForc.../dp/B0084IELGE


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