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Old 11-28-2004, 02:18 PM   #16
oicdn
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But that's why this barebones thing would work, because the programmers wouldn't have to guess if there was nothing on the distro from the start.......everything needed would be with the program you're trying to install.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 02:22 PM   #17
XavierP
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Everything? All rpms then? What about Debian users?

Distrowatch has over a hundred distros listed, you are asking for a program which has all dependencies resolved for all those distros in a format which they can not only read and use but which will show up in their package management systems and can be upgraded as a nd when they need to. Quite a job.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 02:28 PM   #18
oicdn
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Well, that would be the "perk" if you will for having this distro. It contains all the dependancy issues resolves as every install is treated as a blank slate for that program, and if it is infact already there, it just updates it or leaves it alone (as yast does).

Saying "well what about the other distros?" is absurd...you don't see Debian or Mandrake users DLing Suse or Redhat RPMs. You could call this distro Slim Linux orwhatever, and make the RPM formatted specifically for that distro, as most people already have (packman is great example). His RPMs are Suse specific and are pretty close to what I'm talking about, treating each install as if it were the first install, including what's needed for it to run in most instances only, his packages still require dependancies. So essentially, it'd be like a Packman, but with all the dependancies included....
 
Old 11-28-2004, 02:37 PM   #19
speel
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Quote:
Originally posted by oicdn
yes...GAIM is the other thing Iw as thinking of...GAT DAMN that sucks ass to install......mine still doesn't work so I said F it and just DL'd aim and yahoo....the only two I use anyhow....
rofl
 
Old 11-28-2004, 02:43 PM   #20
XavierP
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actually, I was being obtuse. There is already an OS that does this. Go here to check it out

 
Old 11-28-2004, 02:46 PM   #21
oicdn
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LOL!....touche'....the only reason I'm not running a MS OS on this box is spam, spyware, virus'.....I don't have to worry about them on this machine. my other machine, for video editing, and general use however, is MS XP Pro....I would just like an OS that's low key on the Virus and other net crap (linux is it)....
 
Old 11-28-2004, 02:52 PM   #22
XavierP
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OK. Personally, I can't see a problem with the distro side of it, making a very minimal distro is possible and there are a few out there. The problem I see is that you would need someone to post these programs (all umpty thousand of them - Debian quotes over 8000 packages) which is amega job in itself.

The way I would get around this (and I've not tried it) is to set up a repository directory on your hard drive. Let's say you are using YUM or APT. You point YUM/APT at that directory as well as the internet repositories. Open the gui frontend for that program (or do it via console) and when you install your program via APT/YUM, it would also resolve dependencies.

Job done.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 03:06 PM   #23
acid_kewpie
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Ok, well i *AM* a developer. So I totally entitled to say why some developers won't do this or that.

I write acidrip, a perl dvd ripping tool.
Code:
acidrip
  |---> gtk2-perl
  |        |---> perl
  |        |---> glib-perl
  |        |         |---> glib
  |        |---> gtk2
  |---> lsdvd
  |        |---> libdvdread
  |                    |---> libdvdcss
  |---> mencoder
           |---> lame  
           |---> ffmpeg
           |---> xvid
           |---> win32libs
           |---> etc...
at what point am I supposed to stop adding default requirements to my 2000 line program??? programs like mplayer work ok one a minimal set of libraries, but people want it to do all these extra things too, and it backs up that it's my fault, as the acidrip developer that the version of mplayer i ship doesn't include say... xvid codecs. well lucky me.

Quote:
Although your post is absolutely correct, I smell a slight scent of dookie behind it (a$$hole-ish maybe?)you act like it's not possible to install those programs without you DLing a thousand other things.
Please watch your mouth... or fingers. being rude and insulting to members will get you nowhere. And personally, I would appreciate an apology

Last edited by acid_kewpie; 11-28-2004 at 03:09 PM.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 04:17 PM   #24
rehab junkie
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I'm not going to get on my high horse about the whole Linux vs. BSD thing... but in FreeBSD, if you wanted to install for example gaim... to install a package you just type pkg_add -r gaim from a terminal, and it will fetch the current precompiled package with any dependancies needed.

FreeBSD also has what's called the ports system (similar to Gentoo's portage) - a collection of make scripts which do the same as pkg_add but will go out and fetch the sources and compile them on your system.

Updating is simple. You keep the ports tree in synch with cvsup, then run a tool which will update everything that needs it.


It's a simple and elegant way to manage your installed apps. Now that I use it I can't go back to Linux, not even Debian with its apt-get. For those who say there isn't as much software available, there are currently ~12000 ports in the collection now.

Last edited by rehab junkie; 11-28-2004 at 04:18 PM.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 04:19 PM   #25
acid_kewpie
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like you said gentoo has portage. there's also yum and apt that give very similar functionality now. Ports alone isn't a reason to stick with BSD.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 04:23 PM   #26
rehab junkie
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Personal preference. I like the way BSD is organised, it suits my way of thinking.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 04:25 PM   #27
speel
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ok well to kinda make your life easyer try debian or ubuntu ( ubuntu is debian based) beacuase there package management apt-get collects the dependencys you need and installs them automaticly and its all i use
 
Old 11-28-2004, 04:30 PM   #28
acid_kewpie
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well we've already been passed apt a number of times, but that's not what the thread is about.
 
Old 11-28-2004, 05:50 PM   #29
oicdn
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Quote:
Originally posted by acid_kewpie
Please watch your mouth... or fingers. being rude and insulting to members will get you nowhere. And personally, I would appreciate an apology [/B]
Sorry if that seemed rude, it was just meant to state your post seemed a little d!ckheaded....no offense meant to you personally, your post just seemed a little rude....sorry if mine came accross brash as well....
 
Old 11-28-2004, 07:29 PM   #30
Tinkster
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Quote:
Originally posted by oicdn
His RPMs are Suse specific and are pretty close to what I'm talking about, treating each install as if it were the first install, including what's needed for it to run in most instances only, his packages still require dependancies. So essentially, it'd be like a Packman, but with all the dependancies included....
That is SO hilarious, words fail me :)

Even in these days when RAM, disk-space and bandwidth are
cheap as dirt that's as brain-dead an approach to the problem
of user stupidity/laziness as there can possibly be :)

I assume you'd like it best if any app was statically linked against
all the required libraries (I don't even want to THINK about a 80
MB text-editor or 60MB mp3-tag-editor... ). And no, dynamic linking
with 30 versions of the same thing in separate directories doesn't
really resolve the underlying stupidity).


Cheers,
Tink
 
  


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