lol. Point taken.

Dude, I don't mean to sound harsh, but you gave Linux a tryout for 4 days, and you want to throw in the towel? No offense, but it sounds like you may have some unrealistic expectations about the length of time it takes to learn a new technical skill, rather than that Linux isn't ready for prime time. I mean, seriously, what kinds of things can someone learn in just 4 days? Database administration? No. Network security? No. Programming? No. A foreign language? No. A new OS? Again, no.

I don't think there's any way anyone can persuade somebody else that Linux is going to work out better than Windows for them -- that obviously is a personal decision based on each person's unique situation. If Windows is a better deal for you, hey, that's great, if Linux is a better deal for me, well, same deal. However, I would encourage you though to at least give Linux a fair tryout. If you ask me, working with Linux for only 4 days and then deciding it isn't worth it would be like watching the opening credits of a movie and then walking out and complaining that the entire movie sucks. In that scenario, would you really even know enough about it to form a supportable opinion?

Anyway, I'm not trying to be provocative or an irritant, but geez, I'd encourage you to at least give Linux a fair chance. After all, something about that movie must have been interesting enough to get you into that movie theater, right? -- J.W.

I have to agree, I've crashed linux in my life as much as I've crashed Windows, actually. I first started using it probably 10 years ago, the choices were much more limited than what linux has out today. Debian. slackware, and maybe one or two others were avaialble {one was tooated as teh scientist's linux as I recall}. First install I ever did was on an IBM PS/2 2133-19c, neither slackware nor debian ever booted. I was cursed, told I was an idiot, but not a single user of the linux comunity could help me get it running. Back to DOS and Win 3.1. Later I tried on the same machine again after upgrading to 95 for a year I forget teh distro I tried but it was neither slackware nor debian, and I don't recall seeing redhat availble at this time but it might have been. It was not OSR2, but it still beat linux after my second attemp. This time it would boot and when I logged in it would never get get any further. Hardware support at this tiem was VERY limited, and I believe it might of had soemthing to do with me having a 486 SX CPU as opposed to a DX, but never could confirm this. Again I was ridiculed and cursed by the supposed know it all linux heads, but none could help. I was even told I had nonstandard crappy hardware. Apparently buying IBM brand coputers got you nonstandard hardware. That was about the dumbest thing I ever heard, but.

Next, I built a P2-400 i440BX machine. I tried to install a veriety of linuxes and they ran a booted, but any time I ran netscape communicator the system was hard froze. Now I blame netscape for this, but linux, as advertised, should have let me shut netscape down and go about my bunisess, it didn't and browsing with my only other choice at this time lynx just wasn't getting the job done. {Oddly enough today I like lynx, but...}. Next system athlon 750 with a via KT133 chipset, a chipset known to be a big hunking POS, and Linux nor windows were immune to its bad design, random lockups under both until some time later when via got some drivers out for windows that fixed the issues, and asus released a few bios revisions that helped fix some of the buggy parts. Linux was removed and installed in the forms of mandrake 7.1 and 8.0 but it just was never stable under that POS via chipset. Never again will I buy via either.

Fast foraward to today, I built a P4 using an sis mobo and while Mandrake 9.1 has run well, I have already hard locked it once, I have never hard locked XP tp date, though I did expereince the annoyance of the RPC shutdown on our w2K boxes at work. This was due to incompetent IT dept, considering I even mantioned they needed to patch the boxes that morning. The only time mandrake has locked though is when reading the second CD from the install from within linux.

My guess the CDrom driver has a slight bug and it seems the device gets a tad too much priority, though the other attempts to read the CD did not lock the system just konqueror.

Now that's not to say I never had win 95/98 crash on me. Nor NT 4.0 using it at work, but so far, Ive had no problems out of W2K at work or WXP at home {thought I i did have to upgrade from 128MB ram for 2K at work a few years back since corel 8 paradox is a freaking HOG, now I have a .5GB system and use access but.}.

As a desktop OS the lastest releases from MS are great, and linux is great as well, but I'd not place linux above XP/2K for stability from my experiences. But this is desktop OS {aka client} only, not server related. Still Linux runs good and is not a catastrophy like it was in my previous versions, so it deserves its praise too. I just hate the man pages. Windows help system > man pages by far. Other than that in this day and age I'd say either is a viable OS, though both ore far over hyped by their zealotous communities.

Recent distros of linux = Windows 2K/XP until gaming or server usage gets involved, then it changes.

Thank you! That is what I am saying. I have had Mandrake 9.1 completely lock twice (which I posted about but haven't found a solution yet). While I have never had XP lock up like that, this is still not bad. Linux requires a bit more configuration knowledge (maybe not more, but different) and it seems like those 2 lockups were related to audio + xine + my nForce2 chipset. An issue that will be overcome as soon as I figure out how to fix it

I was also using computers back in the DOS days (hell, even had a TRS80 that ran basic ) but didn't get a Windows PC till Win '98. Windows 98, although cool, was unstable as hell. I think mostly due to it's immaturity and the FAT32 filesystem. Then, I hooked up with that absolute abortion of code called ME. Trashed it for 2000 Pro almost immediately, then got XP when it came out. M$ finally nailed it with XP. People I know that should barely be allowed to use a computer get along pretty well with XP.

I started with linux (mandrake 8.1) for much the same reasons as everyone else. More control and escaping the M$ manipulation machine. I really dig Mandrake 9.1. I am working on a B.S.I.T. and think I learn more in a few weeks of using Linux than a whole semester at school. I am just about to take an outside course on Unix administration that looks very cool and will prepare me for the certification, so hopefully my Unix/Linux skills will be improving at a much faster rate soon.

Anyway, Linux is catching up to Windows in the desktop area fast and I am thrilled about it. I think it's already got them beat in the server market due linux being open source allowing complete control over everything. When I say desktop market, I mean the average Joe that just wants his computer to work. Most of the people here @ linuxquestions (myself included) enjoy making our computers work and thats where linux is #1.

Well, I don't think of Linux as an OS that you can rush into it... You nee some previous knwledge (how to make a copy of /etc/lilo.conf for example).

About editing files... there are many ways... Emacs is oine, VI is another... and cat + echo + PIPES is another... There are many more... but that is more the enough. I use them all on a daily basis....

You first need to read a little about linux... and once you manage to survive a few minutes weeks on linux only, then you can read more deep stuff. Know your resources, and use them. LQ is a great one, mailing lists are great as well; but TLDP (http://www.tldp.org) is probably the best source for documents and how-to.

I have Linux (mandrake 9.1, REdHat9) and Windows 2k on my computer... and I use windows for certain things (playing online and stuff) and Linux for almost everything else... I'm using Mandrake right now... with Mozilla.

Try reading the old posts of this section... you will understan much MUCH more things. And please aknowledge that Linux is different form windows in many many ways, It's a little hader to learn linux without reading at all (I've never EVER read a single manual on Windows or it's utilities, except for Access and Visual Studio, and both times I learn programming languages, no how to use the software). For linux, instead, I read the man pages all the time... you might want to try them (just type man <programname> and hit return)

Hope I helped.

BTW: there is a newbie section in this website... you might want to try that out

I had two crashes in a year under XP (but pulled out the plug and everything was OK again).
I had no crashes under SuSe in the same year.

But, in fact, it is not a great difference.

im sure im just unlucky with XP, but iv had and still have serious problems with it.

in close to a year iv never had any distrobution of Linux crash. There have been times when an application might have crashed, but it would always be possible to just kill that app and carry on as normal.

with windows now i get 3 errors every startup, as well as that "the process your trying to run is busy" message, before iv even ran anything. It takes almost 5 minutes to boot up. It is very slow when it runs (this machine is nearly 2ghz, 512 ram) and managed to slow right down occassionally. When antivirus runs my system dies completely, and becomes completely unusable.

i applied M$ patch and got hit by a couple of virii anyway, which was really useful. Since then i havent been able to get internet sharing to work, so i cant get online with my Linux box (for another few weeks at least, when il sort it all out)

on shutdown it nearly always gives errors, almost always. It has about a 20% chance of shutting down correctly. It either gives plenty of errors, or just stops completely, displaying nothing but the backdrop (no icons, no taskbar, nothing) so i had to unplug.

and thats xp, the stable one. All versions of windows degrade over time. The more programs you install and uninstall, the worse it gets. Iv filled this computers 40GB HDD numerous times, and im fairly sure its screwed up its own registry.

win98 was a disaster, and it took me a couple of years to break it completely, to the point that only a format would save it. Fortunately the machine it was on has now been salvaged, with its own Tux sticker and running Slackware.

windows has always been a disaster for me, its been plagued with problems. Maybe it was just fated that way, so that i would contribute my efforts to Linux. You never know, i was learning how to do windows programming before eventually installing Linux, and now im doing little else other than learning KDevelop/QT GTK/Gnome, as well as brushing up on my C++. In the end, it worked out nicely.

I can agree with you in the frustrations of Linux. Being involved with Linux for the past year has been somewhat of an adventure. I thought I was doing alot with setting up my openbsd firewall...little did I know what was ahead. It does take two things until you start to get the hang of it...lots of patience and time.
And in the beginning when I first started using Windows, it was much easier to get a grasp on. Of course all you are doing is clicking icons and not really getting into the heart of things...with Linux you almost feel pushed into it. Do or die. Sink or swim.
Mostly what I have dealt with when friends are first starting to use Linux...they complain of too much time trying to figure out what the problems are to get things running smoothly or to run at all or too much time spent in forums trying to get answers to questions. Versions like Mandrake at least give you a head start and you get to see something familiar when you start up...a nice easy to get around desktop utility like Gnome.
Unfortunately not alot of people out there have the time to spend learning an operating system all over again. So people use what they are used to, Windows. You give up this for that. It's not for everybody...mostly not for the impatient type. Like I said earlier my first adventure was with openbsd on setting up my firewall, my second adventure to get my feet even a bit more wet...Mandrake 9.1
So far so good...but some stumps along the way. I imagine once I get things going for a bit I'll get used to it and things will start to actually make sense to me...as long as I study and read and spend the time with it. My latest adventure with it...Gnucash. Oh boy...I loaded the .qif file it wanted to see so eagerly only to find out when it "successfully" loaded, my checking 1 account was good, my secondary account was over by 20,000.00 and my savings was dwindled down to 5% of the original amount. Naturally when I was running win98 and went to win2k pro...no probs at all when I perfomed the same import.
Oh well...it's live and learn. Linux isn't for everyone. I still use Windows on a dialy basis...I still use Mandrake on a daily basis. Will I ever let go of Windows 100%? Probably not...I drive Nissans and Fords. I play Gibsons and Fenders. I eat pancakes and eggs, I drink water and wine. Ahhh Variety. Did someone say wine? Oh boy...don't get me started. Thats another week spent of finding out why some programs for Windows don't run in Linux. At least the ones I've tried. Which always turn out to be the ones you really really want.

sorry I did not read all of this thread

I would get a couple of nics and a hub(if needed) and use linux as the router.

Just a suggestion, that's what I use.
Or get an ethernet router.

LInux has good support for most usb devices, but as a network connection they are not very reliable in any os that I have seen.

In two months I had over five crashes with mandrake 8.1. Mandrake 9.2, no problems at all. With Windows XP I still have one or two crashes every week or so... that's why I installed win2K... no problems since. Except that the storm just cut the power.... I hate when that happends...

Anyway... it's going a little off topic...

Have you tried what I said?

okay i have seen about twenty threads all about this same subject and none of you seem to even touch it, instead you say things like "if you don't give linux a chance you're better off with Windows."

if you don't know the answer to the question, it's okay to say so. we can look elsewhere.

"I can't believe how many times I heard the word "crashes" associated with windows in this one thread. "

My parents have Windows XP. They use Word, Outlook and IE, that's it. It locks up quite frequently and needs reboots. And every few weeks, the printer stops working. The only way to get it working again is to delete the print queue (XP always freezes here), uninstall the printer, delete the files, reinstall the printer, and ignore a bunch of warnings during the driver install. Yes, this is the HP printer that came with the computer (a Dell), and these are the official XP drivers.

Oh yeah, and search engines, trojan horses, and spyware have hijacked IE's start page, error pages, search pages, bookmarks, etc.. Porn ads accumulate on the desktop when the machine is not in use. Even odds the machine is spewing out spam and DOS attacks during the night, since I can't be bothered to patch and clean my parents' computer every second week.

I've never had a Linux system freeze on me, or do any of that other crap.

So what's wrong with Windows? You tell me.

The reason I got into Linux was for the fact that I wanted to seriously get into programming. Once I learnt C++, I thought of moving onto C# and was glad to hear about the mono project.
The only problem is creating GUIs.
While I don't need them, or even particularly like them, anyone who I've started making programs for doesn't want it to be a black screen with writing on it(mainly as I make programs for idiots ). They want a nice little window with a little textbox and a button to press.
While I don't mind too much, it means that I can't go on Linux as much as I'd like to.. Hopefully C# will change that, as anyone with the .NET framework can view the apps...

Anyways yeah ill shut up. Just play about, have some fun! Don't get stressed.

Linux is very Nietzsche-an... "That operating system that does not kill you makes you stronger, technologically speaking".

Sometimes it's not easy to get something to work. Some things will not work right off the bat no matter what you do.

You just have to be patient, a little analytical, and persistent, and willing to learn, and you'll find that eventually you will be able to do things with your machine that you never thought you could do before.

And the best part is, you'll understand it better.

If you give up and walk away, you learn nothing.

In short, you have nothing to lose, and everything to gain by sticking with Linux. If you do manage to get things working the way you want, get past all the hurdles, all the man pages, all the recompiling and configuration files, and all the reinstalling, you'll come out of the other end of that knowing a lot more about computers than the 'average' person.

And you'll discover that it's not nearly as hard as it sounded when you first started out.

Don't give up on it.

If your sure your modem will not work look for other options, most of us here have been on the internet for years, and there are a lot of us here. Linux was born on the internet. A simpe call to your ISP to say bring me an ethernet modem would do the trick without any more fuss. Or if you bought it then try to trade it off to someone else and get another one. People buy them every day.

Linux has been my Internet router since RH 6.2 came out. And it has never been a problem.