The problem that i have with linspire is the fact that it is so crippled(imo)

What i mean by that is it doesn't even have GCC, and the only way to get it is through cnr, which in the long run will cost you more than windows. It also comes with a broken version of apt(though you can get a full version). One problem that i have with cnr is that almost 90% of the software you download in cnr can be downloaded through apt 100% free.

Also, people will be coming from windows to linux, and they will chose linspire. Then they start thinking that linux sucks because it is just a windows wannabe and you have to pay to download software. They will then quickly switch back to windows because of the little they can do.

I know that if i had started with lindows instead of mandrake 7.2, i would have thought linux was not viable and would be using windows right now.

I have been a Linux user for 6 years and have run all major dists. Today Linspire is all I use. It is the first dist that just works out of the box: hardware, software - everything. Using CNR is a breeze and it's very cheap. For $49 / year you get:
- CNR with it's ~2000 apps
- Good discounts on commercial software titles in CNR
- Every new release of Linspire

...there's simply nothing that can beat this.

Debian

100% free and open source(linspire is based on it)
Extremely cheap as it is free.
Don't need cnr because apt alone has exactly 15,396 packages
Can use apt to update to each new release.

Linspire has to make money too, i can understand you not wanting them to charge for software, but for a newbie or somone tha just doesnt want to be bothered by the technical aspects of everything its great. second how can you say its more expencive than windows in the long run, think about howmany programs you can download in a yr. that you would have to have paid for in windows, second after you dowloaded all the one's you wanted or needed why would u pay for anything after that, unless they have a killer app that you needed. I think its deffinetly worth it especially since they use some of the money to put back into the projects themselves.

Debian is hell for average Joe user. Debian is great for geeks or developers. Debian stable have to be put in museum. Debian testing does not have security patch. Debian unstable is unstable. You have to be geeks to use Debian.

Use Mandrake, FC, or Suse instead.

^wtf are you talking about???

i use mepis, all the advantages of debian sid and none of the disadvantages.

happy bday, nuka_t but what I mean by Debian is pure Debian ( www.debian.org ) not distro that based on Debian.

have you heard of the debian installer? its not mandrake, but its much improved.

debian is not only for geeks, once installed its just like any other distro, except better.

oh, and thanks, except in my timezone my birthday is tomorrw

I see that people at Mepis or Lindows take source code that other write with hard work and for free, they pack it into some more or less shinig installer, than they sell what is 90% made by others for a fee, as if everything they sell was their own work.

If the people who write the linux kernel or Kde or the gimp, just to quote some of them, would do the same, linux wouldn't exists.

I understand that sooner or later linux developers should be receiving some sort of compenstion, but as long as linux is a voluntary effort the very existence of such "linux packagers for a fee" should be avoided, as long as they wouldn't in turn pay some of their dividend back to the other unpaid and hard working linux developers.

You'll be glad to know that Linspire is a big time supporter of open source. It kicks back code to the open source community and pays money to many of the organizations that create it's base code. Check out phonegaim.com

I understand it but I do not understand why gpld code enters such distributions, while they do not offer back source code.

I never spent much time reading about legal matters in linux, but, as far as I know, if one takes gpld software he must give back the new source code that results.

I'm happy to see that Linspire pays back some money to the linux community, anyway I feel that there are people who get the main pieces of whole system, such pieces are gpld, while they do not give back as much code.

For example, redhat gives to the public a whole distro, fedora: it doesn't contain some redhat exclusive products, but such products are entirely developed by them.

The new aol dialer they didn't even devolop, but claimed to have, gave no credit to the original author(s). There are hundreds of examples of them taking source code claiming its theirs, selling it and giving no money to the authors who worked for free to make this open source software. Linspire is a disgrace to the open source community, whats more there are at least 3 distros i've used or use that are easier and more stable than Linspire. Suse 9.1 works right out of the box, with even the newest hardware. Linspire on the other hand I had to find 4 drivers and 1 piece of hardware that I never found a driver for. I only wanted to test it out, and it was a very disapointing experience. I felt like i was using an emulator from the 90's to run windows software, rather than an os that was built off of the linux kernel with linux open source software.

I think Linspire has the best hardware support. About the credits to authors... even though I use Linspire for hours every day, I haven't seen what you describe - maybe you could give some examples? (and yes - the aol dialer IS developed by linspire)

One man's trash is another man's treasure.

The important realization is that in the long run, you have control over what goes on the machine and are not at the mercy of trusting a system that is loaded with abstracted code. Open Source does not always mean free. It is not illegal to sell Open Source applications. I happen to prefer Debian. I have used Linspire but prefer to not participate in paying for what I can get free. I understand how to administer a debian box, so running Linspire for it's "ease" is not a big justification for using it. As for the title of this forum, "Linspire is not Linux"; that does not make a lick of sense. Linux is not an operating system. Linux is any operating system that uses the Linux kernel. Red Hat Linux is an operating system, SuSE linux is an operating system and Linspire is an operating system. They all just happen to be operating systems that use the Linux kernel and are therefore generalized as being called "Linux"

the aol dialer was taken from Pengaol. If you look at the source code they kept all the names, lol. They took the source code made the gui better and then claimed it as their own. I mean come on if you are going to take source code at least rename the files. Also although you are right, selling source code is not illegal, it is however morally wrong is many ways. They are selling a product that they put little to no work into and making a profit. While the ones that put all the hard work into it are not even getting their name mentioned. Whos more evil? Linspire or Microsoft? I find it very hard to determine the differences in their styles.