The Faith & Religion mega Thread

Originally Posted by hazel One confusing factor in Germany is that the state collects tithes on behalf of the churches, so everyone has to belong officially to a church unless they register themselves as unbelievers. Hitler himself was officially a catholic. But I don't think any of them were active believers.

Maybe, but two successive Pope Pius (XI and XII) apparently disagreed, assisting Hitler to power in hopes of increasing the already powerful influence of the Holy See.

Don't matter what religious you are, if they make room for fairytales that's what you get... strap a bomb on and get glory‽ &c...

Might be good to recognize different bases for religious beliefs, ranging from
1. superstitions with virtually no basis in reality
2. myths which at least have the force of popular assent
3. ideas proposed by a widely venerated charismatic or authoritative leader
4. an historical event

The last category entails, i think, just two major religions: Judaism and Christianity. The historical events are, respectively, the people of Israel crossing the Red Sea, and the resurrection of the crucified Jesus, both either supernatural and miraculous, or false and fraudulent.

If Moses truly led the Israelites dry-shod through the Red Sea, the Jewish faith is true. If not, it is a fraud. If Jesus truly is risen, Christianity is true. If not, it is a fraud.

That's all one needs to decide. It matters little whether this or that person who is called a Jew or Christian was a good person or a scoundrel. Did the historical event happen, or not?

Originally Posted by jamison20000e And, before yous whine "we're not all bad eggs just because we believe in fairytales..." Your in the same boat, oh wait you weren't allowed on that boat. LOL

Discussing and explaining is not whining. Like all atheists would be good eggs..yeah right..go to prisons and you will see all kind belief and nonbelief criminals..we are all on|in same boat called planet Earth. Disproove that.

While i not enjoy too much those fairy tales i understand their importance. Without fairy tale influence to newborns and oldborns we would get World War 3. Society can never truly get out of black&white mentality despite life beeing in color so it is either peaceful war(like now with sports etc) or brutal war(bloodbath). So be thankful fairy tales exist forum posters.

Originally Posted by enorbet You were disappointed by "Lions 'n Tigers 'n Bears" as a response to your personal story? What did you expect? There is no objective evidence that you got any manner of "message". It is far more simply explained by coincidence especially since you sought him out for many days. Sooner or later it was likely. Rather than go through all that yet again about standards of evidence and critical thought, I figured my comment demonstrated Frame of Reference and jumping to conclusions. It was not my intent to offend you, but if that is the result of honesty (admittedly with a dollop of obscurity)then oh well. Also please do recall you stated you'd hoped for a negative reaction in the first couple sentences. I didn't think mine was negative. Maybe that was the problem?

Maybe it was my opening spiel. Or maybe I drew you in like I did for 3-4 consecutive days in this thread with Demonica after you questioned my dowsing ability to play you like a fool till I was tired of it and sprung the trap. Don't tell me you didn't think it wasn't offensive after you questioned my dowsing ability.

The way the two of you clung together with the Wizard of Oz bullshit when you couldn't come up with a rational explanation to refute my story reminded me of two white guy strangers in the hood who act like they're best buddies because they're scared to death of getting their ass beat by the black guys. Gretel thought comments Christians dying was pretty funny till I talked about murder. I see he hasn't learned his lesson yet.


I heard it like someone whispered it softly in my right rear. All the crap you put forth above about coincidence is not relevant in the least.


In any instance, Hansel, get in the box with Teddy Bear. You're on ignore if nothing else so I don't set you up to hammer your feelings again a few months down the road. I hate Atheists now more than ever so get in there too Gretel.

From now on none of you exist. You're just Fairy Tails. I had unfinished business with you in this thread, now it's done.

Originally Posted by Trihexagonal Maybe it was my opening spiel. Or maybe I drew you in like I did for 3-4 consecutive days in this thread with Demonica after you questioned my dowsing ability to play you like a fool till I was tired of it and sprung the trap. Don't tell me you didn't think it wasn't offensive after you questioned my dowsing ability.

I used to hang out in another computer forum years ago where I also used to discuss dowsing and my experiences with it. I had the piss ripped out of me time and time again for it.

On computing fora, those into the esoteric are in the strict minority. I gave up defending my position, it was utterly pointless. So I just kept quiet about it in the end, there are many people who will always think people like us are deluded freaks. And I'm fine with that now. I would rather let things go than battle ad nauseam on the internet about something which is ultimately inconsequential to the lives of the people I am trying to convince.

Originally Posted by Arcane Discussing and explaining is not whining. Like all atheists would be good eggs..yeah right..go to prisons and you will see all kind belief and nonbelief criminals..we are all on|in same boat called planet Earth. Disproove that.

True.

Originally Posted by Arcane While i not enjoy too much those fairy tales i understand their importance. Without fairy tale influence to newborns and oldborns we would get World War 3. Society can never truly get out of black&white mentality despite life beeing in color so it is either peaceful war(like now with sports etc) or brutal war(bloodbath). So be thankful fairy tales exist forum posters.

Not true.

When you're a kid and you're more susceptible to Fairytales you're more afraid of the dark. I had a basement once where the light switch was at the bottom of the stairs, I would turn that off and run so fast it would make you spin! Then I grew up. Now I have to watch horror movie after horror movie to finally find one that might give me a little bit of the Creeps like Dead Silence.

Some babies die before they get past that primitive state... so, I guess they go to limbo forever huh, be scary if it was true but it's not.

Our brains flood with drugs, electricity and all kinds of jazz when we die, same as when we live.

Again: science proves why rocks exist, religions and beliefs prove why people throw them them at each other!

Shame on the past for learning nothing from the past but don't worry religion and beliefs are evolving! Go figure‽

Originally Posted by dogpatch Might be good to recognize different bases for religious beliefs, ranging from 1. superstitions with virtually no basis in reality 2. myths which at least have the force of popular assent 3. ideas proposed by a widely venerated charismatic or authoritative leader 4. an historical event The last category entails, i think, just two major religions: Judaism and Christianity. The historical events are, respectively, the people of Israel crossing the Red Sea, and the resurrection of the crucified Jesus, both either supernatural and miraculous, or false and fraudulent. If Moses truly led the Israelites dry-shod through the Red Sea, the Jewish faith is true. If not, it is a fraud. If Jesus truly is risen, Christianity is true. If not, it is a fraud. That's all one needs to decide. It matters little whether this or that person who is called a Jew or Christian was a good person or a scoundrel. Did the historical event happen, or not?

Why not classify those as myths? I mean, what is the distinction between 2 and 4?

Originally Posted by Trihexagonal Maybe it was my opening spiel. Or maybe I drew you in like I did for 3-4 consecutive days in this thread with Demonica after you questioned my dowsing ability to play you like a fool till I was tired of it and sprung the trap. Don't tell me you didn't think it wasn't offensive after you questioned my dowsing ability.

Ah! The extent of your delusion and bent of character is being revealed now. Just because a person deduces another's interests and crafts a few paragraphs to "draw one in", especially in an online Forum, is child's play and hardly represents any manner of "trap". It is apparently impossible to not offend such a Master of Puppets Complex if you are offended just because someone questions your authority. Wait! I think I just heard Cartman yell in my ear.

Originally Posted by Trihexagonal The way the two of you clung together with the Wizard of Oz bullshit when you couldn't come up with a rational explanation to refute my story reminded me of two white guy strangers in the hood who act like they're best buddies because they're scared to death of getting their ass beat by the black guys. Gretel thought comments Christians dying was pretty funny till I talked about murder. I see he hasn't learned his lesson yet.

So, the probability of intersecting coincidence in a limited locality of repeated opportunity isn't rational? You don't know me and have no clue about my history and what scares me and it doesn't include getting my ass beat by black guys in the hood. Most called me "Light"... a select few called me by my real name, more than I allow here.

Originally Posted by Trihexagonal I heard it like someone whispered it softly in my right rear. All the crap you put forth above about coincidence is not relevant in the least.

Coincidence referred to the chance meeting. The "whisper in your ear" most likely anticipation and imagination. Isn't that more rational that "some spirit talked to me to let me know an opportunity to revenge kick ass was nearing"?

Originally Posted by Trihexagonal In any instance, Hansel, get in the box with Teddy Bear. You're on ignore if nothing else so I don't set you up to hammer your feelings again a few months down the road. I hate Atheists now more than ever so get in there too Gretel. From now on none of you exist. You're just Fairy Tails. I had unfinished business with you in this thread, now it's done.

"Hammer my feelings"? Is that what you think you did? I'm smiling right now. How 'bout you? Your standards of judgment are.... interesting... sort of.

Originally Posted by jamison20000e {...}Again: science proves why rocks exist, religions and beliefs prove why people throw them them at each other!{...}

Science is not mightier than religion. Religion can truly explain science cause answers "why?" but science cannot truly explain religion cause ignores "why?". As i wrote already we come from different culture background so we maybe misunderstand context of each other but my basic point of POV was that i am trying to tell that all signs and clues and feeling suggest Deity exist or existed cause humanity was definetly created. I have also body defect so was thinking about this issue for years and that russian video approoved my own thoughts and observations about life growing up and keep in mind that i do not live in Russia so i never met that guy. That unlike what happens sometimes around me is coincidence. Chakra thing prooves creation happened and Evolution only exist for experience. Also why atheists not argue that Devil not exist? Same thing. If they write that God does not exist then they should have no problem writing Devil not exist aswell..yet they act as Devil's advocate most of time. Coincidence? Not really..

Notice This document has been removed from Scribd.

Might be time to update sig link there, Arcane. I smile everyday reading posts in this thread. Ya know, Maybe religious lifestyle rules could use a update also?

Originally Posted by rokytnji Might be time to update sig link there, Arcane. I smile everyday reading posts in this thread. Ya know, Maybe religious lifestyle rules could use a update also?

Really? It is book from Coral Castle builder in Florida. Will update link when home again then. Is that positive or negative kind of smiling? Cause i don't understand something. Ok i am not scientist or someone won any prize or authority figure so understand why i am laughed at but those people who built ancient structures and that "A book in every home" author did achieve something that does make it worthwhile to pay attention. And they agree that life is more than we are told. Yet some still argue cause pride or fear or contract or whatever. There is only one real truth when it comes to both religion and science. Even mythology figures like Jesus and Mohammad and One understood it. Yet people on this forum think truth seekers live in fairy tales. Fairy tales give people hope for better future. Cause when kids grow up into adults they understand why childhood was special.

Science is question everything and religion has many different "answer$" around the globe,,, all unprovable!

Science capitalizes on unprovable things as well.

So Scientology must be the answer, just grab a hold of the phallic symbols and hope you get a high reading...

Originally Posted by Arcane Science is not mightier than religion. Religion can truly explain science cause answers "why?" but science cannot truly explain religion cause ignores "why?".

That's like faulting Science because it can't not be science... that it can't possible explain why Unicorns have horns and horses don't. It's an exercise in speculation and imagination. That's maybe fun for a minute but one can't hope to draw any conclusions from it. Religions are free to (and often do) just make up any ol' kinda baloney. You are aware that even most people in Scientology know it's a scam to qualify for tax free status, right?... yet they still profess belief publicly. What makes them different from any other cult?

Originally Posted by Arcane ... i am trying to tell that all signs and clues and feeling suggest Deity exist or existed cause humanity was definetly created.

Are you seriously blind to how that goes in a circle like a dog biting it's own tail? That circle rests on one giant assumption - that "humanity was definitely created". What facts do you have to back that up? or even just to demonstrate how you came to such a conclusion? It's the central point of discussion in this entire thread.

Originally Posted by Arcane I have also body defect so was thinking about this issue for years and that russian video approoved my own thoughts and observations about life growing up and keep in mind that i do not live in Russia so i never met that guy. That unlike what happens sometimes around me is coincidence. Chakra thing prooves creation happened and Evolution only exist for experience. Also why atheists not argue that Devil not exist? Same thing. If they write that God does not exist then they should have no problem writing Devil not exist aswell..yet they act as Devil's advocate most of time. Coincidence? Not really..

"Devil's Advocate" is not to be taken literally. It does not mean that atheists believe in Satan or whatever name you choose as the personification of Evil. An atheist has concluded it is highly unlikely ANY deity or so-called "supernatural beings" exist. The purpose of the phrase is to illustrate the concept of "let me take the opposing view hypothetically and let's see where that goes... how that plays out"... for the sake of argument.

Please do explain how chakras, another unproven concept with tons of evidence against it, proves anything let alone...gah!.... (OK here I will demonstrate a kind of "devil's advocacy")... Let's assume for the sake of this argument that chakras are real, that some form of energy can actually be measured that seems to fit the definition. Even if that were so how would that prove something happened almost 14,000,000,000 years ago and OUTSIDE our SpaceTime?

@enorbet @jamison
Stop avoiding and bypassing. I have yet see any forum bullies disproove stuff like Coral Castle and other similar creation author ideas. I updated signature.