The Faith & Religion mega Thread

Originally Posted by Arcane Almost didn't notice this - quoted again so you won't delete it. Ok now please answer me this extra question(using that brain) - If God is He then how come all life comes from She-type creatures or at least combined from both? This is just something fake. Read this also and think about it. Conclusion is simple: *If* God exists then God has to be either combined element from both He and She or just She.

First of all note: God is our creator, neither father nor mother.

We human beings and animals has masculine or feminine characteristics. Even some creatures has both. God does not fall in this category. He is not male nor female, nor both. This applies to we creatures, not to Him.

So you may ask why we call "him".
Our nature is to whatever around us tie them with masculine or feminine character even if they are not living creatures. Well this depend on language and society as well. In my native language we call bus as feminine while truck as masculine.

We refer God as "He", probably its just our language restriction. I dont think calling God she or it will have any issue. But it will just look awkward. Power is one quality which is generally associated with masculine. And we know God is super natural power. It could be also one of reason calling him He, not She or It.

Life comes from she with the help of He, this is the mechanism God created. He could have made it reverse also. And I assume no one has problem with this mechanism.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli For him all human being are same does not matter which religion one follow.

Contradicts with:

The biggest sin is to associate anyone with GOD and pray someone else instead of GOD. For that there will be no God mercy.

Also,

The biggest difference between Islam and Christian is Islam says Jesus was Prophet not a God nor son of God.

That Jesus is the son of god is not only what Christianity says, it is written in the Bible. According to your own words, that the Bible is an earlier book given to mankind from your god, this implicates that in one of this books, either the Bible or the Qur'an, your god is either lying or plain wrong. Or it is still the same I have also written in an earlier post (still unanswered from you): It seems that the almighty all-knowing god, creator of the whole universe and of all in it, including all life-forms and mankind, is not able to speak to his creations in a simple and understandable way.

I mean here, God created all of us. If one get born in family following religion X, its not his fault. God will not hold him for that. But after he get his maturity, to whom he prays, how he behaves that matters. Bases on all his deeds he will be part of hell or heaven.

Bible is also word of God. But if it tempered how come we can say that as pure word of God? Its well known that today's bible what people refer has been changed by human beings for their own interest. Get a original copy of Bible and check in that if Jesus has ever said himself as Son of God and he asked his followers to pray him not God.

God has awarded us holy books, He sent us the messengers. What more we need?

Originally Posted by ShaanAli First of all note: God is our creator, neither father nor mother.{...}

Do you even try to read posts before reply? Ok w|e. Proove it then. Also how do you know that it is he? You have been in contact with "him"? Some posts ago i gave material where even Quran was mentioned saying most powerfull God is She not He. Again - if you want to proove something then show evidence because like it or not science CAN be trusted.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRLR9jhP_DM

{...}He could have made it reverse also.{...}

Was this joke? You are again doubting your own belief..it is lame to argue with believer who doesn't even believe in his|her own belief system. Maybe YOU are Trickster? That would explain your behaviour.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli {...}God has awarded us holy books, He sent us the messengers. What more we need?

How about some modern day proof evidence? Afterall if God knew about "Judgement day" then he should understand that people in nowadays will lack any valid proof about God's existance.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli I mean here, God created all of us. If one get born in family following religion X, its not his fault. God will not hold him for that. But after he get his maturity, to whom he prays, how he behaves that matters. Bases on all his deeds he will be part of hell or heaven.

OK, so if I were born as a native Papuan in the 13th century, when they weren't known to the rest of the world, and I worshiped the gods of my clan (remember that your god somehow has forgotten to send a messenger to them), and I followed the rules of my clan (which in some cases even included to eat people from a different clan), then I go to hell, because I have not chosen to live according to rules from a god I never knew or because I have chosen to live according to rules of morality that were part of my society?
Or imagine I was a Mayan priest, worshiping Mayan gods and sacrificing humans. Somehow your god also forget to send messengers to them.
Seems to me that your god was somehow influenced to send his messengers all to only one small region of the whole planet, without giving them the possibilities to reach every one on earth. That sounds either like a nasty god, or he is not so almighty as he says.
This is a flawed system, and you know that, don't you?

Originally Posted by TobiSGD OK, so if I were born as a native Papuan in the 13th century, when they weren't known to the rest of the world, and I worshiped the gods of my clan (remember that your god somehow has forgotten to send a messenger to them), and I followed the rules of my clan (which in some cases even included to eat people from a different clan), then I go to hell, because I have not chosen to live according to rules from a god I never knew or because I have chosen to live according to rules of morality that were part of my society? Or imagine I was a Mayan priest, worshiping Mayan gods and sacrificing humans. Somehow your god also forget to send messengers to them. Seems to me that your god was somehow influenced to send his messengers all to only one small region of the whole planet, without giving them the possibilities to reach every one on earth. That sounds either like a nasty god, or he is not so almighty as he says. This is a flawed system, and you know that, don't you?

If you never heard about the God, you always been in a place not interacted with anyone. You dont know what is God. I believe you will be part of his mercy. You should be pardoned, since you made no mistake knowingly.

But even if God's word reach you or not and you were not a good human being. You used to cheat other people and kill them, I doubt you will get mercy.

This is as per my knowledge. Allah knows best.

God has sent message along with messenger to each and every part of planet. This is our knowledge which got restricted to only few which make you think they came only to few limited places.

There is nothing lime my God or your God. God is one.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli I mean here, God created all of us.

No. Even if there were a god responsible for creation of life, last N (roughly 2500) generations were not created by that god, but were born by their parents. Giving credit for that to a god would be incorrect.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli What more we need?

If there is a god you're talking about then it should simply leave humanity alone. It is unreasonable for a parent to control child's life forever, and it is also unreasonable for a god to control fate of humanity forever. Expecting people to worship it for a deed that happened thousands of years ago is also unreasonable, because omnipotent allmighty deity should be able to create another world to play with. I do not want anything to interfere with my life, I have my own brain and I want to make my own decisions. Shall the god take a hostile action towards me or my family, then it should be taken care of.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli Allah knows best.

"Like lambs to the slaughter".
According to my life experience, a person who claims "to know the best" most likely should not be trusted. You should not trust everything blindly.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli God is one.

There were many polytheistic religions BEFORE islam. How do you know that there is no Zeus, for example? Greek's mythology is older than yours.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli But even if God's word reach you or not and you were not a good human being. You used to cheat other people and kill them, I doubt you will get mercy.

That is the flaw in your believe. For a Mayan preacher it was demanded by his gods to sacrifice humans to becalm them when there was for example a meagerness. That wasn't a bad thing for them, for your morality system it is. It was also not a bad thing to eat beaten opponents in a war between clans of Papuans. In your morality system it is.

God has sent message along with messenger to each and every part of planet. This is our knowledge which got restricted to only few which make you think they came only to few limited places.

Sorry, but that is only an assumption, you have not a single evidence for that.

There is nothing lime my God or your God. God is one.

As also stated before, you can believe this only to be true for the few monotheistic religions out there. Remember that most religions on this planet are not monotheistic. For the followers of this religions (that can't be proven wrong or right, like your religion) there is no one god.

Originally Posted by Arcane Do you even try to read posts before reply? Ok w|e. Proove it then. Also how do you know that it is he? You have been in contact with "him"?

Unfortunately science is not that matured today to prove that. You need to wait.

Some posts ago i gave material where even Quran was mentioned saying most powerfull God is She not He. Again - if you want to proove something then show evidence because like it or not science CAN be trusted. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRLR9jhP_DM

Perhaps I miss that, Can you guide me that again plz.

Was this joke? You are again doubting your own belief..it is lame to argue with believer who doesn't even believe in his|her own belief system. Maybe YOU are Trickster? That would explain your behaviour. How about some modern day proof evidence? Afterall if God knew about "Judgement day" then he should understand that people in nowadays will lack any valid proof about God's existance.

I have no doubt on my faith.

God created us. This is as per his wish. He wanted women to give birth and raise child and take care of the family. So He created women with that nature. He could have designed something different also. But this would be the best thats why he created us this way.

You will have doubts about his existence, I dont, 4000 millions living people dont. If your eyes are closes, does not mean everybody eyes are closed.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli You will have doubts about his existence, I dont, 4000 millions living people dont. If your eyes are closes, does not mean everybody eyes are closed.

Millions and billions of people can be wrong. Number of followers is meaningless. Even if entire planet shared your belief that wouldn't automatically mean that you're right.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli Unfortunately science is not that matured today to prove that. You need to wait.

Your arguments are inconsistent with your own beliefs, plus you're ignoring arguments provided by your opponents. One more argument like that and I'll have to disregard you as a troll pretending to be a muslim. Also, your religion is old enough, and should already have answers to all questions your opponents might want to ask.

Originally Posted by SigTerm No. Even if there were a god responsible for creation of life, last N (roughly 2500) generations were not created by that god, but were born by their parents. Giving credit for that to a god would be incorrect.

This is what you think. Have a look at few websites showing how baby get born in his mother womb. This is a natural process but very complex. There is no way it can happen without any support. Science tried to intervene in between. It got succeed producing Dolly sheep but in womb, not in lab.

Science has no answer yet what is soul. We all know there is a soul with every living body.

If there is a god you're talking about then it should simply leave humanity alone. It is unreasonable for a parent to control child's life forever, and it is also unreasonable for a god to control fate of humanity forever. Expecting people to worship it for a deed that happened thousands of years ago is also unreasonable, because omnipotent allmighty deity should be able to create another world to play with. I do not want anything to interfere with my life, I have my own brain and I want to make my own decisions. Shall the god take a hostile action towards me or my family, then it should be taken care of.

Parents dont control life of their children forever. They initially teach them how to live, behave in this world. Later they monitor them and whenever child make mistake they coach them. but when child grow up, they leave their parents alone. Make their separate family. Start staying alone leaving their old parents alone dying.

You can not compare God to Parents. God does not need us in return. Instead we need him always. He created us. It will be foolish to ask him to leave us.

He created us with a reason. Life is a challenge, full of sins. He let know us what is good or bad, correct or wrong. He gave us capability to analyze, think and choose.
Indeed he knows what our next action will be, but he left us to take decision of our own. So that we will be soley responsible for our actions. We may not be able to make him responsible for our actions.
We are not responsible for whatever happened 1000 years before, or ever whatever done by our relatives. Everybody is responsible for his own deeds.

"Like lambs to the slaughter". According to my life experience, a person who claims "to know the best" most likely should not be trusted. You should not trust everything blindly.

God is not a person.

and believe me, we (muslims) dont trust blindly. This is all you are saying because you didnt read the Quran. Unfortunately full book cant be copy paste here, and partial statements wont help much.

Peolpe need proof. But not everything can be proved today. However there are several like Quran explained each and everything what happens in womb, it also said that moon light is not its own, it also said all moon and earth are rotating. like that there are many. If one read Quran, will realize it can not be written by any human being.

There were many polytheistic religions BEFORE islam. How do you know that there is no Zeus, for example? Greek's mythology is older than yours.

I dont carry information of Zeus.

My logic and my belief says to me that God is one. I am not saying that because its written in Quran. Somewhere inside me I feel that, God is just one. I feel that may be because I belongs to country where everything (almost everything) considered as God and being prayed. I don't want to mention but even human private parts also being prayed.

Originally Posted by TobiSGD That is the flaw in your believe. For a Mayan preacher it was demanded by his gods to sacrifice humans to becalm them when there was for example a meagerness. That wasn't a bad thing for them, for your morality system it is. It was also not a bad thing to eat beaten opponents in a war between clans of Papuans. In your morality system it is.

When its not applicable now so why dont we leave that God to decide for those people. God will not do injustice for sure.

Sorry, but that is only an assumption, you have not a single evidence for that.

You can call it assumption. I said what God mentioned in my holy book. If anyone has doubt, he may argue with God when his turn comes. :P

Living in today's world tell me if any place left out where human beings are leaving and they dont know about God's word.

As also stated before, you can believe this only to be true for the few monotheistic religions out there. Remember that most religions on this planet are not monotheistic. For the followers of this religions (that can't be proven wrong or right, like your religion) there is no one god.

I have personally no problem what other people following and to whom they are praying. They have full rights, freedom of religion. But people should know whom they are praying to.

Originally Posted by SigTerm Millions and billions of people can be wrong. Number of followers is meaningless. Even if entire planet shared your belief that wouldn't automatically mean that you're right.

Agree but a big number of people cant be made fool by one book, one human being and that too after 1500 years. Isn't?

Your arguments are inconsistent with your own beliefs, plus you're ignoring arguments provided by your opponents. One more argument like that and I'll have to disregard you as a troll pretending to be a muslim. Also, your religion is old enough, and should already have answers to all questions your opponents might want to ask.

There is no opponent here, there is no game here. We all are brothers. So no offense in any regards.

If people ask for something which can not be full filled, what can I do? Not everything can be proved. Religion is capable to answer, but there are no proofs. My book says God created Earth and moon and all planets. How do anyone prove that? Science is with books, but there are sometimes contradictions. like Evolution.

Same way I am asking for evolution proofs with my friends here, there is no one convincing so far. Everyone is just making theories based on assumptions.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli Unfortunately science is not that matured today to prove that. You need to wait.{...}

WTF? Ok. How long then? If you can't answer this then your statement is lie.

{...}Perhaps I miss that, Can you guide me that again plz.{...}

See? You don't even care to read and understand discussion. There is option to search in thread and there is option to manually browse through pages. Seems like you really are troll because you even said word "plz".

{...}I have no doubt on my faith.{...}

So are other religion believers saying. You are not superior because of that. If you are - proove it and we will believe and some will apologize even but untill then don't expect blindness acceptance from others.

{...}I dont carry information of Zeus. My logic and my belief says to me that God is one. I am not saying that because its written in Quran. Somewhere inside me I feel that, God is just one. I feel that may be because I belongs to country where everything (almost everything) considered as God and being prayed. I don't want to mention but even human private parts also being prayed.

Then why are you trying to proove your God is better then others? Others actually "feel" there is some other God not your so what? What if some religion even today believes in many Gods and "feels" it? They are wrong? but they have same support base as you have - faith without science evidence but with written text piece.

Agree but a big number of people cant be made fool by one book, one human being and that too after 1500 years. Isn't?{...}

Who said it was written by only one person?

{...}How do anyone prove that? Science is with books, but there are sometimes contradictions. like Evolution. Same way I am asking for evolution proofs with my friends here, there is no one convincing so far. Everyone is just making theories based on assumptions.

You won't proove|disproove God by prooving|disprooving Evolution or Aliens or something else...because there is also possibilty that there exists none and there exists all of them. You can only proove God by prooving God. Simple.

Originally Posted by ShaanAli This is what you think. Have a look at few websites showing how baby get born in his mother womb. This is a natural process but very complex. There is no way it can happen without any support. Science tried to intervene in between. It got succeed producing Dolly sheep but in womb, not in lab.

Argument from ignorance. We don't know therefore God. Not very convincing. And anyway, we do know how great complexity can arise through purely natural causes, ie, evolution. (Which, contrary to some previous posts, is not a random process. Natural selection is not random.)

Science has no answer yet what is soul. We all know there is a soul with every living body.

No, we don't all know that. Everything we do know is completely consistent with materialism. There is no need for an immaterial soul hypothesis to explain anything.

Peolpe need proof. But not everything can be proved today. However there are several like Quran explained each and everything what happens in womb, it also said that moon light is not its own, it also said all moon and earth are rotating. like that there are many. If one read Quran, will realize it can not be written by any human being.

It astounds me that people believe this nonsense. There is no unambiguous knowledge in any "holy" book that could not possibly have been known by the people at the time. Ad hoc revisionism of some poetic turn of phrase in an ancient book is not science or knowledge. Do we say because the ancient greeks coined the term atom and conceived of an indivisible unit of nature they have an understanding of modern particle physics? Ridiculous.

Believe whatever nonsense you want, but don't pretend it has any empirical evidence or represents actual facts about the universe.