Incidentally, I recently tried switching Debian sid from systemd to sysvinit. https://wiki.debian.org/Init

The switch succeeded once, and Debian ran with only minor loss of functionality. On a later installation, attempting to switch failed. The developers don't prioritize keeping alternate init systems working.
Ed

So what do you propose is the way forward?

Now that the Microsoft brand is on systemd, will it change the code at all? It will continue to be developed out in the open, no?

Does the new branding suddenly change the nature of it?

All of that aside, what is it that makes this particular Open Source project unforkable? If it were forked, it certainly wouldn't be the first time in history that a project has been forked away from it's lead developer.

"Screw you guys, I'm going home." Lennart Poettering, probably... So let's play without him. He left us with the bat and ball... What's stopping us?
Yes, yes, but the point is that if they want to transition away there is nothing stopping them. It might take some time and effort, but is certainly not impossible.

OpenSSH doesn't have a hard dependency on systemd. It will easily compile and run on a system which doesn't have systemd.

Obviously, there would need to be some concessions made, but for the most part removing systemd is doable. Projects like GNOME which have hard dependencies will have to change or fall by the wayside, but that's their own stupid fault, isn't it? The KDE developers seem to have played the game a bit smarter in that regard.

I am extremely and eternally grateful for the approach taken by Patrick Volkerding with Slackware. If not for him, I'd have switched away from Linux a long time ago.

We certainly are in interesting times, eh?

Well hopefully this wakes them up.

I tend to agree with rkelsen. And I think some persons are reading far too much into this.

Sure, Poettering developed Pulse Audio, but he hasn't been involved with it for some time and it soldiers on. That Poettering has taken a job with MS does not mean ipso facto that Microsoft is taking over SystemD. Caution and watchfulness is certainly in order, but panic is not.

We still have no proof of that?

I've seen nothing to suggest this is based on more than Michael Larabel talking to unidentified people on Twitter:
We don't yet know if those people are staff at Microsoft who have seen Lennart in their offices, or just random people performing a hoax.

It's being replaced with PipeWire now, isn't it?

PipeWire Is Still On Track For One Day Being A Drop-In Replacement To PulseAudio (2018)

Still no proof. I've wasted some time trying to chase down a second source but although there are many dozens of articles on the topic, they all point back to Phoronix. Nothing in the comments either there or elsewhere I checked. Michael has been reliable in the past, but this is big enough news that a scoop like that needs verification.

Once it is verified or debunked more serious discussion and planning can / must occur.

There's a Twitter thread where Lennart reacts to someone posting a blog link about it, suggesting he's aware of the situation, but has neither confirmed nor denied anything.

https://nitter.net/pid_eins/status/1545341952106840064

(Apart from the final one they are auto-translated, with a handful of tweaks, so feedback/corrections from any fluent German speakers welcome.)

Where there's smoke there's fire.

The pig certainly seems to be enjoying the wrestle so far.

Or a smoke machine, or dry ice, or liquid nitrogen, or ...


Anyhow, what I didn't see earlier was the previous message by Christian Brauner - as in the guy on the Linux Foundation Technical Advisory Board who is also a senior software engineer at Microsoft - which says:
So that seems fairly conclusive.

That message was posted a day after the Phoronix article, but an earlier allusion was posted a day before, so I guess Christian was Michael Larabel's source, or at the least aware the article was going to be published.

Actually, none of those output smoke... It's probably best described as steam or vapour in all 3 of those examples.

Now, if you had said, "the electrics in an English-made car," you would have had no argument from me. They certainly are a good source of smoke.

Anyhow in this case, as in most cases, the smoke lead to fire, didn't it?

I solved the problem by switching that machine to Slackware.

(Ducks before the distro wars break out).
Ed

Huh? I would be surprised if the electrics in any European vehicles were from anywhere other than East Asia.

I've no idea what relevance that might have to any part of this thread.


Stating that smoke is produced by fire is a tautology which contributes nothing.

Someone thinking they've seen smoke doesn't automatically mean it is smoke - an appropriate degree of verification should be performed before calling the fire brigade.

Similarly, the veracity of rumours should be established before spreading them or reacting excessively.

That should be standard practice for any source, but when a claim comes from Michael Larabel, independent verification is even more important. Why? Because:
There was no such release, not in that calendar year, nor since. (The "proof" he saw may have been Hearthstone, Blizzard's first Android release, in Dec 2014.)

Blizzard games do not support Linux-based Operating Systems, and there are no plans to change that.

If you see a white cloud emitting from Michael Larabel, it could easily be steam or vapour...

Now that Microsoft owns Debian, I wonder if they'll rename it?

Next version - Debian Clippy?