LinuxQuestions.org
Welcome to the most active Linux Forum on the web.
Go Back   LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Non-*NIX Forums > General
User Name
Password
General This forum is for non-technical general discussion which can include both Linux and non-Linux topics. Have fun!

Notices


View Poll Results: Do you want a Linux with an Interview Style Install and Setup?
I'm a newbie/novice and Yes, I love that idea. thats just what Linux needs. 906 53.83%
I'm an occassional user, I don't care either way. 222 13.19%
I'm an experience/hardcore user and I don't need it to be any easier. I am happy with it the way it is. 555 32.98%
Voters: 1683. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
  Search this Thread
Old 03-15-2005, 04:36 PM   #1951
amosf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jun 2004
Location: Australia
Distribution: Mandriva/Slack - KDE
Posts: 1,672

Rep: Reputation: 46

Yes, I should have stuck with my original 'yawn' rather than get goaded into yet another pointless discussion about naming conventions...

To bring it back to topic, the move to gui OS tools and turning linux into a gui based OS is an important step in making linux easy for all. MS, with all it's faults, at least knows that in today's world the majority of users want a nice easy gui way to do everything. Even experienced users want that. At this stage linux also has CLI tools to do most things as well, although a point will come, and has come to some extent, where some things will only be done in the gui. That will annoy some traditional users, but it's the way things will be...

So part of the 'ease of use' is creating a full gui OS, and I think we now have it with Mandrake and Suse and such. Only a few weak areas like samba config, perhaps...

(edit - oops tink, I didn't even notice what this thread was til today, I thought it was a separate thread. I just was just getting the email notes and clicking... I'll take a bit more time to note where I am next time...)

Last edited by amosf; 03-15-2005 at 04:45 PM.
 
Old 03-15-2005, 05:20 PM   #1952
Starch
Member
 
Registered: Jan 2005
Posts: 77

Rep: Reputation: 15
If more people will move to Linux, more companies will make products for their costumers with Linux support and will mostlikely make their products easier to use/install on Linux.

[Sorry if this is already said, this thread is 131 pages, I didn't read every post]
 
Old 03-15-2005, 06:41 PM   #1953
Tinkster
Moderator
 
Registered: Apr 2002
Location: in a fallen world
Distribution: slackware by choice, others too :} ... android.
Posts: 23,067
Blog Entries: 11

Rep: Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914
Quote:
Originally posted by amosf
At this stage linux also has CLI tools to do most things as
well, although a point will come, and has come to some
extent, where some things will only be done in the gui.
That will annoy some traditional users, but it's the way
things will be...
I honestly hope and pray that this will NEVER happen,
and if it did I'd be one of the "annoyed traditional users"
and it might be time to move on to BSD ;) ... as soon as
they tie Gnome or anything to the kernel I'm out of the
linux-wagon ...


Quote:
MS, with all it's faults, at least knows that in today's world
the majority of users want a nice easy gui way to do everything.
I still believe that catering to "global lazieness" is not the
"right thing" to do, and I would rather have people
understand things than believing they know how they
can drive a computer. But I keep repeating myself ;)


Cheers,
Tink
 
Old 03-15-2005, 11:18 PM   #1954
amosf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jun 2004
Location: Australia
Distribution: Mandriva/Slack - KDE
Posts: 1,672

Rep: Reputation: 46
Quote:
Originally posted by Tinkster
I honestly hope and pray that this will NEVER happen,
and if it did I'd be one of the "annoyed traditional users"
and it might be time to move on to BSD ... as soon as
they tie Gnome or anything to the kernel I'm out of the
linux-wagon ...
I know what you mean and I'm also in the traditional heap. I don't suppose we will ever lose the existing tools, but I think certain tools will become more gui oriented than others - like partition resizing or whatever (That's just an example since we still have gui and cli tools for that now). I think the gui will be a shell with linux for a while yet, it's just that it's likely that people will concentrate on the gui tools and neglect the cli tools. Mandrake and KDE, for example, do a good job of hiding the inner workings of the OS from the user, so I don't think we need to see the tight integration that MS uses with windows. This gives the gui OS that windows converts expect, but still give the power users full control from cli... That's the best of both worlds, I just don't know if it's going to continue that way. I think that will depend on who is doing the development work ...
 
Old 03-15-2005, 11:34 PM   #1955
ahh
Member
 
Registered: May 2004
Location: UK
Distribution: Gentoo
Posts: 293

Rep: Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally posted by amosf
Yes, I should have stuck with my original 'yawn' rather than get goaded into yet another pointless discussion about naming conventions...
Cheap shot. It wasn't about naming conventions. Good luck trying to run your pc with just a kernel...
 
Old 03-16-2005, 07:04 AM   #1956
JZL240I-U
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Germany
Distribution: openSuSE Tumbleweed-KDE, Mint 18.3+19.3, MX-18, Mandrake
Posts: 4,387

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Quote:
Originally posted by Tinkster
...But I keep repeating myself
Nooo. Really, Tink? In this short thread?

 
Old 03-16-2005, 11:16 AM   #1957
Tinkster
Moderator
 
Registered: Apr 2002
Location: in a fallen world
Distribution: slackware by choice, others too :} ... android.
Posts: 23,067
Blog Entries: 11

Rep: Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914
The bloody thing just won't die, eh?
 
Old 03-21-2005, 06:27 AM   #1958
JZL240I-U
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2003
Location: Germany
Distribution: openSuSE Tumbleweed-KDE, Mint 18.3+19.3, MX-18, Mandrake
Posts: 4,387

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Quote:
Originally posted by Tinkster
The bloody thing just won't die, eh?
Ahm, aren't you one of those powerful ones with the ability to apply lock and key even to this thread? aka moderators ? Perhaps it'd be something like the coup de grāce .
 
Old 03-21-2005, 10:01 AM   #1959
green_squirrel
LQ Newbie
 
Registered: Nov 2004
Location: wyoming
Distribution: fc3
Posts: 7

Rep: Reputation: 0
It was not until the MS version of Windows came out that computers became popular in most households.

Same with the Internet. Few people used the Internet with text only. It was probably about 6 months or a year after the Internet became available that Mosaic and Netscape hit the market as Graphical Web Browsers. After that, the Internet took off. MS Internet Explorer came out about a year after them.

You can complain all that you want about people being lazy and wanting everything easy in a GUI. The fact is that most people have other things in life that is important to them. The computer is simply a tool used like a car is used for going to work or play. (My brother refers to computers such as a hammer, and sometimes thinks that is the tool that it needs. He has used and written programs on UNIX systems since the 1970's and hates it.) Most people simply do not have the time to learn everythiing about an operating system.

And with Linux, no one seems to know everything. I refer to it like a game. There is always something new that requires lots of time which I don't have. The same applies to MS systems.
 
Old 03-21-2005, 12:13 PM   #1960
Salpula
Member
 
Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Distribution: FC3 i386 & PPC
Posts: 36

Rep: Reputation: 15
most stuff that needs to be in a gui for the "average user" already is. Linux. . . is already easy enough for the general population, most people are just too scared to use it. I taught my girlfriend how to use gnome to use my fedora server to watch TV(using tvtime), go on AIM, bring up firefox do some typing. For the most part its VERY easy. . . even installs such as Ubuntu make it difficult for a user to fuck up and the default install of Ubuntu for my ibook was fully functional on first boot. The widespread availability of Live CDs make it even easier for the average user to get familiar with linix since they don't even need to remove windows or attempt paritioning/dualboot setups before they are ready. I have ordered 10 ubuntu lives cds paired with install cds to handout to friends/coworkers who have expressed interest in linux but have also expressed concern over dumping windows. These are people who see me using linux all the time and not fighting popups/adware, freaking out about viruses, or wondering everytime I open my mail program if there is a new virus circulating like wildfire. They also see that the everyday office, web, and communications programs have a familiar look and feel paired with similar functionality.

The problem? If you look around at the distros they all have this peice or that peice of what each distro should be having now. But no one is really to that point where they offer complete ease of use for the average user without stifling your command prompt addicts. Frankely I like a combo of both
 
Old 03-21-2005, 04:05 PM   #1961
amosf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jun 2004
Location: Australia
Distribution: Mandriva/Slack - KDE
Posts: 1,672

Rep: Reputation: 46
[QUOTE]Originally posted by green_squirrel
It was not until the MS version of Windows came out that computers became popular in most households.

Same with the Internet. Few people used the Internet with text only. It was probably about 6 months or a year after the Internet became available that Mosaic and Netscape hit the market as Graphical Web Browsers. After that, the Internet took off. MS Internet Explorer came out about a year after them.


Yes, but MS rode the wave rather than created it. Many people (like myself) had hobby PC's long before windows and even before MS, but the hardware was limitted - ie not enough ram for a page of text. As hardware became better and cheaper, PC's became more useful. And there were other gui systems beside windows. The mac had one and DR had GEM which was just as likely to be the desktop today except the the head of DR was out flying his plane (and DR was undercut with some shadey deal from MS after they practically stole QDOS). Unix also was covered with the superior client/server window system.

And as for the internet. MS ignored that for quite some time and it was left to others to develope - trumpet, mosaic, netscape, etc. Then MS finally saw what it was about and took over as usual using their monopoly position they had developed...

In the end MS was luckily positioned with the right hardware at the start (the IBM PC) and it happened to be the PC that took off. MS was established in that position with DOS way before windows, so they defaulted to the desktop GUI when PC's were powerfull enough. One good/bad thing is that MS initially became popular by piracy of the early OS and this has stuck with people and they still prefer to pirate the OS rather than buy it... Hard to break old habits I guess...
 
Old 03-21-2005, 04:25 PM   #1962
Salpula
Member
 
Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Distribution: FC3 i386 & PPC
Posts: 36

Rep: Reputation: 15
Quote:
Originally posted by amosf
One good/bad thing is that MS initially became popular by piracy of the early OS and this has stuck with people and they still prefer to pirate the OS rather than buy it... Hard to break old habits I guess...
The only time I ever shelled out money for an MS operating system was the Windows 3.11 for workgroups that came with my pentium 60 from gateway and the windows 98 that came with a gateway I purchased some years later. . . and those are the two that I have probably used the least :-p
 
Old 04-06-2005, 06:02 AM   #1963
allforcarrie
Member
 
Registered: Sep 2004
Distribution: Ubuntu
Posts: 157

Rep: Reputation: 30
Quote:
Originally posted by Starch
If more people will move to Linux, more companies will make products for their costumers with Linux support and will mostlikely make their products easier to use/install on Linux.

[Sorry if this is already said, this thread is 131 pages, I didn't read every post]

It is already happening to firefox, people are accepting it with its whole 6% of the market.
 
Old 04-06-2005, 07:18 AM   #1964
jamyskis
Member
 
Registered: Jan 2004
Location: Paderborn, Germany
Distribution: SuSE 10.0, Ubuntu 5.10
Posts: 56

Rep: Reputation: 15
I've taught my gf also to use Linux to a degree (we have SuSE 9.1 Pro) and she can now log in, surf the net, type up her reports, send e-mails and play some games. She can even install an RPM she finds on the net directly (though I've warned her off entering the root password unless I'm there for obvious reasons) and run it (usually games!)

We have two computers, one with Windows with loads and loads of souped-hardware mainly for games and one with SuSE 9.1 Pro which is equipped well enough to do work and play most recent-ish games. I don't think I need to say which one is playing up 9 times out of 10 when she phones me at work with a problem
 
Old 04-06-2005, 07:46 PM   #1965
Tinkster
Moderator
 
Registered: Apr 2002
Location: in a fallen world
Distribution: slackware by choice, others too :} ... android.
Posts: 23,067
Blog Entries: 11

Rep: Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914Reputation: 914
/me shivers ....


I just upgraded my desktop at work from w2k to
eXPeriment ... after the installation the thing new
NOTHING about the VGA controller, the sound-
card or the Network interface ... and the box is
more than two years old.

Knoppix for instance picked up ALL hardware
immediately ...

So much for people crying for Linux to me more
like windows; I for sure am glad it isn't anything
like it, otherwise the thing would have been un-
usable ;)


Cheers,
Tink
 
  


Closed Thread

Tags
cups, guide


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
General question while running make "make[2]: *** [main.o] Error 1" matazar42 Linux - Software 3 08-15-2005 12:39 PM
Ethic Question:Do we have an obligation to make our technology easier djgerbavore General 18 03-04-2005 12:10 AM
Make linux easier? bolinux General 43 10-20-2003 10:22 PM
General commands to make an ISO mrsolo Linux - Software 7 10-10-2003 12:42 AM
LQ Population X11 General 32 04-17-2002 09:01 PM

LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Non-*NIX Forums > General

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:06 PM.

Main Menu
Advertisement
My LQ
Write for LQ
LinuxQuestions.org is looking for people interested in writing Editorials, Articles, Reviews, and more. If you'd like to contribute content, let us know.
Main Menu
Syndicate
RSS1  Latest Threads
RSS1  LQ News
Twitter: @linuxquestions
Open Source Consulting | Domain Registration