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Old 05-29-2022, 09:57 AM   #1
enorbet
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LHC 3.0 to use GPUs to Increase Speed/Precision of Data


I'd like to know how many of what sort of GPUs will be used but LHC is starting to collide particles after a 3 year hiatus for upgrades. It sports a "small" but quite substantial power upgrade to 13.6 Trillion EV which in itself is something of a game-changer but the major improvements are in sensors and data processing power.

There are several results from different colliders that challenge the current Standard Model and increased precision and power could very much help to narrow results and provide some consistency, not only in New Physics, but also refine and solidify previous results like with Higgs.

Attached is an interesting overview explanation of some of these anomalies from Nature.

EDIT: Here is url for source https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-01388-6
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Last edited by enorbet; 05-29-2022 at 02:52 PM.
 
Old 05-31-2022, 12:25 PM   #2
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Why not ask them? You're asking what some faceless engineer somewhere specified. I think you can take it he's not subscribed to LQ.
 
Old 05-31-2022, 12:43 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by business_kid View Post
Why not ask them? You're asking what some faceless engineer somewhere specified. I think you can take it he's not subscribed to LQ.
Why not? I work at Belle, but I have some colleagues working at LHC detectors, so I might ask them.
 
Old 05-31-2022, 01:24 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by enorbet View Post
Attached is an interesting overview explanation of some of these anomalies from Nature.

EDIT: Here is url for source https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-022-01388-6
I personally dislike BSM searches. First of all, from your link, the last CDF II result looks unreasonably precise in comparison with the previous ones, and it seems they underestimated the systematic uncertainties. As for the B -> K* ll ratio, it requires much more studies, and not just from LHCb (and it seems now the only player on this field is LHCb).

It might be interesting to look at muon g-2, but when we will get new results from the Novosibirsk group isn't clear due to the war, and w/o experimental data in low energy QCD one can't predict the muon g-2 precise enough to compete with Fermilab.

I think in the end the meson and baryon spectroscopy is much more fun to study, but unfortunately it's too boring for journalist to write about old good QCD.
 
Old 06-02-2022, 12:04 AM   #5
enorbet
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Thank you for your responses, tauon. Is your dislike of BSM searches personal preference relating to your field of study? It is my understanding that both Atlas and CSM should benefit greatly and possibly provide valuable new data for heavy bosons, squarks and gluinos, and even possibly dark matter candidates. Unfortunately I know next to nothing on meson spectroscopy. As for baryon spectroscopy are you referring specifically to "light" baryons? Is there considerable hope for new Physics in that field? or just due diligence at "covering all the bases"?

I hope you don't mind my ignorant inquiries. I'm not a Physicist, just an EE with a hobbyist fascination with Physics. I'd estimate I grasped less than half of Lee Smolin's Quantunm Gravity books.
 
Old 06-10-2022, 11:15 PM   #6
enorbet
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This is just a test that has zero to do with my thread. This just seems a convenient location for the test.


Quote:
Originally Posted by blocked post
Thanks for the links, leclerc78.They are good examples of the defining difference between Myth and Science. Once Myths congeal into a complete popular story they rarely, if ever change. They are static and stagnant.They are static and stagnant.Science, is not a static conclusion.Science is an ever changing, ever refined process of discovering what is real.It is only the language of Science, Mathematics, that never changes, and it never changes because it is based on the most fundamental identity like "A" equals "A" or 1 equals 1. That can never change.
The test worked... sort of. Apparently I can type "A equals A" but I can't replace the word "equals" with an equals character.

Last edited by enorbet; 06-10-2022 at 11:23 PM.
 
Old 06-16-2022, 12:45 PM   #7
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Thank you for your responses, tauon. Is your dislike of BSM searches personal preference relating to your field of study?
Yes, but I first decided what is interesting to me and then started my PhD. Interest comes first, and the reason why I'm interested more in spectroscopy is because so many young people find particle physics is disappointing to them they just quit to whatever new shiny thing is popular now on the market. And the reason why they are disappointed is because new physics searches is way more complicated that it was advertised 15 years ago before LHC era.

Quote:
It is my understanding that both Atlas and CSM should benefit greatly and possibly provide valuable new data for heavy bosons, squarks and gluinos, and even possibly dark matter candidates. Unfortunately I know next to nothing on meson spectroscopy. As for baryon spectroscopy are you referring specifically to "light" baryons? Is there considerable hope for new Physics in that field? or just due diligence at "covering all the bases"?
Both Atlas and CMS are built around colliding protons. It's really a mess for studying mesons and baryons, because you have all kinds of strong interaction (initial- and final state etc), so it's much easier to use an existing lepton machine data for these purposes. And yes, light mesons and baryons aren't understood well enough to do precise predictions for NP searches. Meanwhile, heavy mesons and baryons are also interesting to study, and especially multi-quark states such as tetra- and penta- quarks, glueballs, and so on. That's why I think LHCb is maybe the most successful experiment up to date since 2008 in all of the particle physics: proton collisions can produce many rare states which can't be accessed by lepton machines, and they indeed exist, not like dark matter at TeV scale.

Quote:
I hope you don't mind my ignorant inquiries. I'm not a Physicist, just an EE with a hobbyist fascination with Physics. I'd estimate I grasped less than half of Lee Smolin's Quantunm Gravity books.
I can't say that hobbyist questions are ignorant: I experimentally know how extremely difficult it is to get a bit of information about a new particle or interaction, which actually involves a lot of EE as well who are much more intelligent in their subject then physicists. What I might recommend to do in your spare time if you are interested in how experimental particle physics looks like is to try to simulate some processes in colliders (there are many MC generators available as opensource, see for example EVTGEN, Pythia, KKMC, etc), this makes you feel you create your own physics by running them.
 
Old 06-17-2022, 12:21 AM   #8
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OOOooh! I smell a project! Thank you tauon. Do you ever visit physicsforums.com? Great website with a wide variety of interesting people from students to very serious pros, covering a wide range of specifics in subsections.
 
Old 06-17-2022, 03:31 AM   #9
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OOOooh! I smell a project!
Oh yes. Are you interested in some specific phenomenon in particle physics?

Quote:
Thank you tauon. Do you ever visit physicsforums.com? Great website with a wide variety of interesting people from students to very serious pros, covering a wide range of specifics in subsections.
Thanks, I didn't know about that forum. I found a couple of interesting threads: https://www.physicsforums.com/thread...icted.1014058/ and https://www.physicsforums.com/thread...oment.1015969/
 
Old 06-17-2022, 11:53 AM   #10
enorbet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tauon View Post
Oh yes. Are you interested in some specific phenomenon in particle physics?
My interests at this stage are very basic. Probably the last time I had anything to do with particle physics was in 1st year High School Physics constructing cloud chambers LOL. So I am aware I need to grasp some deeper understanding before I can articulate even to myself what I want to know. It's hard just to grasp "spin" at this point and I'm aware that Fermi, LHC, and a few others have made massive strides rather recently literally game changing strides. It does seem to appear, for example, that Super Symmetry is in rather dire straits. I just want to know more.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tauon View Post
Thanks, I didn't know about that forum. I found a couple of interesting threads: https://www.physicsforums.com/thread...icted.1014058/ and https://www.physicsforums.com/thread...oment.1015969/
It pleases me that in some small way I could return the favor. It is a rather decent message board and I think deserves greater membership. I've been a member there for roughly a decade. I jump around quite a bit as my interests are varied but tend to gravitate toward Astronomy and Cosmology since growing up in the Boomer Era I was facinated with extra planetary exploration and book/movie "October Sky" was very similar to my life but a High School Guidance Counselor influenced me (sadly) to be more practical, thus EE. Before then I had applied to RPI but my financial status made going there impractical.

Anyway, thanks again for the heads up. These days much of my time is on PCs so an application directly employing Physics will be the best kind of fun, a learning experience..
 
Old 06-20-2022, 04:31 AM   #11
tauon
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My interests at this stage are very basic. Probably the last time I had anything to do with particle physics was in 1st year High School Physics constructing cloud chambers LOL.
Actually, that's quite an advanced achievement, in our department in Novosibirsk we didn't build a cloud chamber, and I only built it after my bachelor degree in CERN on one of the tutorials for summer students.

Quote:
So I am aware I need to grasp some deeper understanding before I can articulate even to myself what I want to know. It's hard just to grasp "spin" at this point and I'm aware that Fermi, LHC, and a few others have made massive strides rather recently literally game changing strides. It does seem to appear, for example, that Super Symmetry is in rather dire straits. I just want to know more.
As for Fermilab, the latest results came from g-2 muon and this is quite promising, but if we want to find some kind of new physics there the g-2 muon SM prediction must be accompanied by experiments in low-energy QCD (VEPP-2000, maybe BES and Belle), and this is really hard topic (my colleague Fyodor Ignatov spent more then 10 years analyzing e+e- annihilation to two pions in low energy region, and I'm not sure he has finished it yet).

As for spin stuff, I guess the best way to "feel" it is to simulate decays of some well-known particles and look at the angular distributions of the final state particles. Usually in particle physics people try to study as simple system as possible, thus you can in most cases find only scalar decays (and scalars decay isotropically). Maybe the most sensitive to spin and simple decay is tau -> pi nu_tau, that's just a standard model decay, but it violates parity, so the angular distribution of the final state pion is not trivial (although, tauon spin must be aligned). An EE analogue to this process is just some sort of directional antenna, and those spherical functions appearing in EE to describe directional antenna radiation appear almost everywhere in quantum physics (hydrogen atom, particle decays, etc).

Quote:
It pleases me that in some small way I could return the favor. It is a rather decent message board and I think deserves greater membership. I've been a member there for roughly a decade. I jump around quite a bit as my interests are varied but tend to gravitate toward Astronomy and Cosmology since growing up in the Boomer Era I was facinated with extra planetary exploration and book/movie "October Sky" was very similar to my life but a High School Guidance Counselor influenced me (sadly) to be more practical, thus EE. Before then I had applied to RPI but my financial status made going there impractical.

Anyway, thanks again for the heads up. These days much of my time is on PCs so an application directly employing Physics will be the best kind of fun, a learning experience..
To my mind the best way to run simulations is to take some examples from EvtGen (https://evtgen.hepforge.org/). It requires to install some dependencies first (ROOT for examples, HepMC, TAUOLA, and PHOTOS for the library). I'd like to write Slackbuilds for these packages, but I'm busy right now to do so.
 
  


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