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Old 12-15-2006, 01:22 AM   #1
nymusicman
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How linux users feel about Macs.


Just a curious question. I know that there are a whole bunch of threads on linux vs windows and why we should be using linux over windows etc... and as an "ex" windows user myself (for the most part) I agree linux is far superior. Now to get this straight I've never seriously used mac but it seems with Mac OsX being built on unix I have more respect for the OS.

But I am a little curious how other linux users feel about Macs and their inferiority or their superiority.

For those curious this thread was started because this article raised my curiosity. http://maczealots.com/articles/dark-side/
It seems this author new everything about windows and linux and still for some reason chose Mac.

I just wonder how others feel about or respond to this.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 01:28 AM   #2
Simon Bridge
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I learned to program on the mac classic when it was new. When I worked for PCWorld NZ (IDG Publications)- they did everything on the mac because they were better than PCs!

The mac is an excellent machine, though expensive. The dedication to IP should warn FOSS users off OSX... but linux will run on it.

Thing is, IBM/AT architecture boxes are very cheap - you want a linux box, this is the way to go.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 02:49 AM   #3
mipia
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I love mine. It's an old G4 Powermac with a 867mHz and a gig of ram. I use it most often over any of my other systems with all the pre-press design work Ive been getting lately. I wouldn't trade it for anything. The more I have been using it, the more i start looking at upgrading.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 03:45 AM   #4
oneandoneis2
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They're expensive, but I'm considering buying one for myself at some point.

If nothing else, they did perform one invaluable service: They shut up all the trolls who claimed "Unix-based OSes will never be good desktops, they can only do server stuff." - you used to encounter them all the time, but I've hardly seen any since OS X came out. . .
 
Old 12-15-2006, 09:50 AM   #5
XavierP
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Moved: This thread is more suitable in General and has been moved accordingly to help your thread/question get the exposure it deserves.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 10:25 AM   #6
Jeebizz
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Quote:
Originally posted by oneandoneis2
They shut up all the trolls who claimed "Unix-based OSes will never be good desktops, they can only do server stuff.
True, these are those older die hard macheads up until MacOSX, I know because I have spoken to one of them in my highschool, and clearly they never heard of A/UX before , but my main gripe with macs, is their price range, and now mac zealots can no longer claim that mac is not a pc, well, it is now, since it is on the x86 arch. As far as the OS is concerned, I am impressed. I never found myself saying this. I never liked MacOS itself, but that was also when I myself never heard about or saw A/UX, which is obsolete anyways, but MacOSX made me look twice at the os, but would I buy one? No. Unfortunately Jobs, as far as I'm concerned has his head far up in his own ass to realize that it might actually benefit Apple in releasing MacOS as a licensed copy, not just strictly for the Mac, but right now there is a project to do just that, which is obviously not sanctioned by Apple. Google OSX86 Project. There are many people I have spoken to that want to run Macos, me included, but refuse to pay the absurd price that they ask for when I can build myself a system with that money and it would be even more powerful.

The way I see it. MacOSX is good, but their computers, aren't worth the price.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 10:38 AM   #7
vharishankar
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Quote:
There are many people I have spoken to that want to run Macos, me included, but refuse to pay the absurd price that they ask for when I can build myself a system with that money and it would be even more powerful.
Apple Macs are expensive because it's meant to be an exclusive product. You pay not only for the product but also for the "aura" and the "pride of ownership". Somewhat like dining in an exclusive up-market restaurant... you pay not just for the food, but for the service and ambience as well. They market it for the niche segment, not for the mass-market. And... they want the people in the mass-market to keep aspiring for the product -- looking at it longingly as a thing they would love to own, but doesn't fit into their budget.

They will keep that image so long as I can see. I think they'll only ruin themselves if they step into the Mass Market where the competition is too high and they stand to lose on their reputation as being a premier product. iPods are one thing, but I dare say they will not bring their flagship product, the Macintosh, within range of the common man anywhere in the forseeable future.

Like they say, marketing is not only about product quality, but also about market segments, brand image and exclusivity. I dare say that several "handmade" systems will beat the Mac hollow in performance, but that doesn't have the same "status" as owning a Mac now, does it?

Last edited by vharishankar; 12-15-2006 at 10:42 AM.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 10:46 AM   #8
undeaf
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Well, i have a lot of different feelings about macs.
-I resent them for being the official token opposition to microsoft
-I am wary of how in some ways they practice much greater vendor lock in than microsoft
-I dislike how they grosely inflate the price of the systems not just by gouging but also by forcing overminiaturization on users, tieing the hardware into various strata and preventing users from using spare parts which could be perfectly compatible
-I dislike how they arbitrairily limit customizability, this point ties together very closely with the last. What if I find their systems too loud? What if I'm very concerned about hard drive durability? What if I want a specific type of monitor with a mid range PC, ie. their imacs? What if I live somewhere very hot and very dusty, without air conditioning?
-at least they're not microsoft and if they did become much bigger they wouldn't be as much of a threat to other OS's due to how they try to be a boutique type vendor
-I would like them to be dependant on linux apps
 
Old 12-15-2006, 10:53 AM   #9
vharishankar
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undeaf, precisely! Your points are absolutely valid, and that's exactly why Apple doesn't target you (not speaking personally, but metaphorically) as a customer! They don't want the discerning user conscious about price, interoperability and all that technical jazz!

There are people in this world who don't genuinely give a damn about any of the points you mentioned and they just want a box to work. To them, the Mac is not so much a computer as you and I see it, but more as a single, unified tool much like a television set. And also have the "cool factor" and the pride of "owning a Mac". There is also another set of customers whom they target -- the folk who genuinely love the Mac for its quality and have been loyal to the brand since times immemorial...

So, yes, I agree with you, but Apple will not change their ways because people like us don't like them. They don't target us and are generally blind to the views of the more technically elite *nix community.

Last edited by vharishankar; 12-15-2006 at 10:55 AM.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 11:14 AM   #10
b0uncer
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Macs..well, they have a lot of good things inside, some bad too, but I'd say the inferiority or superiority of Macs depends on what you do. I don't own a Mac personally, but have worked with them, especially with the new os x these days, and have to say that if the "default" Mac keyboard is switched and mouse tweaked a bit (I believe the latter can be done from inside the os, haven't tried yet), it's a very nice packet. Except for it's price. But I guess if somebody had money, it would be The Choice. You'll get all the expensive software like Office on it too, so you don't have to worry about not having your Windows around just because your boss uses it.

If I worked somewhere where I'd deal with images, audio, video, ...well basically anything and had a lot of money and had a lot of customers using either macs or windows machines, I'd pick up a mac. There is no reason, except for the money, not to pick it up.

Though, personally I like to advernture, and I don't like to pay (at least much) for it -- therefore I consider Linux equally good with any Mac. Windows is good in some cases too, but not everywhere.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 11:53 AM   #11
matthewg42
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My G3 iBook now runs Ubuntu and is my print/file server It was a nice machine. OS X was mediocre, although it was a very early version (10.1). It got to the stage where nothing would install on it because it didn't have the frameworks which were introduced in 10.2. At that point I decided spending £125 to upgrade was simply a waste of money, so I nuked it and introduced Tux to my PPC CPU.

The hardware is nice looking. Some nice touches like the throbbing sleep indicator, but it wasn't so robust. The LEDs in the charging cable went bad after just a few months, and the power supply died completely just after it fell out of warranty, which was annoying because the replacement was horribly expensive. Now the screen hinge is very dodgy - the backlight goes off and you have to fiddle with the hinge for ages to get it back. It had a lot of use but it was hugely over-priced.

I brought the machine when I moved abroad on contract work, and used it as my only machine for two years. When I got the machine it came with a mac.com email account which claimed to be "free for life". After a year of that Apple invoked the "we can change the terms and conditions of service on a whim" clause and it because a subscription account, at which point I was quite annoyed. I spent the money on my own hosting instead, and started to long for freedom again.

I returned from travels and brought myself a Dell Inspiron, nuked XP and installed Linux. I played with a few distros. It was absolutely awesome to see how far things came in those teo years I was without my penguins.

My girlfriend used the G3 for general web browsing and so on, until the screen hinge got too bad. Now we have little Toshiba to replace it. I wouldn't go back to using a Mac. The main reason is that it's simple too expensive - lots of OS upgrades, and they cost serious cash.

The best thing about the Macs is that they have opened lots of people's minds to the idea that there are viable alternatives to Windows, which I figure must be a good thing for all alternative OSes.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 11:58 AM   #12
undeaf
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Why wouldn't they want technically apt users? Without any, who would make all the apps?

If people don't give a damn about any of the details of a PC, why wouldn't they just get a windows box? And why would they be so vocal about what they perceive to be the key differences?


Another thing to add in response to the topic question, I like how stratificational macs are. I think linux should also be stratificational, I would like for the vast majority of technically apt people to use linux. Macs for rich people, linux for smart people, and windows for the unwashed masses
 
Old 12-15-2006, 12:03 PM   #13
samael26
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Not read all the posts above, but I must say that I am a Mac user
and have been for nearly 12 years. At first, Macs sucked but now
with OSX, I must say I am impressed and tend to use my iBook G4
almost as much as my linux desk and laptop.
The only problem I see in Macs are the fact that as in Windows, you
have to pay for everything...
 
Old 12-15-2006, 01:29 PM   #14
alred
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>> "Macs for rich people, linux for smart people, and windows for the unwashed masses ... "

mac have them all !!

"the rest stand one side" as the saying down here goes ...

.
 
Old 12-15-2006, 01:47 PM   #15
samael26
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Not wanting to get into any controversial and futile debate here, I just wanted to say that Macs are not just for the rich people (I didn't know I was so "rich", nice to hear it ;-) ), but they are also for the computer novices who don't give a damn about how a computer works but still want to get as instinctive as possible a way to run their machines.

But if you want to get into OSX a little, it sure is a *nix system on which you can do as many things as with linux, provided you take the time to delve into it, which Mac users don't care about, being rich and trendy fashionable little things... ;-))

I still love mine and runs linux on it, too, for fun.
 
  


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